What is your nemesis,the thing your always upgrading to find the perfect match

[gasolin]

I have used 4 different amps the past year, my Nad C316BBE is my 4th amp (love it, neutral top and lot's of power) have used different speaker cable from supra, thin and thicker version of the classic and ply 3.4, now double van den hul clearwater (4x4meter).

It seen to me my hifi problem,nemesi or what ever you would call it is speaker cable and bass.

So someone who wrote that he upgraded to Kimber 8PR over double van den hul clearwater, naturally like the hifi nerd i am i had to google kimber 8PR (out of my budget)

Heres what he wrote (using google translate to make it faster to translate): clearwater seems stuffy in the treble and swollen in the bass. There are no details in the bass with the cable, it all sounds the same in the bass, with Kimber there are many songs that I've been thinking sounds bass like that? I have never noticed that with the clearwater. Treble seems a lot more rough and without details, where with Kimber is soft and nice and with a lot of detail. The midrange, I have never had the great focus on before, I've got now to secure all the information that comes out of the midrange, especially a drum when it strikes, it sounds delicious.

I never have had a bloted,swollen bass,infact i wouldn't mind a firmer tighter bass and a clearer more open top without sounding bright and fattigue (and thin) i like the neutral top that isn't intrusive/agressive, the eq,tone controls are pretty good on the nad, treble at 0db ist very neutral and not intrusive,at max the sound gets brighter but in a suttle way where it's not agressive, bass get's enhanced or decreased at 50hz not 100hz like many amps do and therefore could sound a bit midbass heavy when using eq/tone controls (don't use tone controls)

(Theres just some people who noticed a huge difference only by upgrading to a different speaker cable,interconnects or mabye amp, personally i like my speakers so i wouldn't change that and i think it would be much more expensive to upgrade to something better, mabye klipsch reference bookshelf speakers)

If i where to try a different speaker cable since i how have the urge to, is there any low budget you would recommend me to look for budget 5£,7€ each meter (i need 2x4 meter), know most of you would say van damm or just some cheap cable like monoprice, is it because abby road studios use van damme or? cheap cables like monoprice because you can't hear any difference so why spent alot of money or beacuse of this http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/the-best-speaker-cable/

Whathifi say clearwater is the best under 10£ http://www.whathifi.com/best-buys/best-speaker-cables but you know we music lovers always want to try to find something different for our system, one cable might be good for one system but not as good with another sytem

Last question, what is you nemsis, the thing you always are upgrading, where you can't find what is perfect for your needs and where you use it and stop thinking about upgrading ?

 

[MeanandGreen]

It's always been the frequency extremes that have been the hardest to get right in my experience. It's always been down to the transducers rather than the electronics too.

When I first started out with hi fi back in the 90's I had a distinct lack of bass and a harsh treble. The biggest improvement overall was when I changed speakers I gained the bass which was supposed to be there and lost the harshness. However over time I felt that the sound was too warm and dull, another speaker swap later down the line fixed the dull treble without being harsh and I retained the bass weight. Yes I swapped electronics too, but I found the changes there to be subtle in comparison. Speakers by far made the biggest change.

Moving house a few times has always caused problems with bass responce. Either too much or too little, the amount of faffing with positioning is unreal when I move my kit somewhere new. When I moved home 2 years ago, again a speaker change was required along with the addition of active sub. Just to get the bass balanced throughout the living area. Overall I'm happy with the sound but I think the treble could be more well extended, however I only feel that when comparing to my Beyer DT 770 headphones. (Headphones are another regularly swapped item during my time with hi fi again due to bass & treble imbalances.) Maybe I like a v shaped sound?

I don't change electronics often. Same digital sources for 16 years and my old NAD amp only got replaced with a new NAD amp when it blew up. That old NAD has since been fixed by myself and is now in another room at the heart of a second system. I've been trough more speakers and headphones than anything else. They definitely change more than amps and digital sources IMO. Though I do very much love NAD amplification and the amplifier/speaker relationship is important.

Overall I'm really happy with what I now have I find it detailed and accurate enough to distinguish recording quality without making poor recordings sound unlistenable. I could upgrade speakers again as I think they are the weakest link, but I would need to spend at least £1000 this time and I don't think the cost is worth what I'd gain. I actually think some/most of my music collection would sound worse if I went down that path. Plus my living room is just that, a living room not a studio.

I think what you are doing is falling into the trap of over analysing and thinking about what your system is doing and which part is responsible for this and that. The biggest influence on your system is the speakers and room relationship. Swapping cables does naff all for tightening bass or increasing treble detail etc... I've had many different cables with different sources, amps and speakers and a good cable is a good cable. They are audibly transparent unles they are unfit for purpose or faulty.

If you want tighter bass I suggest experimenting with your speakers positioning or support. Failing that I think a speaker change could be the best option, you've already swapped amplifiers a few times now. Swapping cables about is going to cost money and do very little/nothing.

A good pair of headphones really helps you to hear how good your kit is at dissecting recordings and digging up the details. Listening room acoustics account for so much of the coloration we hear with our hi fi systems which aren't fixed with electronics swapping and cable swapping.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

I have used 4 different amps the past year, my Nad C316BBE is my 4th amp (love it, neutral top and lot's of power) have used different speaker cable from supra, thin and thicker version of the classic and ply 3.4, now double van den hul clearwater (4x4meter).

It seen to me my hifi problem,nemesi or what ever you would call it is speaker cable and bass.

So someone who wrote that he upgraded to Kimber 8PR over double van den hul clearwater, naturally like the hifi nerd i am i had to google kimber 8PR (out of my budget)

Heres what he wrote (using google translate to make it faster to translate): clearwater seems stuffy in the treble and swollen in the bass. There are no details in the bass with the cable, it all sounds the same in the bass, with Kimber there are many songs that I've been thinking sounds bass like that? I have never noticed that with the clearwater. Treble seems a lot more rough and without details, where with Kimber is soft and nice and with a lot of detail. The midrange, I have never had the great focus on before, I've got now to secure all the information that comes out of the midrange, especially a drum when it strikes, it sounds delicious.

I never have had a bloted,swollen bass,infact i wouldn't mind a firmer tighter bass and a clearer more open top without sounding bright and fattigue (and thin) i like the neutral top that isn't intrusive/agressive, the eq,tone controls are pretty good on the nad, treble at 0db ist very neutral and not intrusive,at max the sound gets brighter but in a suttle way where it's not agressive, bass get's enhanced or decreased at 50hz not 100hz like many amps do and therefore could sound a bit midbass heavy when using eq/tone controls (don't use tone controls)

(Theres just some people who noticed a huge difference only by upgrading to a different speaker cable,interconnects or mabye amp, personally i like my speakers so i wouldn't change that and i think it would be much more expensive to upgrade to something better, mabye klipsch reference bookshelf speakers)

If i where to try a different speaker cable since i how have the urge to, is there any low budget you would recommend me to look for budget 5£,7€ each meter (i need 2x4 meter), know most of you would say van damm or just some cheap cable like monoprice, is it because abby road studios use van damme or? cheap cables like monoprice because you can't hear any difference so why spent alot of money or beacuse of this http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/the-best-speaker-cable/

Whathifi say clearwater is the best under 10£ http://www.whathifi.com/best-buys/best-speaker-cables but you know we music lovers always want to try to find something different for our system, one cable might be good for one system but not as good with another sytem

Last question, what is you nemsis, the thing you always are upgrading, where you can't find what is perfect for your needs and where you use it and stop thinking about upgrading ?

what you need to do is stop mucking around with cables and budget stuff and save money and buy the best amp you can afford then buy some really good speakers then you will be happy cables are not going to change much as your never going to be happy your trying to make something out of nothing the money your spent on 4 amps this year you could of got your self a top amp and a good set of speakers ( that is good advice take it or leave it ) trust me I have been there and I am just trying to help you

 

[ID.]

First system was a bit bright and lacked upper bass fullness.

Next system it was a lack of liveliness but mainly issues with the room and bass.

Overall I crave detail. That feeling of hearing something new that wasn't apparent before.

Currently ive hit on an ideal balance. Even throughout the frequency spectrum plus revealing enough that can hear all the production tricks for what they are.

Except for perhaps playing around with 2nd hand kit if I had the room (battleship build older Japanese amps call to me) I can't see myself upgrading to anything other than better active monitors. Seeking what have now but MORE.

 

[MajorFubar]

Speakers. Though I think I've made far more sideways moves than upgrades. In the late 1980s, while in my late teens still living at home as an impoverished student, I saved some pennies and bought my first proper HFi speakers from Comet: mkII Wharfedale Diamonds. For years I was happy as a pig in sh*t with them, but then one day I found some money and I decided to trade them in. Shouldn't be too difficult buying a better pair of speakers than mkII Diamonds, right? And that was the start.

Naturally I auditioned every pair I bought, and I was always happy at the time of purchase, yet I often quickly got bored of a sound which just didn't involve me as much as I'd like, or as much as the old Diamonds. Must've bought 8-10 pairs over 20+ years before circumstances led me to my current pair of EB2s. Now I'm back to being as happy as a pig in sh*t again, and I'm confident they're going to stay right there on my speaker stands unless I get flush one day and I can afford to throw at least double their price at something different.

 

[steve_1979]

... Last question, what is you nemsis, the thing you always are upgrading, where you can't find what is perfect for your needs and where you use it and stop thinking about upgrading ?

Getting the sound right was the easy part for me. The bit that I struggled with was the user interface.

Depending on what I'm listening to (music, movies or games) I like to change the subwoofer volume quite regularly. As I use active speakers I need a DAC and pre-amp that has easy subwoofer adjustment built in. That's much harder to find than it sounds.

I started off using a Yamaha RX-V667 receiver as a DAC and pre-amp which was OK but you need to switch on the OSD to reach some of the settings which was a PITA. It also had far more functions than I needed which overcomplicated the usability aspect of it. Not only that but it used quite a lot of electricity and got warm even though I wasn't using the power amps in it.

Next I just used the built in DAC and pre-amp on my DM10 speakers. That was much simpler to use but I missed having a display and easily accessible subwoofer settings.

Then I tried the Nakamichi AV1 processor. That almost did the job but it has some software bugs. The only major one that I experienced was that the subwoofer would occasionally stop working for no apparent reason even though it was still turned on in the settings. After reading the two long standing Nakamichi AV1 threads on the AVForum there was a seemingly endless stream of issues with them and I never quite felt it could be relied on to keep working. Luckily I was able to sell it for what I paid for it.

Then I looked at the Marantz NR1504 receiver. This seemed like it would be a good solution. The build quality is a bit cheap but not enough to worry about.

But then... Finally... I struck gold! I bought a 15 year old Yamaha DSP-E800 off eBay. It's perfect. Good build quality. Super simple user interface which is all controlled via the display on the front of the unit with no need for a OSD. It doesn't have loads of unnecessary features (for my audio only requirements) like modern receivers all do which simpilfys things even further. The DAC and pre-amp section is audiably transparent so it doesn't effect the sound quality. It has a dynamic range compressor which comes in handy when watching movies and it's energy efficient enough to stay cool even after hours of use.

After all that time searching I've finally found exactly what I wanted and it was only £8 off ebay too. It's perfect!

 

[keeper of the quays]

I always thought speakers made the biggest difference..it seems my preloved pre amp has changed my view..its actually a home theatre processor which i use in two channel..lol..every input has co ax, optical and rca...it has a very high quality dac...i cant praise it enough and cheap as chips secondhand! I gave £160..best bit of hifi i have ever bought..so for me the pre amp made all the difference..

 

[NSA_watch_my_toilet]

Gasolin, I have probably the answer to your nemesis. Accoustic foam instead of cables. Basstraps when it needs. Some difffraction sometimes. Room, placement and speakers are the key component in a sound chain. Small improvements in that are delivering tons of potential.