Dali

[davedotco]

The way they quote specs 2.83V at 1m with 8 Ohm load produced 1W of power. With 4 Ohm load produces 2W.

If your speakers were 8 Ohm sensitivity would be 88dB since they are 4 it really is 85dB (if you think about 1W). That means you will need more power than you though.

What's your distance to speakers at listening position?

4 meters from my sofa so is that 4watts then lol

No, but at 4 meters loss of volume will be about 12dB.

Sensitivity is measured at 1 meter. Worth bearing in mind when deciding on amplification.

With 40Wpc (into 4 Ohm) at your listening distance and with your speakers sensitivity you will get max 89dB.

Unless the room is absolutely huge, the loss of spl beyond about 1 metre is negligable, reflections, 'room gain' and all that.

Class A is expensive, particularly so if you go for establised, well known makes. Given the speakers that you have this is not a route I would favour.

I do however have a couple of 'wacky' ideas. Firstly, look at the Icon Audio Stereo 60 (KT120/150s), loads of power for about 3k all up. I know you said you were not considering valves but given the excellent backup from Icon Audio, you might want to think again.

Secondly, would be one of the smaller Devialet models, the 120 or 200. Not class a obviously but an interesting topology with a fully class a pre-amp. Has always impressed me as one of the more 'natural' sounding amps in its class, has some qualities that are reminiscent of class a designs but with loads of power. Not everyone 'gets' Devialet, you would have to try it and see.

 

[Vladimir]

Interesting video so going by that video to probably drive my speakers I would need at least 800watts if this is the case then I could buy a power amplifier that will give me this so the music is more dynamic as that’s what the video is saying .

going back to the Dali rubicon 8s I would take it this would control the bass better with a better amplifier that has more grunt

That's why Yamaha made combination topology amps where first 30 watts were class A and when you turned things up loud it switched to 120W class B. It probably chunks out hundreds of watts in dynamic peaks easy.

Yamaha CA-2010

2x 120W (Class B, 8 Ohm, 20Hz...20Khz, 0,03% THD)

2x 130W (Class B, 8 Ohm, 1Khz, 0,03% THD)

2x 140W (Class B, 4 Ohm, 20Hz...20Khz, 0,03% THD)

2x 180W (Class B, 4 Ohm, 1Khz, 0,03% THD)

2x 30W (Class A, 8 Ohm, 20Hz...20Khz, 0,03% THD)

The best part is that you can switch between normal and class A mode, which mean's you don't have to burn the amp and your electric bill when you listen to music casually while multitasking.

 

[gasolin]

like the emotiva mono block i linked to 60 watt in class a and than without doing anything (from the user perspective)it just goes into a/b if theres any need for more power

https://emotiva.com/product/xpa-1-gen-2-2/

 

[Vladimir]

like the emotiva mono block i linked to 60 watt in class a and than without doing anything (from the user perspective)it just goes into a/b if theres any need for more power

https://emotiva.com/product/xpa-1-gen-2-2/

Wow the price is amazingly low. Kudos to Emotiva, the champions of high value and performance.

However, the Yammie is a babe. Wins me over with its looks.

 

[emperor's new clothes]

Hi BS,

A final thought on your upgrade mission and a purely practical one.

I guess you use Main In function from your AV amp to use it as a power amp for the front channels. Of the pages of exotic amps suggested on this thread, how many support this feature? Your Yamahas have synergy - even if another amp has a power amp direct in feature -many do not- you can still run into all kinds of issues balancing the levels for AV. Just a thought as I recall your problems trying to Bi-amp using your PM8005 + 2 channel AV amp.

 

[gasolin]

like the emotiva mono block i linked to 60 watt in class a and than without doing anything (from the user perspective)it just goes into a/b if theres any need for more power

https://emotiva.com/product/xpa-1-gen-2-2/

Wow the price is amazingly low. Kudos to Emotiva, the champions of high value and performance.

However, the Yammie is a babe. Wins me over with its looks.

Emotiva wins me over because of the high power it has (dynamic headroom for a big room) and class a for background music

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwJWWqLr2Yg

 

[Vladimir]

But it doesn't make me wanna touch it.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

After this morning events with my protection mode problem I’ve decided to keep my Yamaha as this has made me realise I’ve already ready got a very good amplifier but thanks for everyone’s input .

i think if Its my dream to own the epicon 6s I’ve got to save up for them as I did started this thread about speakers but it turned into amplifiers because yes if I want more detail then that would be the way to go but I brought my Yamaha amplifier to last me some years that was the intention when I brought the Yamaha .

 

[insider9]

Look at Fanthorpes website and check out what Dali they've taken in part ex recently. Might be something that interests you also might haggle.

Here's a link
https://www.fanthorpes.co.uk/second-hand/dali-euphonia-ms4-floorstanding-speakers/

 

[insider9]

Look at Fanthorpes website and check out what Dali they've taken in part ex recently. Might be something that interests you also might haggle.

Here's a link
https://www.fanthorpes.co.uk/second-hand/dali-euphonia-ms4-floorstanding...

 

[radiorog]

is class A definitely the answer here? Im just curious as it seems like a sudden quick conclusion after the demo of one amp. Could it not just be that the luxman you heard was very good, and and there would be other very good options in other classes? Would an electrocompniet amp at £7000 not sound just as good?

 

[Blacksabbath25]

For now I have changed my mind and keeping what I’ve got as the Yamaha is petty good but wanted to upgrade my speakers at the beginning of this thread to the rubicon 8s but found that the rubicon 5s And rubicon 6s came across a bit rich on bass but that was using a Cambridge class A/B amplifier £1600 and that was using the rubicon 5s And then the luxman class A/B £3500 amplifier using the rubicon 6s .

now the rubicon 6s sounded better with the luxman amplifier not so rich with bass but then the Cambridge amplifier did with the rubicon 5s but Vladimir said the Cambridge was more powerful then my Yamaha so it started to get confusing which was the best route to take. .

then I listened to the sugden 21se with rubicon 6s and then opticon 6s to see what difference I could hear between the 2 speakers I felt the rubicon’s where better on the top end but the opticon 6s sounded more mellow easy listening but still feel I should give the rubicon ‘s a go again but take my amplifier with me this time and then I will no for sure .

 

[Vladimir]

Every amp has its appeal for someone out there. Even NAD 3020D has its charms and fans. The CA 851A doesn't come close to Yamaha's build quality, looks and pedigry.

Under the Yamaha User Manual Troubleshooting section there's instructions how to oil the wood side panels. I like that.

 

[Electro]

BS,

If you are toying with the idea of spending £5000 to £7000 on an amp then you are in Electrocompaniet territory in fact you could have the EC 4.8 preamp and a pair of AW180 monoblocks for £6800 !

You are welcome to listen to mine and you can also bring your speakers if you like , I am in Essex 15 mins from junction 30 of the M25.

I know I often bang on about how good Electro amps are but the combo of the EC4.8 Pre and AW180 monoblocks is truly world class and they are often compared to other equipment many times their price and considered to be better or at least the equal.

Here is a review of the Electro AW 180's , one of the speakers he uses is the Dali Helicon 400 mk2.

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/superioraudio/equipment/1210/electrocompaniet_aw180.htm

and a review of the EC4.8 preamp .

https://www.dagogo.com/electrocompaniet-ec-4-8-preamplifier-review/

As I say I am willing to confirm what they say in the reviews and I am sure it will open your eyes to another option .

Edit,

I made a bit of a **** up on the latest pricing of the Electrocompaniet EC4.8 and a PAIR of AW180 monoblocks, the correct prices are £3215 for the preamp and £3435 for the monoblocks EACH , so a total of £10,085. Sorry for any confusion .

 

[Blacksabbath25]

And every amplifier seems to give it’s own style of sound and detail regardless of price

 

[Electro]

is class A definitely the answer here? Im just curious as it seems like a sudden quick conclusion after the demo of one amp. Could it not just be that the luxman you heard was very good, and and there would be other very good options in other classes? Would an electrocompniet amp at £7000 not sound just as good?

Err, I made a bit of a **** up with the new prices of the Electrocompaniet EC 4.8 and the AW180 Monoblocks. *blush*

The current UK price of a PAIR of AW180 monoblocks and the EC4.8 preamp is £10,085.

I bought mine ex demo for less . *smile*

It's probably wise that you've decided to stick with the Yammie . *good*

 

[Blacksabbath25]

Wow that’s expensive

 

[Vladimir]

Look at this Yamaha B-2. That was manufactured in 1976, it looks like its 40 years younger offsprings in every aspect. They made this Yamaha A-2000A in 1987. All japanese top shelf parts, even custom ones, all made in Japan.

And I can oil the wood panels. I'll take that over a brutish Krell.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

If you look at the Yamaha A-S2100 spec it’s well engineered from the way they lay out the speaker terminals at the back which is set A one side then set B the other side not like some amplifiers where they put both A and B speaker terminals all together which can cause interference .

a separate headphone stage , a separate TT stage , custom power supply , heat sinks other side big electronics inside and thought about where to keep things separate in side for the cleanest signal and quality construction .

now there are not meany amplifiers out there at £1700 but remember when the Yamaha A-S2100 first came out you would be looking at spending around £4000 so it’s a bargain at today’s prices with this level of build quality unless your looking at luxman ,Accuphase which to compete or get a better amplifier then your looking at spending £7000 or more as a upgrade and that’s if price comes into it really as you can spend a lot less when you know what your looking for .

this is why I started to get cold feet because I’ve never spent £7000 or more on a amplifier before and who’s to say it’s going to be any better

 

[Electro]

Wow that’s expensive

They are more expensive now, I think the retail when I bought mine was about £8500 but I got them ex demo for £5800.

To be honest if I was still in the market for this level of amp now the Electro's would still be on my list even at the increased price, there is nothing I have heard that can do what they do with music dynamics and detail, you can listen at insane volumes and not realize how loud the music is, all the fine detail remains laid out even when the music is at full tilt, it envelops you just like live music.

They have been compared to many other exotic amplfiers from the likes of MBL, Lamm Audio, Pass Labs, Bryston etc at many times the price and they come out better or at least the equal .

I have to say that the EC4.8 preamp is the biggest star, it may be a no frills preamp but the sound quality is up there with the best in the world imo, and others.

I have used my EC4.8 pre with my old AW120 DMB stereo power amp ( still in the loft ) and it is quite close to the far more expensive AW180 mono's apart from that last bit of headroom and effortless detail. *smile*

 

[Vladimir]

It's logical if you have big Epicon's to have big Electro's to unleash their full potential. Everything fits nicely.

 

[insider9]

Wow that’s expensive 

They are more expensive now, I think the retail when I bought mine was about £8500 but I got them ex demo for £5800.

To be honest if I was still in the market for this level of amp now the Electro's would still be on my list even at the increased price, there is nothing I have heard that can do what they do with music dynamics and detail, you can listen at insane volumes and not realize how loud the music is, all the fine detail remains laid out even when the music is at full tilt, it envelops you just like live music.

They have been compared to many other exotic amplfiers from the likes of MBL, Lamm Audio, Pass Labs, Bryston etc at many times the price and they come out better or at least the equal .

I have to say that the EC4.8 preamp is the biggest star, it may be a no frills preamp but the sound quality is up there with the best in the world imo, and others.

I have used my EC4.8 pre with my old AW120 DMB stereo power amp ( still in the loft ) and it is quite close to the far more expensive AW180 mono's apart from that last bit of headroom and effortless detail. *smile*

 

Stop this at once

I don't need another amp right now. Every time I read about them I crave an Electrocompaniet. They're either this good or the way you describes them is

 

[Oie]

Vitus?

Class A

http://www.hifi-forsale.co.uk/mobile/moreinfo.php?pid=53068

Review:

http://www.hifibroker.com/index.php/amplifiers/integrated-amplifiers-combo/vitus-ri-100-detail

Review:

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/vitus-audio-ri-100-integrated-amplifier/

I am being following the ri100 and there are sometimes very good examples for as little as £5000

Regards,

O

 

[Electro]

Wow that’s expensive

They are more expensive now, I think the retail when I bought mine was about £8500 but I got them ex demo for £5800.

To be honest if I was still in the market for this level of amp now the Electro's would still be on my list even at the increased price, there is nothing I have heard that can do what they do with music dynamics and detail, you can listen at insane volumes and not realize how loud the music is, all the fine detail remains laid out even when the music is at full tilt, it envelops you just like live music.

They have been compared to many other exotic amplfiers from the likes of MBL, Lamm Audio, Pass Labs, Bryston etc at many times the price and they come out better or at least the equal .

I have to say that the EC4.8 preamp is the biggest star, it may be a no frills preamp but the sound quality is up there with the best in the world imo, and others.

I have used my EC4.8 pre with my old AW120 DMB stereo power amp ( still in the loft ) and it is quite close to the far more expensive AW180 mono's apart from that last bit of headroom and effortless detail. *smile*

Stop this at once

I don't need another amp right now. Every time I read about them I crave an Electrocompaniet. They're either this good or the way you describes them is

Probably a bit of both but they really are that good. *yes3*

They just do something that very few amps can do and it's very hard to describe in words.

Others I have heard that have this trait are Dartzeel , Pass labs and Spectral amplfiers .

http://www.dartzeel.com/our-instruments/?lang=en

http://www.spectralaudio.com/

 

[gasolin]

You might like this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1zEMoUKzrQ