Which of these two tonearm cables?

[good_enough]

Trade in assumes the cartridge is intact I guess??

Nope - some are condition immaterial, including Hana's, and some don't care if you are the second owner. Google is your friend.

TL;DR:

Yup, on an MC you replace the whole cart not just the stylus. Whether this is a material difference depends on whether the MC brand you buy supports 'new for old' trade-in, cos the cost of a MM stylus is high. It's not material for a Hana.

 

[Al ears]

Nope - some are condition immaterial, including Hana's, and some don't care if you are the second owner. Google is your friend.

TL;DR:

Yup, on an MC you replace the whole cart not just the stylus. Whether this is a material difference depends on whether the MC brand you buy supports 'new for old' trade-in, cos the cost of a MM stylus is high. It's not material for a Hana.

I certainly hope you are correct.
One assumes if quite damaged you are not going to get much of a trade in price.

 

[miksko]

Hmm there's plenty of headroom beyond the 2500 I would suggest, including line contact designs and HOMC like my (superb) Hana SH, that don't need a new pre-amp.

FWIW I find stereophile.com a better source for vinyl related recommendations than WHF as they appear to take matters at least half seriously.

Hello again.
Here's a late reply to your posting: I've recently discovered the Hana SH and I agree that is a tempting cartridge. So is also some of Nagaoka's models, which implements the "moving iron" technique -- same as the Goldring 2500 -- which means a lower mass than "moving magnet". Most of Nagaoka's styluses are eliptical though and I would prefer a microline stylus. I'll see what happens when it is time to replace the current stylus.

The disadvantage with the Hana SH is of course that it's not possible to replace the stylus, since it's a moving coil. (I've recently learned that there are companies which re-tip MC cartridges, but I'm pretty sure that would mean I'd had to send it abroad.)

 

[miksko]

I can now respond with some experiences from replacing the turntable cable.

I finally went for the Chord Shawline X with an angled DIN connector. I use the same cable model between my amplifier and loudspeakers and am very pleased with the way it opens up the sound. (If you have the budget for it, I would also recommend you try the Tellurium Q Ultra Black II, which is a brand I have very good experiences of.)

The new phono cable changed the sound stage, so I had to move one of the loudspeakers a little. (The manufacturer had forwarned me about this as a common effect of new cables.) At first I found the sound to be a bit hard (particularly the trebble) but it became softer after some hours of playing.

The remaining differences are these:

• The trebble and bass have become more distinct and precise; also in the inner tracks.
• The mid- and high ranges have become more "delicate".
• Less rumble and noice from scratches.

 

[good_enough]

Hello again.
Here's a late reply to your posting: I've recently discovered the Hana SH and I agree that is a tempting cartridge. So is also some of Nagaoka's models, which implements the "moving iron" technique -- same as the Goldring 2500 -- which means a lower mass than "moving magnet". Most of Nagaoka's styluses are eliptical though and I would prefer a microline stylus. I'll see what happens when it is time to replace the current stylus.

The disadvantage with the Hana SH is of course that it's not possible to replace the stylus, since it's a moving coil. (I've recently learned that there are companies which re-tip MC cartridges, but I'm pretty sure that would mean I'd had to send it abroad.)

As i have commented on another thread, Hana do a new for old trade in. When you look at the percentage of the purchase price that you have to spend on a new stylus for a MM, the difference compared to the Hana trade in is not worth worrying about.

At the moment there's a bet to be made that a SH purchase might get you a N4O on the mk2 when yours eventually gives up the ghost, which may be neat as the SH 2 shares its suspension with the MH and ML and early reports are that it's an upgrade (the Hana scheme doesn't allow a trade in for an upgrade).

 

[good_enough]

As i have commented on another thread, Hana do a new for old trade in. When you look at the percentage of the purchase price that you have to spend on a new stylus for a MM, the difference compared to the Hana trade in is not worth worrying about.

At the moment there's a bet to be made that a SH purchase might get you a N4O on the mk2 when yours eventually gives up the ghost, which may be neat as the SH 2 shares its suspension with the MH and ML and early reports are that it's an upgrade (the Hana scheme doesn't allow a trade in for an upgrade).

BTW wrote this while listening to an old favourite, Tortelier's Bach suites. It would be incorrect to say it sounded 'in the room'. Rather, I closed my eyes and was in the room it was recorded in. Slightest of overhangs said it was small. Think chapel rather than cathedral, with a full audience, and I was about five rows back. (Yes it probably was a well damped studio, but i can dream.) The Hana can still evoke astonishment at the detail and imaging, and I recommend it wholeheartedly.

 

[miksko]

As i have commented on another thread, Hana do a new for old trade in. When you look at the percentage of the purchase price that you have to spend on a new stylus for a MM, the difference compared to the Hana trade in is not worth worrying about.

At the moment there's a bet to be made that a SH purchase might get you a N4O on the mk2 when yours eventually gives up the ghost, which may be neat as the SH 2 shares its suspension with the MH and ML and early reports are that it's an upgrade (the Hana scheme doesn't allow a trade in for an upgrade).

I did find English sites with information about trad ins but none in Swedish. I will try to visit my dealer tomorrow and ask how they handle that part in general. (That would also give me an opportunity to compare a Hama cartridge with a Nagaoka.)

I have to admit I'm more interested in the Hama MH though, since it comes with a microline stylus. That will however also make the trade in more expensive. On the other hand the stylus for the Goldring 2500 is quite expensive as well (~ £500).

 

[Gray]

....the stylus for the Goldring 2500 is quite expensive as well (~ £500).

'quite' expensive 🤔🤨🙂
By any standards, £500 for a stylus is extremely expensive.

(PS I know you can pay more, but two wrongs don't make a right).

 

[Al ears]

'quite' expensive 🤔🤨🙂
By any standards, £500 for a stylus is extremely expensive.

(PS I know you can pay more, but two wrongs don't make a right).

Replacement stylus can be had for around £250, not sure where the £500 comes from.
However, the complete cartridge is £595
Its all relative though as if he goes for the Hana MH he has all the disadvantages of a moving coil and no real benefits.
Damage the cantilever on that and it's probably going to cost more than £250 to get repaired......
That and the fact the Goldring is a moving magnet and not moving iron, as he states, I figure he needs to do a bit more research....

 

[Integralista]

Nope - some are condition immaterial, including Hana's, and some don't care if you are the second owner. Google is your friend.

TL;DR:

Yup, on an MC you replace the whole cart not just the stylus. Whether this is a material difference depends on whether the MC brand you buy supports 'new for old' trade-in, cos the cost of a MM stylus is high. It's not material for a Hana.

Hi, which turntable do you use? This is much more important info than discussion if MM or MC cartridge. So which turntable and which arm? Both technologies MM or MC are today capable of very good sound. For me, cartridge with replacable stylus will never sound so good as when made in one piece. MM like Nagaoka 500 or Rega ND07 are fully comparable in sound quality with MC carts up to 800-1000 Eur. But you need MC phonopreamp which is costly. Yes Hana is very good brand with orientation on high value, high quality and still good prices. But they are quite heavy, not optimal for each turntable arm. And remark: cartridges like Nagaoka 500 have big fanfactor and even switch to a good MC cart is some pain in first days. Than you get used to MC soundsignature. The best is to use two turntables or two arms on one TT with both technologies. I will order new Rega ND 07 for my old upgraded Planar 25. BR

 

[Al ears]

Hi, which turntable do you use? This is much more important info than discussion if MM or MC cartridge. So which turntable and which arm? Both technologies MM or MC are today capable of very good sound. For me, cartridge with replacable stylus will never sound so good as when made in one piece. MM like Nagaoka 500 or Rega ND07 are fully comparable in sound quality with MC carts up to 800-1000 Eur. But you need MC phonopreamp which is costly. Yes Hana is very good brand with orientation on high value, high quality and still good prices. But they are quite heavy, not optimal for each turntable arm. And remark: cartridges like Nagaoka 500 have big fanfactor and even switch to a good MC cart is some pain in first days. Than you get used to MC soundsignature. The best is to use two turntables or two arms on one TT with both technologies. I will order new Rega ND 07 for my old upgraded Planar 25. BR

The Hana MH he is talking about will not require a separate phono preamp.

 

[Integralista]

The Hana MH he is talking about will not require a separate phono preamp.

Depending on sound quality, he wish to get. Low budget, less fun.

 

[good_enough]

Depending on sound quality, he wish to get. Low budget, less fun.

I was delighted by the phono stage in my roksan K2 and am even more delighted by that in my K3. As @AI ears points out, the 'H' carts are made for standard MM phono stages.

 

[Integralista]

I was delighted by the phono stage in my roksan K2 and am even more delighted by that in my K3. As @AI ears points out, the 'H' carts are made for standard MM phono stages.

Hi, nothing against your amp. Roksan K3 is very good powerhouse. I believe also phono in this amp is quite good as roksan is still regarded as turntable specialist. But cartridge for 1000 eur(!) is truly special. This is not a basic cartridge. I recommend to try (just try) some really good phonostage. Price range around 1000-1400 Eur when new. You will hear a Big difference. But it is your money, so your choice.

 

[miksko]

Replacement stylus can be had for around £250, not sure where the £500 comes from.
However, the complete cartridge is £595
Its all relative though as if he goes for the Hana MH he has all the disadvantages of a moving coil and no real benefits.
Damage the cantilever on that and it's probably going to cost more than £250 to get repaired......
That and the fact the Goldring is a moving magnet and not moving iron, as he states, I figure he needs to do a bit more research....

In general, I try to avoid buying from Great Britain. Since the country is now outside of the EU, the Swedish customs will add 25% VAT and fees. I used the wrong exchange rate though. Buying the stylus from the two sites below -- the first in the Netherlands, the second one in Germany -- costs €480:

• https://www.eltim.eu/en/phono-repla...g-styli/goldring-2500-stylus/a-23255-20001070
• https://www.thakker.eu/en/needles/goldring-gl-2500-stylus-for-g-2500-genuine-stylus/a-5844/

As you can see in on the Goldring site (https://support.goldring.co.uk/portal/en/kb/articles/2000-series-differences-at-a-glance), the stylus is a Line Contact Shibata diamond. A replacement stylus for Ortofon 2M Black, which is a naked Shibata, costs about £30 less but is still in the same price range. Logical, since it's the exlusive tip and cutting you pay for.

By the way, the same table presents the cartridge as Moving Permalloy, which is another name for Moving Iron. I've learnt that the Goldring 2000 series was actually produced by Nagaoka, which has it's own series of MP/MI cartridges, which I will also have a look into.

Anyways, £250 is still such a good price that it compensates for added VAT and customs, so please send me a link to that site.

 

[Al ears]

In general, I try to avoid buying from Great Britain. Since the country is now outside of the EU, the Swedish customs will add 25% VAT and fees. I used the wrong exchange rate though. Buying the stylus from the two sites below -- the first in the Netherlands, the second one in Germany -- costs €480:

• https://www.eltim.eu/en/phono-repla...g-styli/goldring-2500-stylus/a-23255-20001070
• https://www.thakker.eu/en/needles/goldring-gl-2500-stylus-for-g-2500-genuine-stylus/a-5844/

As you can see in on the Goldring site (https://support.goldring.co.uk/portal/en/kb/articles/2000-series-differences-at-a-glance), the stylus is a Line Contact Shibata diamond. A replacement stylus for Ortofon 2M Black, which is a naked Shibata, costs about £30 less but is still in the same price range. Logical, since it's the exlusive tip and cutting you pay for.

By the way, the same table presents the cartridge as Moving Permalloy, which is another name for Moving Iron. I've learnt that the Goldring 2000 series was actually produced by Nagaoka, which has it's own series of MP/MI cartridges, which I will also have a look into.

Anyways, £250 is still such a good price that it compensates for added VAT and customs, so please send me a link to that site.

Unfortunately £250 is for the stylus only not the whole cartridge.

 

[miksko]

Unfortunately £250 is for the stylus only not the whole cartridge.

I know. I'm only looking for the stylus.

 

[Al ears]

I know. I'm only looking for the stylus.

I see.
Unfortunately the site I saw it on is now showing "Out of Stock" .
Wonder if the stylus for a 2400 would fit.
There is always this :-

2400 Moving Magnet Cartridge

All Goldring 2000 series cartridges feature Moving Iron technology. This lends them the high levels of detail associated with more expensive moving coil designs whilst retaining the convenience of a replaceable stylus and high output associated with moving magnet types. The cartridge employs a...

www.turntableworld.co.uk

 

[good_enough]

Hi, nothing against your amp. Roksan K3 is very good powerhouse. I believe also phono in this amp is quite good as roksan is still regarded as turntable specialist. But cartridge for 1000 eur(!) is truly special. This is not a basic cartridge. I recommend to try (just try) some really good phonostage. Price range around 1000-1400 Eur when new. You will hear a Big difference. But it is your money, so your choice.

As said I'm delighted by the sound I'm getting. Take note of my handle 'good-enough'.

For the phono stage, Stereophile said the K2 'rocks with vinyl' and has the 'best phono stage ever heard in a budget integrated' and to my ears the K3's is even better, though that might be the better overall performance of the amp, which has noticeably more 'grip' in the lower registers. (Think texture of a 'cello in a string quartet.)

Like you said it's my money and I'll spend it on the music! HNY.

 

[good_enough]

I did find English sites with information about trad ins but none in Swedish. I will try to visit my dealer tomorrow and ask how they handle that part in general. (That would also give me an opportunity to compare a Hama cartridge with a Nagaoka.)

I have to admit I'm more interested in the Hama MH though, since it comes with a microline stylus. That will however also make the trade in more expensive. On the other hand the stylus for the Goldring 2500 is quite expensive as well (~ £500).

I'd love it if I could use my SH as a trade in for an MH when the time comes but as said it's only like-for-like.

I wish you luck (and a Happy New Year). I am a 100% Hana convert based on my experience!