vinyl vs cd.....

admin_exported

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I keep hearing that a good quality record player will beat an equally priced cd player for performence in every respect, these are bold statements! As an example would an arcam cd73 out perform a project rpm.5, both units are around 400 each or is it a matter of taste? Im going to dip my toe into the world of vinyl and buy a project genie as a starting point, I Like the idea of hunting round second hand record stores for those old black disc's, How many of you use turntables? and how does the sound differ from cd?
 

fatboyslimfast

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I love both, and find that decent vinyl just sounds more "real" - it's hard to justify this, but to me it does.

However, there is a huge difference in sound quality between a brand new LP and a well-worn one. A CD will easily outperform a worn (not necessarily scratched) LP.

If you are looking at the 2nd hand market for vinyl, then I would stay this side of £200 for a player, as even a mint-looking LP can sound awful if it was played with a damaged stylus at some point in it's life.

FWIW, I have a mid-range turntable in my main system, which I generally use for my own collection and new purchases (the Beatles Love album on 180g vinyl sounds sublime), but keep the car-boot / flea market purchases for my 25-yr old Dual 505/2 in the dining room, as the Roksan shows up the imperfections too much. But it is a great way to discover new music, on a shoestring budget.

I hope I'm not waffling too much here. Basically, go for it, but if second-hand vinyl is your preference, then stick to a low-budget turntable.
 
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Anonymous

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I found some old LP's , 80's stuff, in the loft a couple of weeks ago so I bought a second hand project debut. The LP's needed a serious clean as they have not been seen for 20 years!

I thought that my CD's would sound a class above but no, vinyl sounds great.
 
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Anonymous

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i can only say that i can't hear any difference between my project debut 3 and nad pp2(approx £180 all in) phono stage against the nad c542 cd player (£330).

I've not had the inclination to test the project against my new naim cd5i yet
 
fatboyslimfast:I love both, and find that decent vinyl just sounds more "real" - it's hard to justify this, but to me it does.

However, there is a huge difference in sound quality between a brand new LP and a well-worn one. A CD will easily outperform a worn (not necessarily scratched) LP.

If you are looking at the 2nd hand market for vinyl, then I would stay this side of £200 for a player, as even a mint-looking LP can sound awful if it was played with a damaged stylus at some point in it's life.

FWIW, I have a mid-range turntable in my main system, which I generally use for my own collection and new purchases (the Beatles Love album on 180g vinyl sounds sublime), but keep the car-boot / flea market purchases for my 25-yr old Dual 505/2 in the dining room, as the Roksan shows up the imperfections too much. But it is a great way to discover new music, on a shoestring budget.

I hope I'm not waffling too much here. Basically, go for it, but if second-hand vinyl is your preference, then stick to a low-budget turntable.

It's a bit of a toughie. yes, a turntable has more soul and sounds more believable. However, for modern recordings i.e. recordings made since the early 90's then cd's are better. Prior to that I prefer, in the main, vinyl. That is because earlier cd's tend to be digitally remastered and that means compressing the sound = too clinical or clean.

JD is the man in the know.
 
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Anonymous

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I will be buying new records as well as old ones, would it be worth starting with the genie or going for the project rpm 5? would there be much difference?
 

John Duncan

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plastic penguin:JD is the man in the know.

I wouldn't say that. I have an opinion - though as everybody knows, they're like ****holes - everybody has one, and they're usually full of ****.

There is a discussion here which contains some white noise but will hopefully be helpful. I think my view can be summarised as "it depends", but (as always), with the corollary "you must have a Knosti Disco Antistat or don't bother".
 
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Anonymous

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plastic penguin:
JD is the man in the know.somewhere on here there is a post by JD saying he can't hear a difference (or something very similar)
emotion-3.gif
 

John Duncan

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jimm:I will be buying new records as well as old ones, would it be worth starting with the genie or going for the project rpm 5? would there be much difference?

There is a difference, yes - stability, bass control, surface noise and general transparency for starters. Be wary of spending a lot on new vinyl though, I've found it expensive and largely pointless (though primarily because I'm lazy).
 

fr0g

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Even if vinyl were superior, which I don't believe... As soon as I hear that innevitable crackle...AGGGH!

I don't like vinyl...at all. I was so happy when I finally got a CD player.
Less getting out of my comfy seat to change the music thats now stopped.
Less fretting about getting scratches.
...And now with squeezebox I can replace 'Less' for 'Zero' Ahhhhhhhhhhh relax and listen to music...

My smallish LP and single collection is now slightly warped...;)P (

Oh and I used to stack singles!
 
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Anonymous

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Pros and cons to both obviously. Most people (?) will find the sound of good quality vinyl on a good quality system more appealing than an equivalently priced CD player. However...

* Some degree of surface noise (i.e. little crackles etc) is almost inevitable, and some people find this very off-putting.
* Vinyl takes more looking after than CDs, and is more susceptible to damage.
* A piece of diamond scratching along a piece of plastic? It should be obvious than vinyl sound quality degrades with heavy / long term use.
* It's quite easy to get so obsessed with getting your turntable set up "just so" that you forget to enjoy your music.
* New vinyl, when you can find it, is usually more expensive than the equivalent CD release.

On the other hand...
* Flicking through the racks at a second hand record shop / charity shop and turning up that mint copy of an album that you've been after for years is one of life's great pleasures.
* There's something about big pieces of black plastic spinning under a needle and kicking out analogue signals which has an allure that CDs can't quite muster.
* Records are just sexier.

Personally I've never got my head round music reproduction, and suspect it's all some kind of magic rather than science. The idea that you can get music reproduction from black plastic and needles is just as ridiculous as the idea that you can get it from a laser reading a reflective disk spinning at crazy speeds. I suspect there are actually tiny multi-instrumentalists living in my speakers.
 
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Anonymous

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Like has been say already it is silly to buy new vinyl like an album in the hit parade.

Any album from past 20yr+ is probably made all digital. Putting to vinyl just adds colour.

I compare recent band Bloc Party Cd and vinyl. CD is much better. However, old analogue jazz LPs 50yrs+ sound nice and enjoyable.

Vinyl can be the fun to use but man who say it is better is nostalgic and silly. Well for modern recording that are digital anyway.

I hope I explain rightly. My English is basic. Cannot be use technical reason in English.

Santino
 

John Duncan

Well-known member
santino.b.it:
Like has been say already it is silly to buy new vinyl like an album in the hit parade.

Any album from past 20yr+ is probably made all digital. Putting to vinyl just adds colour.

I compare recent band Bloc Party Cd and vinyl. CD is much better. However, old analogue jazz LPs 50yrs+ sound nice and enjoyable.

Vinyl can be the fun to use but man who say it is better is nostalgic and silly. Well for modern recording that are digital anyway.

I hope I explain rightly. My English is basic. Cannot be use technical reason in English.

Santino

Perfect explanation, and pretty much what I think, with the added point that when I compare side-by-side, I don't really hear any of the supposed sonic advantages of vinyl, only disadvantages (surface noise, warps etc).

Cost and availability are a different matter.
 

Anton90125

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jimm:I keep hearing that a good quality record player will beat an equally priced cd player for performence in every respect, these are bold statements! As an example would an arcam cd73 out perform a project rpm.5, both units are around 400 each or is it a matter of taste? Im going to dip my toe into the world of vinyl and buy a project genie as a starting point, I Like the idea of hunting round second hand record stores for those old black disc's, How many of you use turntables? and how does the sound differ from cd?

I have heard LPs and CDs. On every occasion I preferred the LP. LPs have depth,ambiance and smoothness that CD's lack. CDs are convenient,last much longer,have a better bass,but also suffer from a "trebleness" that seems to be less natural.They also sound flat in comparison to LPs.

The fact that SACDs sound closer to LPs (and better then CD) is proof enough for me.
 

Pike900fish

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Just wanted to add my two penneth!!

IMO you cant say vinyl is better than cd or vice versa...I'd say it's just different. It's like hifi full stop, the difference is subjective. The thing I like most about vinyl is the ritual of playing a LP. The selecting the album, the carefull removing of the record from the sleeve, the deft like positioning of the stylus over the selected track, etc...etc. Sad I know but before the advent of CD it's all we had..well...apart from cassette tapes for convenience but that's another story!
 
As I mentioned before, vinyl is not better with certain styles and the same applies to cd's.

For example, if you listen to the Simon & Garfunkel difinitive box set and compare the record with the cd - you would certainly hear a difference (scratches aside). There are many examples I could quote, this would take too long (and boring).

Other styles are Punk, Prog rock or anything up to late 80's/early 90's and vinyl certainly has the edge.
 

Lost Angeles

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Fetched all the wife.s DVDs off the lid of me Rega Planar 3lturntable the other night and played Dire Straits Brothers in Arms album side 2, track 1 Ride across the water. I thought the bass guitar was better than I'd heard before so I dug the CD out and put on the old CD player and the album was definitely better. The bass was tighter and the whole sound was better separated and wider.

I then compared a load more stuff and the CD was generally better although the vinyl sound was warmer. The only other vinyl track that was better again was Dire Straits

Skateaway from Makin Movies and this time is was mainly the bass drum.

Dark Side of the moon 20th anniversary CD definitely blew my original vinyl copy away.

Where vinyl is way better than CD is with the sleeve.

A 12in square LP sleeve is more interesting than a 5in CD sleeve and on albums like
Zep 3 where the centre turns you can spend ages looking at it, + the artwork on Allmans Bros Eat a Peach is more interesting in 12 inch
 

evo6tme

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Hi just to add my two penies worth, i last week recieved a new copy of goldfrapp supernature which i have been listening to on a gyrodeck se. also ive been comparing the same album on cd played on a rega apollo.

And i am suprised to say (considering its a newish record,and digitally recorded) it souds so mutch better on lp. The music is just more alive and real, with no scratchess yet to detract from it ..
 
T

the record spot

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Vinyl - an excellent medium with a superb playback fidelity that leaves many with their jaws scraping the ground at times.

The old jokes about scratched, clicks pops and crackles are fair enough, but look after vinyl well (and we're not talking regimented climate controlled systems here) and it will easily last decades. I note with interest some of my older CDs are degrading over time and some no longer play (Crash Test Dummies debut for one), so the problem isn't unique to vinyl!

Capable of stunning results, it's also not a "safe" or "warm" listening experience (but can be if that's your thing). My own set-up (listed below) is a bright, detailed and analytical sounding deck/cartridge combination and - about as far away from safe as you could get.

CD - capable of excellence, but falls down in both compression and brickwalling at times depending on the release and the mastering. The packaging is poor compared to vinyl which has had some stunning examples of great sleeves - anyone owning a copy of Gilmour's "On An Island" will know exactly what I mean. The CD has the booklet. Anyone with a download won't have a clue what they're missing!

I'm very happy with my Linn though - it's from 1994, plays a blinder and has a big rich sound with plenty of detail. Bought used just over a year ago, it's been money well spent.

Downloads - convenient. Needs software. Supposed to be excellent, but more faff than I can bothered with. Linn offer studio quality masters which is a big step in the right direction, other than that, it's great for reducing music to a commodity.
 

fr0g

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the record spot:
CD - capable of excellence, but falls down in both compression and brickwalling at times depending on the release and the mastering.

An arguement often used, unfairly... Yes many CDs sound crappy, but before I ditched my turntable, I had quute a few terribly over compressed records (esp 12 inch singles) ...far worse than on CD, especially given vinyls lower dynamic range potential.
 
T

the record spot

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I don't recall saying vinyl was perfect though...? Cherry pick my comments by all means, but credit the others that clearly acknowledge the various formats' shortcomings too.
 

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