Dilemma - upgrade my 20yr old Arcam separates or buy new speakers to unleash their potential?

[druidneu]

Hi folks

I'm a first time poster with a dilemma.

I have an 18yr old hi-fi separates system consisting of an Arcam Alpha 8R integrated amp and Alpha 8Ppower amp. These are wired in a bi-amp configuration to power a pair of Mission 750LE stand mount speakers. Input source to the amp is an Arcam 7SE CD player - that's it.

I have suspected since I bought the above components back in 1998 that there was something lacking in system, although being a hi-fi layperson I'm struggling to put my finger on it. I put it down to the speakers not being of comparative quality to the rest of the system components but have no real experience or a bench mark to back up my hunch.However I have finally decided that I want to improve the overall sound and bring some more detail and low frequency oommph to my listening experience.

One question I have asked myself is:how do my Arcam 8R and 8Pcompare with contemporary amp & power amp set-ups? If they were available on the market today, what sort of price bracket would they fall into? The reason I ask is that I have no idea what sort of budget I need for replacement speakers that would improve the sound but I also do not want to over spend on quality speakers if their potential will not be realised by my 'ancient' amp set-up.

I have considered the Q Acoustics 3050 floorstanders (yes I know they are BIG but I have the room for them and I understand that they are truly excellent speakers for the £500 asking price). Would my amps do them justice? Am I better off going for alternative speakers or even upgrading the whole system entirely?

Finally, I intend to re-jig my living room furniture which would necessitate moving the position of my amps and cd player some distance away from the speakers. I need to run the speaker cable length approximately 7 or 8 metres around the skirting board of the room ideally hidden in some trunking. Obviously short as possible cable runs are preferable but will an 8m run be overly detrimental to system performance? Any recommendations for 4-way speaker cable given that they will need to be secreted away inside some trunking?

Thanks for taking the time to read this - any advice will be gratefully received.

 

[matt49]

From where I'm standing, it's the speakers that seem to be letting your system down.

Your best bet is to borrow some speakers to try out at home. Find a local dealer who's willing to do this. You may have to make a refundable payment.

Alternatively you could chance your arm on the second-hand market. There are some real bargains out there, though much will depend on how confident you are about finding them.

Good luck!

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

If your budget is limited,then I reckon a nice pair of s/h speakers around the £500 mark could breath new life into that nice ageing arcam hardware . don't get to hung up on floor standing speakers though.I've been there and in this kind of price range they just loose out in detail and clarity compared to £ equal stand mounts.the missions will be well bettered by some b&w cm series,pmc db1 or 1i if you can go the extra £or two.if you have to have floor standers monitor audio silver rx6.b&w 683 . I'm sure others will help with some others,these speakers are all discontinued but are your best bang for your buck second hand and should be achievable for around £500.I wouldn't dream of putting £500 into a new speaker these days,when I could get a perfectly good s/h pair of £750-£1000 for £500.good luck on the search.

 

[jonathanRD]

There is no doubt that going s/hand will maximise your budget, and there are some very good deals on discontinued ranges at the moment. But s/hand is not for everyone and if you have been out of the market for a long time you will have no reference points - so any purchases will carry some risk.

3 years ago I was in a similar position and had no idea what modern floorstanders would sound like in my new room with my 12yr old amp.

Like Matt suggested I headed to my local dealer with a set budget, and listened to a few speakers. You may be able to take your arcam kit with you for a demo, but the best option is to get on home demo any speakers you like the sound of. Then review the situation. I had a much clearer idea after I had home demoed two sets of speakers.

 

[rjbell]

100% speakers.

These caught my eye this week incredible value and should definitiy be on your short list.

PSB Imagine B Speakers £900 down to £350

http://www.sevenoakssoundandvision.co.uk/p-10734-psb-imagine-b-bgl.aspx

You have £150 spare might be worth experimenting with a dac.

 

[druidneu]

From where I'm standing, it's the speakers that seem to be letting your system down.

Your best bet is to borrow some speakers to try out at home. Find a local dealer who's willing to do this. You may have to make a refundable payment.

Alternatively you could chance your arm on the second-hand market. There are some real bargains out there, though much will depend on how confident you are about finding them.

Good luck!

Thanks Matt

Great advice. Any tips on good reputable used hi-fi shops or online retailers? I'm a bit concerned of buying used privately as I'm low on experience and don't want to buy a pair of dogs! Thanks.

 

[rjbell]

If you buy from ebay and pay by paypal you are protected.

 

[druidneu]

I've been there and in this kind of price range they just loose out in detail and clarity compared to £ equal stand mounts.the missions will be well bettered by some b&w cm series,pmc db1 or 1i if you can go the extra £or two.if you have to have floor standers monitor audio silver rx6.b&w 683 . I'm sure others will help with some others,these speakers are all discontinued but are your best bang for your buck second hand and should be achievable for around £500.I wouldn't dream of putting £500 into a new speaker these days,when I could get a perfectly good s/h pair of £750-£1000 for £500.good luck on the search.

Thanks Mark

I'm interested in the PMC DB1i but they seem very thin on the ground and I have not been able to find a used pair anywhere within reasonable distance from home and I really don't like the idea of buying used without checking them ou first. I've heard good things about the KEF LS50 but I'm worried that inadequacies in my amp system will not do them justice. What are you thoughts on the KEFs?

 

[matt49]

From where I'm standing, it's the speakers that seem to be letting your system down.

Your best bet is to borrow some speakers to try out at home. Find a local dealer who's willing to do this. You may have to make a refundable payment.

Alternatively you could chance your arm on the second-hand market. There are some real bargains out there, though much will depend on how confident you are about finding them.

Good luck!

Thanks Matt

Great advice. Any tips on good reputable used hi-fi shops or online retailers? I'm a bit concerned of buying used privately as I'm low on experience and don't want to buy a pair of dogs! Thanks.

Where are you?

 

[druidneu]

From where I'm standing, it's the speakers that seem to be letting your system down.

Your best bet is to borrow some speakers to try out at home. Find a local dealer who's willing to do this. You may have to make a refundable payment.

Alternatively you could chance your arm on the second-hand market. There are some real bargains out there, though much will depend on how confident you are about finding them.

Good luck!

Thanks Matt

Great advice. Any tips on good reputable used hi-fi shops or online retailers? I'm a bit concerned of buying used privately as I'm low on experience and don't want to buy a pair of dogs! Thanks.

Where are you?

I'm in Leamington Spa, Warwickshire but I don't mind travelling 50 miles or so.

 

[Frank Harvey]

I used to find KEF and Ruark speakers went very well with the Arcam Alpha stuff. If you want to stick with standmounts, try the Ruark Sceptre (available around the time of the Alpha stuff at around £600rrp. KEF's RDM range should work well too. I would guess that some of the older Sonus Faber speakers would go quite well with them as well, but I haven't heard the combo so I can't vouch for it first hand.

My main advice would be to stick with speakers that are an easy load, and stay away from those that are predominantly 4ohms and low sensitivities.

 

[BigH]

If you buy from ebay and pay by paypal you are protected.

Protected from what? Good luck.

 

[BigH]

Whereabouts do you live? There are a few used hifi dealers about. Modern speakers do a bit different, so best to audition before buying. Cable runs of 8m should not be a problem as long as cable thick enough.

 

[rjbell]

If they are faulty. You just open a paypal dispute and you will get your money back.

 

[druidneu]

There is no doubt that going s/hand will maximise your budget, and there are some very good deals on discontinued ranges at the moment. But s/hand is not for everyone and if you have been out of the market for a long time you will have no reference points - so any purchases will carry some risk.

3 years ago I was in a similar position and had no idea what modern floorstanders would sound like in my new room with my 12yr old amp.

Like Matt suggested I headed to my local dealer with a set budget, and listened to a few speakers. You may be able to take your arcam kit with you for a demo, but the best option is to get on home demo any speakers you like the sound of. Then review the situation. I had a much clearer idea after I had home demoed two sets of speakers.

Thanks Jonathan. That's sound advice. Just wish there were a few more retailers in my area. A lot of shops have disappeared - the recent recession and advent of download/streaming of music I guess

 

[druidneu]

If they are faulty. You just open a paypal dispute and you will get your money back.

True. But hasslesome when the dispute gets strung out over 3 weeks or so before resolution is reached. However the potential savings are worth the small risk I guess.

 

[druidneu]

100% speakers.

These caught my eye this week incredible value and should definitiy be on your short list.

PSB Imagine B Speakers £900 down to £350

http://www.sevenoakssoundandvision.co.uk/p-10734-psb-imagine-b-bgl.aspx

You have £150 spare might be worth experimenting with a dac.

Thanks buddy. I'll bear them in mind. Not much info on them though as I could not find a review on line.

 

[matt49]

From where I'm standing, it's the speakers that seem to be letting your system down.

Your best bet is to borrow some speakers to try out at home. Find a local dealer who's willing to do this. You may have to make a refundable payment.

Alternatively you could chance your arm on the second-hand market. There are some real bargains out there, though much will depend on how confident you are about finding them.

Good luck!

Thanks Matt

Great advice. Any tips on good reputable used hi-fi shops or online retailers? I'm a bit concerned of buying used privately as I'm low on experience and don't want to buy a pair of dogs! Thanks.

Where are you?

I'm in Leamington Spa, Warwickshire but I don't mind travelling 50 miles or so.

Well, there's Audio Affair in Brum and Frank Harvey in lovely Coventry. MusicMatters have a store in your very parish. A bit further afield, there's Audio-T in Cheltenham, and if you go there you should drop in at Boggit/Colin's place now trading as iQ Speakers.

 

[bigfish786]

On your own Mission speakers. Before replacing them, do some experimenting with them. This will cost you nothing, and nay give you some surprising results.

Try optimising their position in your room. This can take some time, and it's always good to have a second pair of ears, but set yourself a few hours aside to move them around..

Just doing this may give you the sound you are looking for. If not, you haven't lost anything, but it may open your eyes to what speakers can do when positioned optimally.

 

[rjbell]

No but there baby brothers the mini's have.

 

[BigH]

If they are faulty. You just open a paypal dispute and you will get your money back.

Not always because if the sellers disputes it then often Paypall will do nothing, same if its the other way round. I have read about lots of cases where people have been left with problems.

 

[BigH]

Where is edit?

Here this is what Paypal say: "You can file disputes for Items Not Received (INR), or for items that are Significantly Not as Described (SNAD). However, recovery of any amounts is not guaranteed and is limited to the amounts that PayPal can recover from the seller’s account, even if PayPal makes a final decision in your favor."

 

[rjbell]

I've run a ebay shop for 10 yrs believe me payal/ebay never side on the seller. I've had examples of people leaving feedback thanking me for the item then opening a dispute saying they've not received anything and paypal siding with them. However there are plenty of hifi traders on ebay if your feeling a bit worried. They have to offer you 14 days return policy. As it happens there are a very nice pair of Epos m5 on there for £99 with free shipping from a ebay shop. I had a watch on it. It looks like it ended without a sale. Love these speakers my dad has them.

Are you allowed to put in links?

 

[Thompsonuxb]

Read up a little on the speakers - common theme is they are bass light but excel in the midrange and with clarity.

So for your needs the speaker positioning play or change looks like the right move or add a sub.

S/H looks the way to go a pair of Mission 753(floorstander) or maybe pmc standmounts or their smaller floorstanders.

But from the user reviews looks like you have it almost as good as it'll get minus the bass.

The speakers look like the mission 780's - try turning them upside down.