Dynamic Range Day - March 16, 2012

[Electro]

It is dynamic range day on the 16th of this month worldwide , would you like to be involved ?

Here is a link for more info. http://turnmeup.org/

If you are fed up with recordings being too loud and compressed here is a chance to get your voice heard !

What is your opinion ?

 

[6th.replicant]

:clap:

 

[Anonymous]

Good post, i did the u2 spotify test, Bullet the blue sky from 'joshua tree' does sound better than 'city of blinding lights' which was recorded 20 years later, surely the newer recording should sound much better? nope, it does not, the 1987 recording has much more meat on it's bones.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Is the "Turn Me Up" logo really the best they could come up with? I think that's a little misleading, as dynamic range isn't really anything to do with volume, as the logo seems to make you think. I think they could've chosen something more suitable...

 

[6th.replicant]

Is the "Turn Me Up" logo really the best they could come up with?... I think they could've chosen something more suitable ...

Such as?

 

[oldric_naubhoff]

I think that's a little misleading, as dynamic range isn't really anything to do with volume,

oh Davy, a big miss again (how does he do it?). dynamic range has anything to do with volume. and "turm me up" logo is very well chosen.

didn't you hear about loudness war at all? didn't you know that the aim is to make tunes sound louder? didn't you know that a by-product of such techniques is severely limited dynamic range, which in turn makes music sound distorted?

those who fight against loudness war want the DR of the recording to be preserved. but that means the mean level of the song will be set at a level few dB lover than of compressed version. hence uncompressed version will sound quieter than compressed version at any given volume setting on your pre-amp. hence "turn me up" logo. turn the amp up, not the mastering.

shame on you Davy. to show such an obvious lack of understanding... I'm really disappointed on you.

 

[Electro]

I think this short clip from the Turn me up links explains it very well .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Gmex_4hreQ

 

[Overdose]

shame on you Davy. to show such an obvious lack of understanding... I'm really disappointed on you.

How patronising!

If a message conveyed is ambiguous, then it is poorly conveyed, therefore, if the logo is not clear in its meaning to all, then it fails in its objective.

In isolation, that logo would imply the turning up of something and dynamic range would not be top of the list of guesses. A campaign logo should need no explanation of its meaning.

 

[Anonymous]

...but that means the mean level of the song will be set at a level few dB lover than of compressed version. hence uncompressed version will sound quieter than compressed version at any given volume setting on your pre-amp.

So perhaps a more appropriate logo would be "turn it DOWN!" :doh:

 

[Lee H]

oh Davy, a big miss again (how does he do it?).

didn't you hear about loudness war at all? didn't you know that the aim is to make tunes sound louder? didn't you know that a by-product of such techniques is severely limited dynamic range, which in turn makes music sound distorted?

shame on you Davy. to show such an obvious lack of understanding... I'm really disappointed on you.

Hugely patronising. Shame on you for such an obvioulsy cheap shot.

 

[Frank Harvey]

oh Davy, a big miss again (how does he do it?). dynamic range has anything to do with volume. and "turm me up" logo is very well chosen.

I'm sorry, I couldn't hear you - I'd turned my music up.

 

[Frank Harvey]

didn't you know that the aim is to make tunes sound louder?

Making something "sound louder" isn't necessarily to do with turning something up. If you give music a better dynamic range and ability, it will naturally sound louder - you don't have to turn up a dynamic sounding system. Therefore, "Turn It Up" is, as far as I'm concerned, completely the wrong message.

(and yes, before you start, I do realise that music with a higher dynamic range are generally quieter recordings as far as continuous output is concerned)

those who fight against loudness war want the DR of the recording to be preserved. but that means the mean level of the song will be set at a level few dB lover than of compressed version. hence uncompressed version will sound quieter than compressed version at any given volume setting on your pre-amp. hence "turn me up" logo. turn the amp up, not the mastering.

shame on you Davy. to show such an obvious lack of understanding... I'm really disappointed on you.

I've read the whole thing, and understand completely. I just disagree that the logo is the right choice. I think it is you who has hugely misunderstood my point.

I'm not getting into an argument about it though, this is my final word - I'm busy, I have regular customers to help out, as well as others on forums who are here for help, rather than constantly trying to pick holes in what others are doing.

 

[chebby]

My nearest gathering on Dynamic Range Day is an hour's travel time from here.

According to the website, three people are attending. The notes urge attendees to bring amps that... "go up to 11" (So I can tell what their take on 'loudness' is.)

Helpfully, the address includes the road but not the number.

I'll pass.

 

[Anonymous]

The amp should also have a loudness button :roll:

 

[oldric_naubhoff]

Making something "sound louder" isn't necessarily to do with turning something up. If you give music a better dynamic range and ability, it will naturally sound louder - you don't have to turn up a dynamic sounding system. Therefore, "Turn It Up" is, as far as I'm concerned, completely the wrong message.

(and yes, before you start, I do realise that music with a higher dynamic range are generally quieter recordings as far as continuous output is concerned)

aren't those two highlighted sentences contradicting each other?

and "you don't have to turn up a dynamic sounding system" bit... have you ever listened to a good album with nice and wide DR on your system? you definitely noticed that you have to turn up the volume to bring that album up to realistic volume levels. if I also misunderstood this, please enlighten.

I've read the whole thing, and understand completely. I just disagree that the logo is the right choice. I think it is you who has hugely misunderstood my point.

yes, I misunderstood your point. please explain.

I'm not getting into an argument about it though, this is my final word - I'm busy, I have regular customers to help out, as well as others on forums who are here for help, rather than constantly trying to pick holes in what others are doing.

sorry to make you feel uncomfortable. again. but I don't like when "someone's wrong on the internet" 😉. and you, David, are wrong more often than others for some reason >).

 

[John Duncan]

Is this this week's handbags thread? Just asking so I can keep an eye on it...

In fact, if a thread is going to be a handbags thread, could you help me out by saying so in the title? Thanks.

 

[Frank Harvey]

I'm not getting into an argument about it though, this is my final word

I tell a lie...

Making something "sound louder" isn't necessarily to do with turning something up. If you give music a better dynamic range and ability, it will naturally sound louder - you don't have to turn up a dynamic sounding system. Therefore, "Turn It Up" is, as far as I'm concerned, completely the wrong message.

(and yes, before you start, I do realise that music with a higher dynamic range are generally quieter recordings as far as continuous output is concerned)

aren't those two highlighted sentences contradicting each other?

Nope.

I've read the whole thing, and understand completely. I just disagree that the logo is the right choice. I think it is you who has hugely misunderstood my point.

yes, I misunderstood your point. please explain.

Nope.

but I don't like when "someone's wrong on the internet" 😉. and you, David, are wrong more often than others for some reason >).

Get used to it, this is the internet. And you are certainly entitled to your opinion, even if it's wrong.

That was my last word.

 

[Lee H]

Is this this week's handbags thread? Just asking so I can keep an eye on it...

In fact, if a thread is going to be a handbags thread, could you help me out by saying so in the title? Thanks.

It would appear it is, although as far as I can tell, only one person seems to be swinging the bag

 

[Lee H]

sorry to make you feel uncomfortable. again. but I don't like when "someone's wrong on the internet" 😉. and you, David, are wrong more often than others for some reason >).

and you are ruder than most, for some reason. Can you take your cheap shots, point scoring and vague attempts at smugness elsewhere?

 

[Electro]

When I started this thread I did not imagine for one second that it would cause an argument :O

As far as the turnmeup logo is concerned it has always appeared to me to be a symbol of an amplifier volume control and it is saying give the control of the music volume to the end user not the mastering engineer , it may not be the best or most informative symbol but it is not worth arguing about . :shame:

I just thought the good people of the forum would be pleased that at long last something is being done about the sound quality of over compressed recordings and we could all join in and support it 🙂

 

[Lee H]

I just thought the good people of the forum would be pleased that at long last something is being done about the sound quality of over compressed recordings and we could all join in and support it 🙂

I think the major blocker here is portable audio and FM radio. Most listeners in the car don't want dynamic range, just consistent volume. The trend (sadly) is for a lower dynamic range and those that want the "old" range back are in a decreasing minority.

The price of portability is a compromise in quality.

 

[The_Lhc]

I just thought the good people of the forum would be pleased that at long last something is being done about the sound quality of over compressed recordings and we could all join in and support it 🙂

I think the major blocker here is portable audio and FM radio. Most listeners in the car don't want dynamic range, just consistent volume.

That's true enough but generally speaking Radio stations apply their own dynamic compression anyway, for exactly that reason, so it shouldn't be necessary for it to be done twice.

 

[WinterRacer]

Didn't the loudness wars start as record labels found that 'louder' CDs sold better than quiter ones? From what I've read, Oasis started the mass trend for this when their very loud debut sold in bucket loads.

As others have said, radio stations apply their own compression, so I don't think making recordings louder has anything to do with giving consumers what they want, it's just about sales.

 

[Lee H]

From what I've read, Oasis started the mass trend for this when their very loud debut sold in bucket loads.

Not strictly true; it was their second album. Although, it had been going on long before that. Back in the vinyl jukebox days, making a record "hotter" than the others made it stand out, therefore selling more.

Oddly, it was the extremely loud Guns 'n' Roses (or the shadow version of latter days) that went the other way with Chinese Democracy and released a low compression version.

 

[WinterRacer]

Too true, my bad for getting Oasis' debut and follow up confused! 😳

My point (which I think is important) is that making recordings louder is not for consumers, it's to boost sales. Some recent albums I've bought sound awful with obvious distortion, e.g., Lisa Hannigan's 2nd album. It's a shame as her first album was an excellent recording.

As an aside, it's not something I hear with electronica albums I buy, they generally seem to have a better sound quality with more dynamic range.