beresford caiman - the quest for Dac perfection on a budget

[admin_exported]

With my six week old Beresford 7520 with op amp upgrade bringing a smile to my face , I have sniffed the Caiman which is a Special Edition ( now out of stock ) 7520.

Stan has been most helpful in pointing me to a Scottish outfit that can take my 7520 and give it the Caiman spin.

Essentially this means the Wolfson Dac WM 8716 ( the key component ) , the dual op amp 4203 ( improving headphone socket I think ) and according to the spec Stan sent a Windows 7 ready usb input ( but that may already be in the 7520 )

Am waiting for a quote for the mods from north of the border ... it's going to be around 30 quid

Is this worth it ? will I have a Dacmagic beater and for about the same price ?

 

[PJPro]

peebs:
Is this worth it ? will I have a Dacmagic beater and for about the same price ?

Some would argue that you've got that already ;-)

 

[Anonymous]

Please keep me updated on the matter. 30 quid seems quite reasonable.

Personally I prefer the Beresford sound over the Magic, from what I have been hearing the Caiman should be somewhat better than the magic.

 

[Anonymous]

If anyone is interested in this upgrade, google: Tirna Electronics.

I might give it ago, also might try the metal can version of the LM4562 ops, the LME49720HA.

I will post again with my findings.

 

[basshound]

There is another company Audio Upgrades http://www.audioupgrades.co.uk/beresford.shtml offering mods to the Beresford from £115-£195.Any technical people out there who could say how much this would improve the Beresford beyond the upgrade mentioned above i.e. is it worth the money or would it be wiser to just get a more expensive Dac in the first place?

 

[Anonymous]

I've considered the audio upgrade route but I think its a little too much cash on such a modest DAC. Whereas 30 seems relatively reasonable amount to send on a DAC in this price range.

When I email audio upgrade they told me that the top upgrade on the Beresford, the one with the PSU is roughly equivalent to a 1500+ CD player. It might pay to talk to Brent if you are considering the upgrades for an idea of how each stage would perform. Although I would take these estimates with a pinch of salt.

 

[manicm]

I followed a thread in another forum elsewhere, and the Caiman is officially off sale, but if you ask nicely Steve(?) will still build one for you.

Apparently he did not sell too many, surprisingly, citing reasons of perception that at that price customers felt safer with a brand name like CA.

Sad really.

 

[Anonymous]

Pretty sure its Stan.

I received an email recently and they were still on sale then, umm. Looking at the site they can still be purchased. From what I heard they were originally build for a few forum members but after wider demand they were put on general sale.

Personally I prefer to support an individual such as Stan who puts a lot of effort into the business and provides wonderful customer support. Also the Beresford has a good DIY route, this makes upgrades more cost effective. Hopefully I will be sending my DAC off for the upgrade next week, will let you know how it sounds.

 

[basshound]

I currently have a Roksan Kandy Mk3 cdp and am considering going the laptop/dac route.Would the Beresford be on a par with the dac in the Roksan or would I need to aim higher?

 

[Clare Newsome]

manicm:
I followed a thread in another forum elsewhere, and the Caiman is officially off sale, but if you ask nicely Steve(?) will still build one for you.

Apparently he did not sell too many, surprisingly, citing reasons of perception that at that price customers felt safer with a brand name like CA.

Sad really.

Well Stan has offered us a review unit of the Caiman, which suggests it's still available. We hope to run the review soon...

 

[Craig M.]

basshound:I currently have a Roksan Kandy Mk3 cdp and am considering going the laptop/dac route.Would the Beresford be on a par with the dac in the Roksan or would I need to aim higher?

i used to have the same amp and cdp going into dyn focus110, i never compared directly but from memory the kandy had a slight edge on the 7520. broadly similar type of sound though. personally, if you can i would aim a little higher, although i don't think a beresford would be embarrassed by the rest of your kit. the main problem is the next step up in dacs cost a lot more.

 

[Craig M.]

basshound:I currently have a Roksan Kandy Mk3 cdp and am considering going the laptop/dac route.Would the Beresford be on a par with the dac in the Roksan or would I need to aim higher?

i used to have the same amp and cdp going into dyn focus110, i never compared directly but from memory the kandy had a slight edge on the 7520. broadly similar type of sound though. personally, if you can i would aim a little higher, although i don't think a beresford would be embarrassed by the rest of your kit. the main problem is the next step up in dacs cost a lot more. not heard the caiman though, if the mags review is positive i might get one before i blow mega bucks on a chord or naim dac.

 

[manicm]

Clare Newsome:manicm:

I followed a thread in another forum elsewhere, and the Caiman is officially off sale, but if you ask nicely Steve(?) will still build one for you.

Apparently he did not sell too many, surprisingly, citing reasons of perception that at that price customers felt safer with a brand name like CA.

Sad really.

Well Stan has offered us a review unit of the Caiman, which suggests it's still available. We hope to run the review soon...

That's great!

 

[Anonymous]

Well sent my beresford off for the upgrade today, should take about a week. I will post impressions when I get it back and any other comments about the service. So far they have been quick to respond to emails and offered all the advice I needed, so far so good. Borrowing a friend's TC-7510 for now, cant coupe without a DAC for a week.

 

[Anonymous]

Just thought that I would add to the forum.

Spoke with Stan from Beresford yesterday via email.

He has put me on the waiting list for a Caiman and will be in touch next week when they arrive.

Can not wait my digital music is in need of some help!!!

 

[Anonymous]

I've also taken a punt and ordered a Caiman today. I already have a DacMagic which sounds wonderful in the living room and my study, but it cannot be in two places at once. The Caiman is cheaper and I have high hopes of it sounding better. Stan seems like a stand up guy and it feels good to give him a leg up. Fingers crossed I may get it before the weekend.

 

[Clare Newsome]

Our Caiman has just arrived for review - we'll be testing it shortly. Will update re when the review will go online

 

[Anonymous]

and my upgraded 7520 came today. Good day all round. Will add first impressions when I get time tomorrow.

 

[Anonymous]

paid for mine today...

should be arriving tomorrow!

 

[Anonymous]

Well my first impressions are positive. For all that £30 doesn't buy you in this world it is well spent on this upgrade. Looking at the size of the chip this is no job for an amateur, so its worth the professional labour. The service has been great, communication at every point in the upgrade.

As for the sound I think there has been an improvement in most areas including detail, dynamics, soundstaging and timing. A good all-round upgrade when coupled with the LM4562NAs. So if you looking a Caiman sound without the class A-headphone amp this is a worthwhile and effective upgrade.

 

[Anonymous]

I've had my Caiman several days now but have only been able to use on my budget system as my Yamaha is broken at the moment.

I'm not a professional tester so I can only tell you what my impressions are compared to the DacMagic.

Straight out the box I thought it was a little hard sounding but either I have grown used to it or it has mellowed. It is certainly very clear and wide soundstaging as the DacMagic was. I did also detect a little extra treble detail on one track that I had never heard before. In fact I thought maybe it was a glitch as it really stood out and surprised me.

The most noticeable differences to me was that my faster paced music had more attack and rhythm plus the bass seemed significantly extended.

I haven't plugged my DacMagic back in yet but I am wondering if the acoustic music I have is soft and warmer sounding with it.

I think I will need to do back to back testing to really know. As they both use different power supplies it sounds like too much hard work.

When my RX-V1900 gets replaced I will do a serious audition in the living room.

 

[Anonymous]

please update us on the Caiman vs Dacmagic

 

[Anonymous]

If you are referring to me I'm still awaiting a replacement amp. I've been offered the RX-V2065 but it is not available for 2 weeks. Sevenoaks have just rang me and they do have an RX-V1900 boxed that they can send me. I am now scratching my head. I've been without my amp for 3 weeks already.

 

[Anonymous]

Opted for the 1900, won't have it till Monday.

 

[Anonymous]

Hawkmoon:please update us on the Caiman vs Dacmagic

I decided to do a short back to back test Caiman vs DacMagic in my study listening to Muse - Starlight several times with each DAC one after the other. The equipment used was a Marantz SR4200 with Mission M7 bookshelf speakers. The DAC's were used as a preamp through a Velodyne SPL-800i sub via RCA connects Silver Anniversary and then into the amp with Interflex Serial Digital. The music was pumped via digital coax from my home PC playing an accurately ripped backup of Muse - Starlight on Foobar2000 utilising WASAPI bit perfect playback.

On sound alone the Caiman is the clear winner in my opinion. Both sounded great but after two listens with each, I am certain that I was not imagining a difference. The Caiman is clearer and wider sounding, Matthew Bellamy's opening vocals were flawless. You'd think the Caiman was louder but surely this is not possible. It seemed louder because the track immediately had more drive, focus and rhythm. The bass was tighter and had more weight. The DacMagic in comparison was not so clear and wide sounding plus the bass was allowed to get a little overblown in places. That being said I was using a rushed setup and the subwoofer could have been placed better and probably married with the M7's more professionally. It also has to be said that the DacMagic sounded extremely good as it did when I first bought it but after a consecutive comparisons the Caiman proved it was an improvement.

On specification the DacMagic has balanced outputs, digital outputs, 3 phase filter options and little lights to show what sample rate you are receiving. Although the Caiman does not have these features it does have a headphone stage with volume control which can also be used with optional RCA outputs as a preamp volume stage.

I prefer the power pack on the Caiman which is small and neat and does not appear to generate any heat. The DacMagic's PSU is bulky and will get hot when left plugged in. I noticed that the DacMagic itself also tends to get quite warm when being used.

On this result the Caiman will be given pride of place in the living room due to sound performance. I can leave it plugged in knowing that it is not wasting as much electricity. The DacMagic will return to my study where I first used it and was wowed by it's sound. I'll be able to turn it off at the plug more readily there. Plus I intend to experiment with the digital output.

I hope What Hi-Fi make the same findings or I'm going to look a right charlie.