As the Nait 5i, but more detailed

[admin_exported]

Hi all.

Recently I got a Naim Nait 5i, which is connected to an Audiolab 8200cd and some EB Acoustic EB2. The combination is fantastic because Naim has eliminated the rough, wheezing and brightness that I had with other amps. And now the music is full of life, rhythm and momentum. I love the sound of Naim! The problem is that the Audiolab and EB2 are very detailed, but the Naim eliminates most of these details, which are one of the reasons why I bought this player and these speakers.

Does anyone know if there is an amplifier with the sound of the Nait 5i (warm, punchy, rithmic) but more detailed and transparent? I do not want to ruin:my budget is around 1000 pounds.

Thank you!

 

[plastic penguin]

Good question TBH. This could be a case of too much detail could kill the overall presentation. From what I've heard about the EBs and a very short listening with the Audiolab CDP, yes they are very detailed. The issue comes when you start adding to the detail side: Sometimes additional detail can make it sound brittle, hence why mix 'n' matching is vitally important you strike the right balance.

If you like the combo but hanker after more detail it maybe worth holding back a while. Changing the amp may change the overall feel and you'll lose the lovely sound currently.

What cables do you use with your set-up?

Edit - The obvious choice for an amp is the Naim XS. I personally think it has all the traits you're looking for, and it's on par with my Leema Pulse. Alternatively, look at Roksan Kandy K2 and Creek Evo2.

 

[Anonymous]

Hate to ruin your budget. But the answer is an easy one: Naim XS

 

[Anonymous]

Hate to ruin your budget. But the answer is an easy one: Naim XS

I suspected it. How detailed is the XS? Not as much as the Cyrus 8xp, according to the review of WHF, but more than a Marantz?

Thanks!

 

[Anonymous]

Good question TBH. This could be a case of too much detail could kill the overall presentation. From what I've heard about the EBs and a very short listening with the Audiolab CDP, yes they are very detailed. The issue comes when you start adding to the detail side: Sometimes additional detail can make it sound brittle, hence why mix 'n' matching is vitally important you strike the right balance.

If you like the combo but hanker after more detail it maybe worth holding back a while. Changing the amp may change the overall feel and you'll lose the lovely sound currently.

What cables do you use with your set-up?

Edit - The obvious choice for an amp is the Naim XS. I personally think it has all the traits you're looking for, and it's on par with my Leema Pulse. Alternatively, look at Roksan Kandy K2 and Creek Evo2.

Thanks for your advice. I use chord cables, but I do not think they affect much in the detail.

You are right: with Cyrus the combo was very detailed, but wheezing and too bright for me. She caused me a headache!

Do you think than Roksan, Creek and Leema have the same sound funny, warm and punchy than Naim?

Thanks!

 

[plastic penguin]

Good question TBH. This could be a case of too much detail could kill the overall presentation. From what I've heard about the EBs and a very short listening with the Audiolab CDP, yes they are very detailed. The issue comes when you start adding to the detail side: Sometimes additional detail can make it sound brittle, hence why mix 'n' matching is vitally important you strike the right balance.

If you like the combo but hanker after more detail it maybe worth holding back a while. Changing the amp may change the overall feel and you'll lose the lovely sound currently.

What cables do you use with your set-up?

Edit - The obvious choice for an amp is the Naim XS. I personally think it has all the traits you're looking for, and it's on par with my Leema Pulse. Alternatively, look at Roksan Kandy K2 and Creek Evo2.

Thanks for your advice. I use chord cables, but I do not think they affect much in the detail.

You are right: with Cyrus the combo was very detailed, but wheezing and too bright for me. She caused me a headache!

Do you think than Roksan, Creek and Leema have the same sound funny, warm and punchy than Naim?

Thanks!

The Kandy and Creek won't out punch the Nait 5i but the Leema will. The Kandy and the Creek have a nice full-bodied or warmish presentation, and will outgun the Nait (not by much) in detail, although it'll be more subtle. The Pulse, on the other hand, is the best integrated amp I've heard below the 2k mark... and it has incredible punch. Don't mistake that with bass depth. It has deep, taut bass and in isolation nothing else will do. It's only when you hear the Caspian or XS side-by-side with the Leema that the Welsh beauty ever-so-slightly lacks. Overall, though, the Leema improves on the Nait 5i in pretty much every area. Albeit very noticable it isn't 'night and day'. Although not warm the Leema does have a lovely organic tonal balance.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for your reply. My concern is that the final sound, combined with the 8200cd and the EB2, can not be too hurtful at high frequencies.

 

[rich51080]

Exposure 3010 would be well worth a try. lots of PRaT and also detailed.

IMO a little step up from the Nait and more on par with the XS range.

 

[oldric_naubhoff]

you could also check out my amp; Classic One mkIII, entry level form Pathos.

never heard your CDP nor your speakers. however, my set up sound like something you described you want to get; detailed and fast but fluid, musical and non fatiguing.

mind you, what you're trying to get is probably the most difficult thing to get in hi-fi, at least at budget level; the high level of musical detail true hi-fi is capable of achieving but no associated head ache . good luck on your endeavour.

 

[plastic penguin]

Thanks for your reply. My concern is that the final sound, combined with the 8200cd and the EB2, can not be too hurtful at high frequencies.

Well, the Leema has wonderful control over my RS6s treble, which can become slightly shrill with the wrong amp. When I heard the Leema/Audiolab 8200 and RS6s at a dealers last year, it sounded 'alive' but... the problem I have is I like a slightly laid back presentation, hence why my sources tend to have these traits.

Could also look at cables. There are a few on here who are really impressed by Tellurium Q black, describing it as far more detailed than most other cables. However, it comes at a price: About £40 per metre. Or alternatively, look at the TQ Blue, which are cheaper.

I'm currently using Chord SilverScreen speaker cable and Merlin Chopin interconnects (CD to amp), and the Merlins are open and transparent. Fabulous for a sub £100 i/c.

 

[Anonymous]

Yes, I think I I'm looking for the Holy Grail of sound: warm, very detailed, with PRAT and without fatigue.

The problem is that these speakers are not in stores, and it is impossible to hear the final result before buying.

For now, I will take de Naim sound. Later, If I find one of the these amplifiers (Leema, XS, Roksan, Exposure) a good price, I will venture.

 

[plastic penguin]

Wise decision to stay with a combo you like, even if it isn't utopia. The old saying, "if it ain't broke..." rings so true with hi-fi.

 

[oldric_naubhoff]

The problem is that these speakers are not in stores, and it is impossible to hear the final result before buying.

I was only saying that you could try out my amp if you get a chance, not the whole set up.

but you're right. Focus110s are now discontinued. but I'm using Magnepan MG12s ATM. and I think they are vasly superior speakers. since when Maggies arrived (beginning of Jan) I haven't changed them for Dyns. I think it's about time for me to change the bio....

 

[Gazzip]

Spoken from disappointed experience, nothing from Cyrus that I have owned worked with the EB 2's.
This was echoed by EB Acoustics who were "left feeling cold" by their experience of the EB/Cyrus combo.

8VS2
X Power
Mono X's

None of the above worked and all sounded very bright and lightweight.
Steer clear of that combo. (although I haven't tried my current weapon of choice, Mono X300's).

 

[Potts]

Similar to the above posts, and might be a tad biased... but I'd recommend the Nait XS highly. It seems to have everything that you're looking for, however I don't know how it compares to the other amps that the guys on here have suggested.

I started with the Nait 5i and upgraded to the XS, it just seemed like a natural progression as I enjoyed the sound of the Nait 5i so much.

 

[Anonymous]

If you are after a warmth without detail loss I recommend Accuphase E-250 and Luxman L-505u. They are expensive but they worth every penny and are far better than Naim XS. The L-505u is punchier and cheaper.

 

[plastic penguin]

The OP has only a £1,000 budget.

 

[Roby]

If you are after a warmth without detail loss I recommend Accuphase E-250 and Luxman L-505u. They are expensive but they worth every penny and are far better than Naim XS. The L-505u is punchier and cheaper.

Hue It not so shore about that demoed the E-250 it couldn't convince me an it realy expensive....An my preference went to the Musical fidelity M6i

On the other hand when I demoed the niam xs I choosed the M6i but that choice took more reflection an time an it was a much harder choice.... because The Naime heve some particular sound who is realy easy to listen to an to enjoy.

But than its subjective an it depend what your afther

Anyway the xs would still be my secound choice afther the demo's I did an not the E-250

But hey enjoy the music..... :rockout:

 

[Anonymous]

Spoken from disappointed experience, nothing from Cyrus that I have owned worked with the EB 2's. This was echoed by EB Acoustics who were "left feeling cold" by their experience of the EB/Cyrus combo. 8VS2 X Power Mono X's None of the above worked and all sounded very bright and lightweight. Steer clear of that combo. (although I haven't tried my current weapon of choice, Mono X300's).

I totally agree with you. I tested with Cyrus because that was the midrage system proposed by WHF, but for my taste was very bright and anemic, unexciting.

I'm looking to make the best of the EB2 requieres very fine adjustments: they need to punch and energy, great warmth and at the same time, an amplifier that respects the transparency of the speakers.

It would be nice to know which systems have the EB2's users and what results have been obtained.

Thanks again

 

[nbaptista]

Densen B 110

detailed, warm, and lots of Prat!

 

[chebby]

Try the matching Naim CD5i CD player with your Nait 5i.

It's within budget. Naim amps and their own matching sources really do have a lot of synergy. (I speak from the experience of owning and enjoying a Nait 5i/CD5i/NAT05/nSATs system for two years).

Extend the 'matching' right down to using the Naim supplied 5 pin DIN interconnect that comes in the CD5i box and you might be pleasantly suprised.

(Just an alternative to getting rid of an amp that - from your first comments - you obviously really enjoy.)

 

[poldo]

I second the Exposure 3010s2, it is nor far behind the Naim XS and in some areas even better (bass control), you can also easily upgrade the amp by adding the 3010s2 power amp and bi-amp your speakers.

Caspian is a warm smooth amp, but it is a bit slow I think, exposure has more pace.

Try the it with the budget Chord Cobra plus interlink it is very good for the money.

 

[plastic penguin]

Having a Leema Pulse, there's no amp around the sub-£1500 sector that has comparible PRaT, the possible exception being the Cyrus IMPO.

 

[Al ears]

I would tend to agree with Chebby in that a change of CD player rather than an amp change may be what is required here.
If you are determined to replace the amp then the XS or Roksan Caspian (forget the Kandy) would be the options that I would look into.
I have EB2's but have never heard them with any Audiolab equipment so could not offer any advice in this particular pairing.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the advices. At the moment I cannot do tests because I am waiting to replace my Eb Acoustics Eb2. However, the models that attract me most are the Roksan, the Leema and the Nait XS. I've tried with Cyrus 6xp and in my opinion has nothing to do with the Nait 5i. With the EB2 had not PRAT at all, but a lot of detail.