Cable did need a burn in! WOW!

[jase fox]

aliEnRIK:chebby:
Seriously, what does it matter?

Ive had 'far' too many people telling me im dillusional to just drop it. Once the truth finally comes out i'll be the very first in line to tell them so............

Well i'm standing shoulder to shoulder with you Rik .

 

[chebby]

So you guys prefer to purchase cables that take a long time to burn-in and when they are 'ready' you lose interest and sell them on to enjoy the burning-in of another new set?

Would it not be better just to save money and enjoy the music with some decent cables that work properly?

 

[Peter Larsen]

Red Dwarf:Peter Larsen:
I bought 0,5 meters of Chord Chameleon Silver to connect my DacMagic to my Cambridge 740A.

I had read that the cable neeeded burn in (because the silver sounds harsh just out of the box).

I was sceptic!

I had also read that alot of people who don't believe that cables make a difference, have stated that your ears get used to the harsh sound and therefore you fool yourself into believeing that the cable has been burned in after a while.

So I plugged the cables in. Listened for half an hour. Was shocked at the harsheness the cable produced. Guitars almost hurt my ears, and the soundstage was strangely light and fluffy. Not good!

So, I decided not to listen to the cable anymore for 4 days. To rule out that my ears would get used to the awful sound.

I turned off the amp, and set Metallica's Death Magnetic to loop for 4 days which ought to be sufficient for the burn in.

Needles to say, I was pretty excited when I turned on the amp again to listen if anything had changed.

It did! Away was the harsheness, the soundstage was wide and open, and the increase in details was significant compared to my old Tara Labs cables.

So if you ask me, burn in is not cable voodoo. It worked for my Chameleon, and I would guess, also for other cables.

Tha' tha' thats all folks...

It's your hearing that's adapting to the sound. Sorry if that's a disappointment.

I'm sorry didn't you read my entire post? I specifically state that I listened for 30 minutes when I just bought the cable, and then I let my cd player loop the same cd for 4 days continuesly without listening to it (amp off). Then after 4 days I listened and the harshsness was completely gone. How could my ears have adjusted to that, when I only listened to the new cable for 30 horrendous minutes, and then didn't listen until after 4 days of burn in?

 

[jase fox]

chebby:
So you guys prefer to purchase cables that take a long time to burn-in and when they are 'ready' you lose interest and sell them on to enjoy the burning-in of another new set?

Would it not be better just to save money and enjoy the music with some decent cables that work properly?

Hey Chebby,

As long as its keeping me entertained what harm is it doing? Just like it isnt doing Nasa any harm in thinking there's life on mars?? At least mains cables etc dont cost as much as sending a rover to the red planet! I look at it this way, if i personally can tell differences in cables as they slowly get burnt in then that makes me happy in believing there bringing more to the table in time, if it's just a myth to some then so be it, or it could just be me "thinking" there's a difference? But to me there has been noticable differences i hear over time.

 

[SteveR750]

chebby:
So you guys prefer to purchase cables that take a long time to burn-in and when they are 'ready' you lose interest and sell them on to enjoy the burning-in of another new set?

Would it not be better just to save money and enjoy the music with some decent cables that work properly?

I think that fundamentally that everyone is saying the same thing - if you can hear it then it is real - this is more important than trying to convince someone else that they should be able to hear something.

 

[matthewpiano]

chebby:
Seriously, what does it matter?

All that matters is the long-term sound quality.

Car magazines and testers don't tie themselves up in knots over a car's performance during the running in period.

Music critics don't write essays on the relative merits of different Orchestra's warm-up sessions.

No decent hifi reviewer will judge a product stone cold from the box.

Why are you all so wrapped up in this short period when a cable is 'sub-optimal'? (A tiny, tiny percentage of the product's lifetime.)

Why are there even entrenched 'camps' on this issue? It has to be one of the most laughably insignificant debates in the world of hifi because it does not matter to anyone who is right or who is wrong.

After a suitable period the matter is moot unless someone is daft enough to keep buying new cables especially to enjoy hearing them transform. Certifiable behaviour. Like someone who buys a brand new car every month because he enjoys the running in process rather than the full potential of the car!

Excellent post Chebby. I completely agree with everything you say here.

 

[Anonymous]

aliEnRIK:
all im waiting for is the proof to all the 'flat earth' clan

It's those that believe in the burn in rubbish that are the flat earthers.

 

[aliEnRIK]

chebby:
So you guys prefer to purchase cables that take a long time to burn-in and when they are 'ready' you lose interest and sell them on to enjoy the burning-in of another new set?

Would it not be better just to save money and enjoy the music with some decent cables that work properly?

Err. No

Ive got a system im very happy with and attempting to see as an experiment how much I can 'squeeze' out of the system without upgrading (And I cant see me upgrading the actual equipment bar a new bluray player for a LONG time)

So with regards to speaker cables ~ Im spending no more as I would have to spend an unbelievable amount to get anything more out of them. With regards to interconnects ~ I have some of the finest interconnects money can buy under 500 quid. So again im spending no more (Except I need a few coaxes for my power amp ~ but thats just to get all the same cable)

Mains ~ I didnt believe they made any difference at all so was shocked when I found they have. So through trials ive personally found braided cables benefit my system more than standard armoured ones, and the more braids the better. Again ~ ive no real desire to buy anymore except im thinking about a longer one for my av amp as its too short to be able to pull the unit out and I might buy another solid silver one for my tv.

I also have the Isotek Sigmas mains conditioner which ill probably keep all my life with no need to upgrade

With regards to your original comment ~ thats absolutely stupid. Why the hell would I just buy something to 'burn it in' then throw it away and start again? Im actually very suprised at that comment Chebby................

 

[aliEnRIK]

Red Dwarf:aliEnRIK:
all im waiting for is the proof to all the 'flat earth' clan

It's those that believe in the burn in rubbish that are the flat earthers.

Rest assured ~ when the truth comes out for absolute certain youll be one of the 1st ill show it to

My personal opinion is that the equipment doesnt yet exist to measure what I believe the difference is. But id assume something will come along sooner or later.

Jitters already measured in digital cables, RFI reduction in mains cables etc. I'll just sit back and wait.........

 

[chebby]

aliEnRIK:
Jitters already measured in digital cables....

Measured, analyzed for it's impact on viewers/listeners and discussed in BBC research papers in the early 1960s. (Regarding PCM digital transmission of signals along leased phone lines.)

No doubt researched and discussed long before the early 1960s by RCA, Bell etc.

None this is something you 'discovered' (or even waited for the the disovery thereof) and nothing whatsoever that was ever in any doubt when considering the possible audible effects.

There is nothing in this whole subject regarding cables or burn-in or jitter or directionality or anything else for you to justify a personal, "Aha. see? I told you all." type moment.

You have not made any 'discoveries' that were not being discussed with great 'vigour' in hundreds of issues of hifi magazines in the late 1970s and most of the 1980s.

There will be a couple of coachloads of far more qualified and published individuals queueing up to have their, "I told you so" moments on such topics long before you get there. Sorry to say this but most of these 'bandwagons' were rolling a long time before your conversion to their respective causes.

 

[Anonymous]

aliEnRIK:
My personal opinion is that the equipment doesnt yet exist to measure what I believe the difference is.

One day there might be a helmet you can wear that measures it.

 

[aliEnRIK]

Red Dwarf:aliEnRIK:
My personal opinion is that the equipment doesnt yet exist to measure what I believe the difference is.

One day there might be a helmet you can wear that measures it.

Theres a helmet we're developing at work that can read thought processes so yeah ~ maybe

 

[aliEnRIK]

chebby:aliEnRIK:
Jitters already measured in digital cables....

Measured, analyzed for it's impact on viewers/listeners and discussed in BBC research papers in the early 1960s. (Regarding PCM digital transmission of signals along leased phone lines.)

No doubt researched and discussed long before the early 1960s by RCA, Bell etc.

None this is something you 'discovered' (or even waited for the the disovery thereof) and nothing whatsoever that was ever in any doubt when considering the possible audible effects.

There is nothing in this whole subject regarding cables or burn-in or jitter or directionality or anything else for you to justify a personal, "Aha. see? I told you all." type moment.

You have not made any 'discoveries' that were not being discussed with great 'vigour' in hundreds of issues of hifi magazines in the late 1970s and most of the 1980s.

There will be a couple of coachloads of far more qualified and published individuals queueing up to have their, "I told you so" moments on such topics long before you get there. Sorry to say this but most of these 'bandwagons' were rolling a long time before your conversion to their respective causes.

Im not disputing any of this. I said im waiting for irrifutable evidence

You seem to have skipped past the whole point of me buying cables though? WHAT was your point again?

 

[Anonymous]

I noticed the same thing, I bought a QED interconnect and it was too bright, I took it back to my dealer who gave me the same cable but run in, took it home and it was like a different Hi Fi!

 

[Alec]

aliEnRIK:chebby:aliEnRIK:

Jitters already measured in digital cables....

Measured, analyzed for it's impact on viewers/listeners and discussed in BBC research papers in the early 1960s. (Regarding PCM digital transmission of signals along leased phone lines.)

No doubt researched and discussed long before the early 1960s by RCA, Bell etc.

None this is something you 'discovered' (or even waited for the the disovery thereof) and nothing whatsoever that was ever in any doubt when considering the possible audible effects.

There is nothing in this whole subject regarding cables or burn-in or jitter or directionality or anything else for you to justify a personal, "Aha. see? I told you all." type moment.

You have not made any 'discoveries' that were not being discussed with great 'vigour' in hundreds of issues of hifi magazines in the late 1970s and most of the 1980s.

There will be a couple of coachloads of far more qualified and published individuals queueing up to have their, "I told you so" moments on such topics long before you get there. Sorry to say this but most of these 'bandwagons' were rolling a long time before your conversion to their respective causes.

Im not disputing any of this. I said im waiting for irrifutable evidence

You seem to have skipped past the whole point of me buying cables though? WHAT was your point again?

His point is that theres no point obsessing over burn-in. Thats what the thread is all about, you know.

You then went on to say how you like finding the best cables for your system. This is different.

 

[aliEnRIK]

al7478:aliEnRIK:chebby:aliEnRIK:

Jitters already measured in digital cables....

Measured, analyzed for it's impact on viewers/listeners and discussed in BBC research papers in the early 1960s. (Regarding PCM digital transmission of signals along leased phone lines.)

No doubt researched and discussed long before the early 1960s by RCA, Bell etc.

None this is something you 'discovered' (or even waited for the the disovery thereof) and nothing whatsoever that was ever in any doubt when considering the possible audible effects.

There is nothing in this whole subject regarding cables or burn-in or jitter or directionality or anything else for you to justify a personal, "Aha. see? I told you all." type moment.

You have not made any 'discoveries' that were not being discussed with great 'vigour' in hundreds of issues of hifi magazines in the late 1970s and most of the 1980s.

There will be a couple of coachloads of far more qualified and published individuals queueing up to have their, "I told you so" moments on such topics long before you get there. Sorry to say this but most of these 'bandwagons' were rolling a long time before your conversion to their respective causes.

Im not disputing any of this. I said im waiting for irrifutable evidence

You seem to have skipped past the whole point of me buying cables though? WHAT was your point again?

His point is that theres no point obsessing over burn-in. Thats what the thread is all about, you know.

You then went on to say how you like finding the best cables for your system. This is different.

Hi chebby......sorry.... al

Im not obsessing over anything. What im saying is incredibly clear ~ it exists, and im waiting for irrifutable evidence to prove it as such.

Al....sorry......chebby then 'claimed' (At least that what it looks like to me), that I buy cables just to burn them in then throw them away and start again which is simply beyond stupid

Ive bought mine and tested mine as I bought better ones each time to see if (When) I hit a limit. But thus far each and every cable HAS brought benefits to 'my' system (Disregarding a few 'ebay specials' that were utter rubbish)

So to sum up 'my' experiments ~

Burn in does exist.

Components appear to acclimitise to cables that have been used (Even for years)

Silver takes a lot longer to 'burn in' than copper

Braided cables make more of a difference then armoured

The more wires that are braided, the better the RFI/EMI cancellation effect

Is that clear now?

 

[Anonymous]

aliEnRIK:
So to sum up 'my' experiments ~

Burn in does exist.

Components appear to acclimitise to cables that have been used (Even for years)

Silver takes a lot longer to 'burn in' than copper

Braided cables make more of a difference then armoured

The more wires that are braided, the better the RFI/EMI cancellation effect

Is that clear now?

I think you and Peter Belt are soulmates.

 

[Alec]

aliEnRIK:al7478:aliEnRIK:chebby:aliEnRIK:

Jitters already measured in digital cables....

Measured, analyzed for it's impact on viewers/listeners and discussed in BBC research papers in the early 1960s. (Regarding PCM digital transmission of signals along leased phone lines.)

No doubt researched and discussed long before the early 1960s by RCA, Bell etc.

None this is something you 'discovered' (or even waited for the the disovery thereof) and nothing whatsoever that was ever in any doubt when considering the possible audible effects.

There is nothing in this whole subject regarding cables or burn-in or jitter or directionality or anything else for you to justify a personal, "Aha. see? I told you all." type moment.

You have not made any 'discoveries' that were not being discussed with great 'vigour' in hundreds of issues of hifi magazines in the late 1970s and most of the 1980s.

There will be a couple of coachloads of far more qualified and published individuals queueing up to have their, "I told you so" moments on such topics long before you get there. Sorry to say this but most of these 'bandwagons' were rolling a long time before your conversion to their respective causes.

Im not disputing any of this. I said im waiting for irrifutable evidence

You seem to have skipped past the whole point of me buying cables though? WHAT was your point again?

His point is that theres no point obsessing over burn-in. Thats what the thread is all about, you know.

You then went on to say how you like finding the best cables for your system. This is different.

Al....sorry......chebby then 'claimed' (At least that what it looks like to me), that I buy cables just to burn them in then throw them away and start again which is simply beyond stupid

Do you mean this:

"After a suitable period the matter is moot unless someone is daft enough to keep buying new cables especially to enjoy hearing them transform. Certifiable behaviour. Like someone who buys a brand new car every month because he enjoys the running in process rather than the full potential of the car!"

If so I hope rereading it helped.

Now, you are saying burn in happens. Chebby says it doesnt much matter.

Is that clear now?

 

[aliEnRIK]

al7478:aliEnRIK:al7478:aliEnRIK:chebby:aliEnRIK:

Jitters already measured in digital cables....

Measured, analyzed for it's impact on viewers/listeners and discussed in BBC research papers in the early 1960s. (Regarding PCM digital transmission of signals along leased phone lines.)

No doubt researched and discussed long before the early 1960s by RCA, Bell etc.

None this is something you 'discovered' (or even waited for the the disovery thereof) and nothing whatsoever that was ever in any doubt when considering the possible audible effects.

There is nothing in this whole subject regarding cables or burn-in or jitter or directionality or anything else for you to justify a personal, "Aha. see? I told you all." type moment.

You have not made any 'discoveries' that were not being discussed with great 'vigour' in hundreds of issues of hifi magazines in the late 1970s and most of the 1980s.

There will be a couple of coachloads of far more qualified and published individuals queueing up to have their, "I told you so" moments on such topics long before you get there. Sorry to say this but most of these 'bandwagons' were rolling a long time before your conversion to their respective causes.

Im not disputing any of this. I said im waiting for irrifutable evidence

You seem to have skipped past the whole point of me buying cables though? WHAT was your point again?

His point is that theres no point obsessing over burn-in. Thats what the thread is all about, you know.

You then went on to say how you like finding the best cables for your system. This is different.

Al....sorry......chebby then 'claimed' (At least that what it looks like to me), that I buy cables just to burn them in then throw them away and start again which is simply beyond stupid

Do you mean this:

"After a suitable period the matter is moot unless someone is daft enough to keep buying new cables especially to enjoy hearing them transform. Certifiable behaviour. Like someone who buys a brand new car every month because he enjoys the running in process rather than the full potential of the car!"

If so I hope rereading it helped.

Now, you are saying burn in happens. Chebby says it doesnt much matter.

Is that clear now?

Very clear, but again youve got it all wrong with what I said. I said cable burn in DOES exist

I dont 'get off' on it. It happens and personally id rather it didnt. Ive bought cables as ive bought 'better quality' ones to aid my system. I havnt bought them to masterbate over the 'burn in' process

 

[Alec]

no, i have it right. you say it does exist. i know that. if you're sick of the process all you can do is say "im buying these cables and then im not going to worry anymore".

EDIT - You will just need to make the decision carefully. Some would say.

 

[aliEnRIK]

al7478:
no, i have it right. you say it does exist. i know that. if you're sick of the process all you can do is say "im buying these cables and then im not going to worry anymore".

EDIT - You will just need to make the decision carefully. Some would say.

worry about WHAT exactly?

 

[Alec]

You're being difficult for its own sake now.

You wold no longer need to worry about the sound or burn in of cables. Because, as i said, you could simply choose not to. And i said this because the "fact" that burn in exists seems to be a cause of annoyance to you.

 

[aliEnRIK]

al7478:
You're being difficult for its own sake now.

You wold no longer need to worry about the sound or burn in of cables. Because, as i said, you could simply choose not to. And i said this because the "fact" that burn in exists seems to be a cause of annoyance to you.

Gotcha ~ wasnt trying to be difficult, I just wasnt sure what you ment

Thats certainly my stance. Burn in exists, but I wish it didnt

 

[Peter Larsen]

So to do those of you who state that burn in does not exist. How do you explain, that I DID NOT let my ears adjust to the cable, but simply listened to it before burn in for only 30 minutes where it AT ALL TIME sounded harsh, and then after 4 days of continuous burn in (thats 96 hours) without me listening to it, the sound was immediatly improved, and the guitars in the same tracks that I listened to before burn in were smooth as butter? I mean we are not talking about subtle improvements, but going from truly intolerable to beautiful.

If YOU can't hear the difference, maybe you should get a new hobby, because then your are simply not up to the task of listening to hifi.

 

[Alec]

aliEnRIK:al7478:

You're being difficult for its own sake now.

You wold no longer need to worry about the sound or burn in of cables. Because, as i said, you could simply choose not to. And i said this because the "fact" that burn in exists seems to be a cause of annoyance to you.

Gotcha ~ wasnt trying to be difficult, I just wasnt sure what you ment

Thats certainly my stance. Burn in exists, but I wish it didnt