Am I wrong to expect a refund after 7 months of ownership

[bigboss]

Video of the problem 3 most detailed one

Would anyone agree this looks right??

https://youtu.be/OH_lFGE8HLA

Is this problem only seen in your projector? Have you connected it to your TV and is the issue reproducible? I'm asking because I suspect it is the limitation of technology of your projector. Even my Sony projector occasionally flickers (similar to the video) which lasts few seconds and disappears.

Check this thread:

https://www.avforums.com/threads/hw40es-flickering-in-low-lamp-mode.1890785/

 

[bigboss]

Video of the problem 3 most detailed one

Would anyone agree this looks right??

https://youtu.be/OH_lFGE8HLA

Is this problem only seen in your projector? Have you connected it to your TV and is the issue reproducible? I'm asking because I suspect it is the limitation of technology of your projector. Even my Sony projector occasionally flickers (similar to the video) which lasts few seconds and disappears.

Check this thread:

https://www.avforums.com/threads/hw40es-flickering-in-low-lamp-mode.1890...

 

[ellisdj]

BB its not flickering the picture is dropping out same as if yiu turned the pj on with no signal. The pj is on high lamp mode and there is no flickering

The pj was working perfectly soon as i put the darbee in i started getting occaisional drop outs and a few other things.

Initially they were very spread apart so maybe i watched 10 hours of content between them then a quick power cycle of the darbee i.e. turn it off then back on again brings the picture back for maybe another 10 hours.

Seeing as its my cinema room no tv 10 hours of content could be a few weeks so the odd power cycle i could suffer.

I admit i havent tried the darbee in our back room on a tv.

There is also the possibility its my blu ray player.
However it started when i put tye darbee in and power cycling the darbee brings picture back. If it was the blu ray then surely i would need to power cycle the blu ray player.

If i power cycle the pj and it does bring the picture back as well but there is no way i am doing that with a bulb pj.

So basically it seems there needs to be a resink of the hdmi handshake.

I will be taking the systen apart later today to take the darbee to pack up to send back so i will do some testing without it and see if i get the prolem again

 

[ellisdj]

Just to exaplain by picture dropping out i mean the screen going black and the hdmi logo comes up indicating the pj is receiving no signal.

The hdmi logo is yellow with a cross when this happens.
With the lindy fibre hdmi it stayed black and i dont remember it coming back unless i power cycled the darbee.

With the shorter cable i am using now 10m hdmi to the pj from the darbee the picture does come back on after a short period like 10-30 seconds.
Again that shows to me the blu ray player is sending the signal the pj is receiving it when its there but there is something in the middle causing the chain to break down.

 

[ideal av]

 

[ideal av]

well here goes, it might be a long one but i think its only fair to put my side of the story as so far you have all just heard Terry's, i'm gonna be cut & pasting the conversation from the avf conversation so Terry can see that i'm not lying as he has accused me of.

May 9th 2016
TerryHi AllenI have done it mate just now through the site - I didnt see your full message re over the phone no matter its doneThanks very much for the help with it, I look forward to getting it and hope its an improvement on Reality Creation as you say - good combo of both hopefully be the one
Thanks again
All the best

no matter what i do i'm unable to edit anything into this post so i've reported it to the forum admin, tbh i haven't the time to be messing about like this so if you want me to continue i'll have to post separate posts

lmk

allan

 

[ellisdj]

Hi Allan if you are going to copy and paste the whole conversation - then dont worry I have it all screenshot pasted into jpeg files and will post all 25 of them up in time line.

I didnt really want to do that - it wasnt my intention for this thread but if think that would be fair to you then i will do it ?

 

[ideal av]

Hi Allan if you are going to copy and paste the whole conversation - then dont worry I have it all screenshot pasted into jpeg files and will post all 25 of them up in time line.

I didnt really want to do that - it wasnt my intention for this thread but if think that would be fair to you then i will do it ?

it shows my side of the story Terry, how you accused me of lying when i didn't and how i've offered from day one to replace it for you, and finally how you kept asking to hang onto it for longer with all the dates of each and every message.

you decided to start this thread not me so i've every right to reply to defend myself Terry i've also asked Darbee USA to respond to me this morning as you told me you had been in contact with them but didnt bother to let me know the outcome of the conversation between yourselves,

i'm waiting to hear back from them but the time differences will make it later on

Allan

 

[ellisdj]

Ps I emailed Darbee on 17.11.2016 and didnt get a response.

email sent reads
Terry Reply|Thu 17/11/2016 10:48 To:support@darbeevision.com
Dear Sirs

I hope you can provide me some assistance.

I purchased a DVP 5000s from the UK distributor in May 2016 Ideal AV

Straight away I reported I was having infrequent problems with the unit, I felt it was faulty - the picture would drop out as if it had lost hdmi connection or something similar

To regain the picture I had to hard power off and on the DVP unit, because the unit is going to a projector I am unable to quickly restart it to try and gain the hand shake again that way.

The issue being infrequent I managed to watch a lot of content with no drop outs - or the odd one here and there I was suffering because I like how the unit improves my picture

However just recently the drop outs have increased dramatically to sometimes being every few minutes - which as you can imagine makes watching any content impossible.

I have also had other issues - like sparklies on screen before a drop out.

Quite often now hard powering the DVP off then on does not bring the picture back - sometimes the picture is going on and off before it finally drops out.

I am now thinking the unit is actually faulty because at the moment I cannot even watch an hour long streamed episode from Netflix as the picture drops out multiple times and sometimes I cannot get it back on at all.

This is so frustrating and I am hoping you can help me. Does the unit sound faulty? Do I need to return it

I have the DVP connected direct to my blu ray player via a 1metre hdmi cable - it then feeds my projector via 20m HDMI Fibre Optic Cable.

It seems like its the input hdmi that is the problem as unplugging and plugging it back in has brought the picture back when hard powering the DVP off then on has not worked.

Would it better or worse to have the DVP just before the projector with the 20metre hdmi cable as the input then a 1metre cable as the output to the projector?

I can do this but its a lot of work and I dont want to waste the time doing it if it will not fix the issue, however I will do it if it will fix the issue

Can you please get back to me with some assistance on this

Very much appreciated

Kind Regards

 

[ellisdj]

Allan I had no issue with you and I was greatful with how you dealt with the situation until recently where I asked you for the refund. Then you seemed to turn which I semi understand but didnt appreciate at all and took very personally actually.

Up to that point you offered me some advice and suggested quite clearly the issue could be the darbee handshaking and that the improved model 5100 had fixed this issue for other people - not once did you mention it was the older model they had - how the hell was I supposed to know that? You put clearly that the 5100 had the fixed the issue for other people even mentioning their names and suggesting I speak to them. I will post up the full conversation here but it will take me time as its a of uploading and even writing this is stressing me out and making me feel upset and angry. I dont want to be doing this today

Then when I asked you about the refund you all of a sudden you had no previous knowledge of any problems with hdmi handshaking - but you did when it might lead to a further sale. Whether you intended it or not - that it is how I interpreted it.

So saying you lied there is exactly how I saw it and imagine how that made me feel. You may not like being called a liar as much as I dont like being on the receiving end.

I started this thread because I have a conscience and I wanted to see if others thought I was being unreasonable but I am being 100% honest stating the problems I have had, there is no scull duggery here I am genuinely a very dissapointed person overall and I have tried to give you but really the darbee as much benefit of doubt as I can give a piece of equipment that has not worked 100% since day 1.

I will post the conversation up when I can - please bear with me

 

[ellisdj]

This is the first 8 of 24 - you can see here I reported straight away about the issues I was having and it was suggested it could be handshake issue with the unit. In my eyes at this time this is how I saw it and the choices I had

If the unit is not faulty and its just an inherent design situation - what do I do?

1. Take the unit out of my system and lose the benefit of it - I didnt want that

2. pay out more and upgrade to the better box (I didnt really want to do this as I was holding out to buy a UHD player and the darbee was intended as a temp measure until I bought a player with it built in

3. The decision I made - suffer the drop outs for the picture improvement and try and work out if its somehting I can fix some how. You will see from the next lot of comments why I did this and how I explained it to you Allan.

EDIT I have just seen how small the text is - Please let me know if you cant read it and I will have try and edit it - thanks

 

[ideal av]

thanks for the Darbee reply Terry

I'm clutching at straws here but i'm still thinking that the issue could well be having a 20 mtr HDMI cable between the darbee and Sony pj could be your problem, i know you have tried other cables but the least length one i gather is 10 mtrs.

why you say its too much trouble is your business, but all you had to do was unplug the darbee from the avr end, plug in into the sony and supply power, surely that takes 2 mins and that would tell us if indeed it was the cable length

Remember any hdmi device has to send voltage to the receiver end to activate the hdmi handshake, if the cable (s) you are using are using some of that voltage then it will cause issues which is why i suggested a hdmi repeater such as the ones Keene supply, which fell on deaf ears, that or trying the 5100cie Darbee

I've also suggested that it could be a part of your equipment that doesn't like the darbee in the chain or vice versa and you asked me to guarantee that if it was replaced that it would work, i explained that i cannot guarantee that and no one can, its impossible to do this

i've offered to show you your darbee in action here which i'm pretty sure will work ok and an offer to replace if not which is i think only fair to do, but you refuse to do this, i asked this so i can check the hdmi input to see if its got damaged in any way at all

you won't even send it back so i can test it for you and blame the darbee for breaking your hdmi cable which quite frankly is ludicrous to me

you say you haven't time to post any more but yet you started the thread in the first place

tell you what, send it back, if you want i'll post a video of me unopening it and setting up in my system to see it working ok and i'll refund you less postage as i havent time either to be posting this nonsense as its doing me, you, and the product no good at all

i reckon i must have sold over 300 Darbee 5000's unit since launch and unless i'm completely wrong you are the only one to complain, not saying you don't have a right to if somethings not right, but at least you should give me a chance to put it right which you are refusing to do and demanding a refund after 7 months

but i still won't accept being called a liar, that was clearly out of order and not called for, i'm know for good customer service/relations and WILL NOT do anything to jeopardise that so i'd like an apology please

good day

Allan

 

[Benedict_Arnold]

Gentlemen,

Might i suggest you both consult "learned friends" and / or continue this discussion off-board before either of you drops yourself in the legal manure?

If there's a technical issue we can help with, fair enough. If it's a fault with the equipment, there's nothing any of us can do by internerd.

Either sort it out between yourselves or go to Court.

 

[bigboss]

I would suggest you both to calm down, have a drink and come back to this thread with a calm response. Ellisdj does not owe any apology IMO. He has perceived the conversation his way, similar to the way Allan has.

 

[ideal av]

well here goes, it might be a long one but i think its only fair to put my side of the story as so far you have all just heard Terry's, i'm gonna be cut & pasting the conversation from the avf conversation soTerry can see that i'm not lying as he has accused me of.

May 9th 2016
TerryHi AllenI have done it mate just now through the site - I didnt see your full message re over the phone no matter its doneThanks very much for the help with it, I look forward to getting it and hope its an improvement on Reality Creation as you say - good combo of both hopefully be the one
Thanks again
All the best

 

[ellisdj]

Allan you are still not seeing it from my side - I do see it from yours but why cant you see it from view point?

I am not apologising to you. All I have done is explain my experience to this whole situation as a customer. .

I have been having problems, I posted videos yesterday showing examples of the problems I am having, I had them yesterday watching content yesterday. It doesnt matter if the darbee works for you, it needs to work for me, it needs to work with my kit. I cant be expected to change everything just to make that one thing work - it has to work universal or be advertised as such that it doesnt work with certain kit.

My HDMI cable got damaged becasue I have had to pull power on the darbee umpteen times, sometimes umpteen times in an hour. That its the truth of what I have been doing. I have never once said that was your fault - that should not have happened.

However my whole concern when I go to the trouble of replacing that hdmi cable which was installed for the long term in trunking under velour I dont want to be in a position in the future where it happens again. Its the problems I have had with the darbee unit that have caused the damage to it in directly.

I have got no issue sending the device back to you and will be doing so next week as I have stated - I didnt want to get into conflict with you either. Your attitude towards me and this situation has been coming across as hostile to a degree, maybe I am reading it wrong.

Had you said somehting like this Terry I am very sorry you have been having issues, you have tried to work it out and it hasnt worked which is a shame, I appreciate your persistence.

I am sorry your other kit got damaged that is terrible luck and I hope you get it sorted under warranty.

Please understand its been 7 months, so can you send me the unit to test it out and I will see if it actually is faulty - if it is or isnt faulty how about we work something out if a replacement is not going to work in your system.

That sort of response would have me spending more money with you - thats its not the response i got from you

I got this

 

[Q5]

Guys,

I have one of these in my system, it is placed between my TV and amp. I have a 2 metre Chord active from the amp to the 5000S and a 0.75 Metre Chord Active from the 5000s to the TV, I have had no problems at all.

I realise that:-

I am not using a projector

My cable runs are alot shorter.

Ellisdj - I thought you were a methodical person, would it not be of interest to all that you test the unit with a TV and shorter cables to see if there is a fault with the unit, or a fault in your setup.

If Allan tests the unit in his system and it does not fault what is he to do.

If you send it to me I will test it in place of mine, then you have a neutral opinion.

 

[ellisdj]

Q5 - I appreciate what your saying - so am I at fault using the unit with a projector? If it works with 1m cables what do I do, do I accept that?

Does it say not suitable for long hdmi cable runs or use with projectors - not that I have seen so I am not at fault here for expecting it to work using it that way? Its pretty normal expectation,

Please see where I am on that front

EDIT - I do need to test the system without it more yes I admit I am at fault there - and I will be however factor in my situation - I am using the system for many months no problem - I install the dvp 5000s straight away no picture then I get it working and within 2 weeks drop outs are happening. They are happening on 50hz content looking back - I have had the most problems with the nox sets I have watched - Walking Dead, Sons of Anarchy, Game Thrones and atm terrible luck with Luce Cage. That only accounts for about 30% content I watch - I dont remember having the problems with 24fps content such as the 3 films I have watched this week. Its not been a simple matter for me

This is the damage to my hdmi cable btw -

I am hoping Lindy can simply provide me a replacement connector to save me removing the whole cable from its installation fingers crossed they are closed until 3rd Jan

 

[Q5]

It is not about fault with you, it is to find out if the device is faulty or not.

if the device shows the same symptoms tested elsewhere, then it would appear to be faulty.

However if it does not, then the problem lies elsewhere in your system.

It is unfortunate that the cable has been damaged and have never seen that happen before.

 

[ellisdj]

No i am sorry q5 if the device works elsewhere and doesnt in my system it doesnt make my system faulty.

If my system works perfectly but doesnt when the dvp is in the chain how can you say the system is at fault in that instance.

We are talking quality here marantz ud7007
Sony vw500
Chord active hdmi then 2 different long hdmi.

 

[Deleted member 2457]

Seeing that it wasn't working properly in the first and seeing that you informed the shop of this, you have been honest from the start, if it's faulty in your system that's all that counts.

 

[Q5]

No i am sorry q5 if the device works elsewhere and doesnt in my system it doesnt make my system faulty.

If my system works perfectly but doesnt when the dvp is in the chain how can you say the system is at fault in that instance.

We are talking quality here marantz ud7007 Sony vw500 Chord active hdmi then 2 different long hdmi.

I am not saying your system is faulty, I am saying under those circumstances there is possibly an issue.

The hard part is to find what the issue is, but if the 5000S is proven to be not faulty it is more about compatibility with your setup.

 

[ellisdj]

Q5 that is the killer bit if its true hence my rock and hard place scenario.

 

[Series1boy]

I think Allan at AV is bang out of order with is poor customer device and I think he may have also broken the data protection act by naming his customer Terry if this is ellisdjs real name. Unfortunately for Allan at Av it doesn't work both ways and because he is a business and supplying products and services then he can be named and shamed because he is a business and is wife open if he probvides a poor service, so long as it isnt slander that is...

if Ellisdj has an issue, then Allan should be helping him in every way possible to try and resolve the problem and not blame the customer.. this is typical of a small business where they take it personal and you don't don't see these types of responses from the operations director at Richer Sounds...

 

[ellisdj]

I packaged up the Darbee last night as promised - It was late I was actually going to leave it for today - however as soon as I started up my system I was having problems before I even put content on this time so I decided to remove it.

After taking it out and getting the system wired up and working I managed best part of a Luce Cage episode on netflix with no problems before I fell asleep. I woke up the picture was still on but obviously I didnt watch enough to know for sure its stopped the problems. I wont get a chance now until tomorrow night to watch anymore at best.

I boxed it all back up today to be sent back to Ideal AV - its the first time I had a chance to look at the unit - its been in situ behind a rack in a blacked out room. I thought I would publicy show the condition of the unit so that its not used against me in anyway

Main body of the unit is perfect

HDMI OUT minimum traffic and in near perfect condition

However HDMI in that has received all the traffic from the power cycling and removal of the hdmi cable to try and get picture back on when its gone off - we are talking many times you can clearly see the traffic its had

Please bear in mind I have been doing this in a pitch black room and even with the lights on visibility is not the best with not a lot of space to move and after doing it many times, sometimes many times in one hour the motivation takes a dip

Everything is back in the original plastic and box now ready to go back next week - neater than this photo and obviously the darbee is in the box as well