Streaming over Ethernet testing

[admin_exported]

This month three readers decide which is the best way to connect your music streaming system: wireless, wired or powerline?

How can some people thing wireless or powerline ethernet is better than wired?

 

[roger06]

How can some people thing wireless or powerline ethernet is better than wired?

Surely that's the point of the test?

 

[roger06]

I'd have thought the homeplugs would make noise on the mains?

 

[aliEnRIK]

Id put wired at the top (obviously), then homeplugs then wireless

of course wireless could be better than homeplugs if the internal wirings not to standard

 

[aliEnRIK]

I'd have thought the homeplugs would make noise on the mains?

Yes they do, but that wasnt really a part of the question

Wireless produces EMI whilst we're on it

 

[professorhat]

This month three readers decide which is the best way to connect your music streaming system: wireless, wired or powerline?

How can some people thing wireless or powerline ethernet is better than wired?

Indeed, the point of the Big Question is to leave aside things you "know" and just test what you hear. Having taken part in a recent one (which I won't go into for obvious reasons), the results can be surprising or can confirm what you thought you knew. The beauty is you don't have a clue until everything is revealed!

 

[Anonymous]

I'd have thought the homeplugs would make noise on the mains?

Yes they do, but that wasnt really a part of the question

Wireless produces EMI whilst we're on it

Of course. But that EMI is there regardless of whether you're using it to transmit digital audio. Think cellphones, your (neighbour's) wifi network...

Purposefully injecting noise into your mains is a different beast altogether. It would be really interesting to see if the (theoretical) mains degradation has an impact on the amplifier (barring the use of mains conditioning, of course -- that would be cheating).

 

[aliEnRIK]

Purposefully injecting noise into your mains is a different beast altogether. It would be really interesting to see if the (theoretical) mains degradation has an impact on the amplifier (barring the use of mains conditioning, of course -- that would be cheating).

The effect of injecting RFI into an amp has been 'measured' to raise the 'noise floor' of an amp.

Many people dont believe this to be true so im happy for people to make their own minds up

The fact I use a balanced mains transformer AND a mains conditioner to virtually eradicate RFI on the mains should tell you which camp im in.

 

[Anonymous]

So what's the technical explanation for someone saying streaming via Ethernet via homeplugs (and obviously some Ethernet cables) sounds better?

 

[professorhat]

So what's the technical explanation for someone saying streaming via Ethernet via homeplugs (and obviously some Ethernet cables) sounds better?

Sound waves are created from the speakers connected to an amplifier, which is connected into three systems - one where music is streamed via ethernet cables, another where music is streamed via homeplugs and a final one where music is streamed wirelessly. Once any of these sound waves hit the eardrum, it vibrates and causes a chain reaction resulting in these vibrations being passed along the cochlea. Here, there are thousands of cilia (which are hair like nerve endings) and as the vibrations occur, these move. The brain interprets these movements as sound. Things get a bit fuzzy from here on in I'm afraid, but the best way I can put it is that when some brains "hear" the sound produced by the music streamed via homeplugs or music streamed wirelessly, this results in greater satisfaction than that produced by the music streamed via ethernet. The opposite is also true for some other brains.

Hope this helps.

 

[John Duncan]

Or to put it more succinctly, they didn't know what they were listening to (except that the systems were 'different'), so just said what sounded best. If I recall, all three came up with a different answer, thus proving that theory isn't everything...

 

[roger06]

So what's the technical explanation for someone saying streaming via Ethernet via homeplugs (and obviously some Ethernet cables) sounds better?

Sound waves are created from the speakers connected to an amplifier, which is connected into three systems - one where music is streamed via ethernet cables, another where music is streamed via homeplugs and a final one where music is streamed wirelessly. Once any of these sound waves hit the eardrum, it vibrates and causes a chain reaction resulting in these vibrations being passed along the cochlea. Here, there are thousands of cilia (which are hair like nerve endings) and as the vibrations occur, these move. The brain interprets these movements as sound. Things get a bit fuzzy from here on in I'm afraid, but the best way I can put it is that when some brains "hear" the sound produced by the music streamed via homeplugs or music streamed wirelessly, this results in greater satisfaction than that produced by the music streamed via ethernet. The opposite is also true for some other brains.

Hope this helps.

Come on WHF, that post deserves a prize...

 

[roger06]

So what's the technical explanation for someone saying streaming via Ethernet via homeplugs (and obviously some Ethernet cables) sounds better?

Sound waves are created from the speakers connected to an amplifier, which is connected into three systems - one where music is streamed via ethernet cables, another where music is streamed via homeplugs and a final one where music is streamed wirelessly. Once any of these sound waves hit the eardrum, it vibrates and causes a chain reaction resulting in these vibrations being passed along the cochlea. Here, there are thousands of cilia (which are hair like nerve endings) and as the vibrations occur, these move. The brain interprets these movements as sound. Things get a bit fuzzy from here on in I'm afraid, but the best way I can put it is that when some brains "hear" the sound produced by the music streamed via homeplugs or music streamed wirelessly, this results in greater satisfaction than that produced by the music streamed via ethernet. The opposite is also true for some other brains.

Hope this helps.

Actually zero help!

But so beautifully written!

 

[Anonymous]

So what's the technical explanation for someone saying streaming via Ethernet via homeplugs (and obviously some Ethernet cables) sounds better?

Sound waves are created from the speakers connected to an amplifier, which is connected into three systems - one where music is streamed via ethernet cables, another where music is streamed via homeplugs and a final one where music is streamed wirelessly. Once any of these sound waves hit the eardrum, it vibrates and causes a chain reaction resulting in these vibrations being passed along the cochlea. Here, there are thousands of cilia (which are hair like nerve endings) and as the vibrations occur, these move. The brain interprets these movements as sound. Things get a bit fuzzy from here on in I'm afraid, but the best way I can put it is that when some brains "hear" the sound produced by the music streamed via homeplugs or music streamed wirelessly, this results in greater satisfaction than that produced by the music streamed via ethernet. The opposite is also true for some other brains.

Hope this helps.

Actually zero help!

 

[Ravey Gravey Davy]

Actually zero help!

Then that's precisely what you will get.(with that approach)

 

[Anonymous]

Actually zero help!

Then that's precisely what you will get.(with that approach)

What approach? I'm asking why a straight ethernet cable is considered to result in a data transfer that sounds a) different and b) worse to someone compared with a more complex path using homeplugs.

Ask a network person and they will tell you a simple cable is best. What are homeplugs doing to the data? Probably nothing, so what does this tell you about listening tests?

 

[Ravey Gravey Davy]

"Ask a network person and they will tell you a simple cable is best. What are homeplugs doing to the data? Probably nothing, so what does this tell you about listening tests?"

It tells me you are not listening.

 

[roger06]

I wonder if WHF will ever do the ultimate reader / listener test?

Use exactly the same system three times and see what views the listeners give... I'd be very interested in the result of that!

 

[Anonymous]

I wonder if WHF will ever do the ultimate reader / listener test?

Use exactly the same system three times and see what views the listeners give... I'd be very interested in the result of that!

it would be very interesting, especially if they told them that the three systems were using cables and interconnects of varying prices, and told them which was which before listening

 

[Craig M.]

I wonder if WHF will ever do the ultimate reader / listener test?

Use exactly the same system three times and see what views the listeners give... I'd be very interested in the result of that!

that would be interesting. there is evidence that suggests just thinking something has been changed means you hear a change.

 

[Anonymous]

Use exactly the same system three times and see what views the listeners give... I'd be very interested in the result of that!

that would be interesting. there is evidence that suggests just thinking something has been changed means you hear a change.

That evidence is known as the placebo effect

I know that real science has no place in this forum, but Roger's proposal is actually a very common scenario and is used to lend credibility to group test results. Basically, a scientific test without a control group is almost useless. See your sig

 

[aliEnRIK]

That evidence is known as the placebo effect

I know that real science has no place in this forum, but Roger's proposal is actually a very common scenario and is used to lend credibility to group test results. Basically, a scientific test without a control group is almost useless. See your sig

I disagree

I think that science should be a part of the forum. Placebos are a well known fact, and SHOULD be taken into account with these tests.

That said, the tests are more a 'bit of fun' than actual tests: no real deductions can ever be taken from them

 

[professorhat]

So what's the technical explanation for someone saying streaming via Ethernet via homeplugs (and obviously some Ethernet cables) sounds better?

Sound waves are created from the speakers connected to an amplifier, which is connected into three systems - one where music is streamed via ethernet cables, another where music is streamed via homeplugs and a final one where music is streamed wirelessly. Once any of these sound waves hit the eardrum, it vibrates and causes a chain reaction resulting in these vibrations being passed along the cochlea. Here, there are thousands of cilia (which are hair like nerve endings) and as the vibrations occur, these move. The brain interprets these movements as sound. Things get a bit fuzzy from here on in I'm afraid, but the best way I can put it is that when some brains "hear" the sound produced by the music streamed via homeplugs or music streamed wirelessly, this results in greater satisfaction than that produced by the music streamed via ethernet. The opposite is also true for some other brains.

Hope this helps.

Actually zero help!

It was meant to be fairly tongue in cheek given you were essentially asking why some people preferred one method of music transmission over another in a blind listening test. Which is much the same as asking why some people prefer Pepsi over Coke in a blind tasting test.

I just chose to answer your question literally as I was a bit bored and thought I'd show off my new found knowledge from watching Inside the Human Body

 

[Andrew Everard]

it would be very interesting

And of course entirely counterproductive when it comes to getting readers to volunteer in the future.

especially if they told them that the three systems were using cables and interconnects of varying prices, and told them which was which before listening

It's not about testing the participants.

 

[Anonymous]

Andrew - so what were you testing and how do you explain the differing results for what is an ethernet connection?

Have you done any tests to see the technical difference to the data after it has been through the 3 methods of transmission? Clearly no data is actually lost.

This suggests that it's not the source sound that is important, but what anything transmitting and reproducing it does.