Stereo amp advice needed to pair off with Q Acoustics 2050i

[danbeatles78]

Hi

Just bought set of Q Acoustics 2050i, currently using Yamaha Rxv673 av amp

Now, I was thinking of getting Marantz pm6004 as a few online shops put these together in their package deals

To confuse me more somebody posted online that the marantz struggles to drive the 2050i's

Would appreciate your thoughts please

 

[PAULCHRISTOPHER]

I have Marantz PM6004,CD6004,NA7004 and QA2050i's and IMHO they all work fine together. I use reasonably priced Van Damme 2.5 Sq MM section cables & I have 5 meters on each speaker. Retailers who bundle things together such as Peter Tyson know what they are doing .
They don't want loads of dissatisfied customers.

 

[Cypher]

You bought some great speakers there

The Marantz PM6004 has enough power for those, don't worry.

 

[audioaddict]

does that mean my cr 603 would drive these too if they are about the same power output

 

[PAULCHRISTOPHER]

does that mean my cr 603 would drive these too if they are about the same power output

As the 2050i's power range is 25 to 150 watts it should be OK but the only way to be sure is to demo the combination.

Has anybody on here got this combination?

 

[Cypher]

does that mean my cr 603 would drive these too if they are about the same power output

I owned the PM6004 and the M-CR603 also and believe me............the PM6004 is way more powerful.

 

[the record spot]

Have you tried bi-amping your 673 to the speakers yet? If you don't use a multichannel setup, one of the great benefits of AV amps, apart from the functionality they offer that traditional integrated amps don't, is the means to bi-amp using the additional onboard amps you have. Did it with my Onkyo and it made an appreciable difference. Personally, I would be hard pressed to go back to a traditional stereo amp, albeit I have no idea what the Yammy sounds like. Very happy with the Onkyo models I have tried (two so far, the 818 included) and performance is well up there. Give it a spin, you only need to buy another set of speaker cables and you're off. £20 or less from Maplins.

 

[davedotco]

I'm kind of old fashioned in that, for budget equipment, the idea of using speakers of the quality (and cost) of the 2050s with cheap mass market amplifiers simply does not work for me.

I appreciate that these are more expensive but in my view decent integrated amplifiers such as the Creek Evo 50 or the Croft Integrated would lift you into a completely different level. I know such views are not fashionable, but I think spending a bit more makes a huge difference at this level and I would not think twice if I was after the best SQ.

There also seems to be an issue with how well amplifiers can drive speakers, these days it is rare for an amplifier to get into real distress, but there is an issue with how well amplifiers can do under dynamic conditions, ie playing music.

Various factors are important here, one of the most obvious being power, not paper specifications, the the ability to play real music into real speakers. Just a glance at the amplifiers mentioned in this thread gives an idea, all rated around 50 watts but very different in terms of real power capabilities.

The MCR 610 for example has a power supply rated at just 55 watts, the PM6004 a more repectable 150 watts, but both the Creek and the Croft have power supplies rated at 350 watts. That is going to make quite a difference.

 

[ISAC69]

If you can sterch your budget the Roksan Kandy K2 will give better results . floorstanders are more demanding than standmounts in terms of power

I don't think the Marantz will fulfil the full potential of the Q Acoustics .

 

[davedotco]

If you can sterch your budget the Roksan Kandy K2 will give better results . floorstanders are more demanding than standmounts in terms of power

I don't think the Marantz will fulfil the full potential of the Q Acoustics .

Probably not even close.

In line with my post above the K2 has a suitably large power supply so will not lack power.

I have not heard this particular model but over the years I have usually found Roksan amplifiers a bit forthright and lacking in refinement, that's my taste though. Sensible price so definitely worth a go.

 

[ISAC69]

If you can sterch your budget the Roksan Kandy K2 will give better results . floorstanders are more demanding than standmounts in terms of power

I don't think the Marantz will fulfil the full potential of the Q Acoustics .

Probably not even close.

In line with my post above the K2 has a suitably large power supply so will not lack power.

I have not heard this particular model but over the years I have usually found Roksan amplifiers a bit forthright and lacking in refinement, that's my taste though. Sensible price so definitely worth a go.

That's right the Roksan Kandy is a bit forthright and lacking in refinement but in this level of price is one of the best integrated amps .

 

[Cypher]

I know both the PM6004 and Roksan K2 amps.

You can get the PM6004 (new) for 320 euro in Holland. The Roksan K2 costs over 1000 euro. Quite a difference.

What about taste ? I'm a fan of the Marantz sound but I found the Roksan to be clinical and harsh. The Marantz sounds way more pleasant and musically engaging.

Spending more money does not always give you more positive results.

 

[PAULCHRISTOPHER]

I bought the Marantz PM6004 as a budget amplifier. I then bought the Q A 2500i's in gloss white but I think you can get the cheaper finishes for £399 now so I would call this just a step up from budget. If I was contemplating spending £800 on an amplifier then I would be considering floorstanders from the likes of Tannoy or B & W for about £1000 a pair. I have been called niave on this forum but Hi Fi is not my main hobby. I was just replacing some 15 year old Technics stuff so I can listen to music with some semblance to the original.

 

[davedotco]

Several of these posts represent the 'modern' trend where the amplifier is considered less important. A lot of people have this view and this thread reflects that.

Personally, as you can probably guess, I really do not subscribe to this view, in fact I find it misguided and one of the prime reasons that I find so many systems in this price sector, pretty much unlistenable.

 

[drummerman]

The MCR 610 for example has a power supply rated at just 55 watts, the PM6004 a more repectable 150 watts, but both the Creek and the Croft have power supplies rated at 350 watts. That is going to make quite a difference.

Not disagreeing on the importance of a good power supply but the Marantz 610 uses, as far as I know, a much more efficient switch mode power supply and 'digital' amplifier section which may go some way towards explaining the low consumption (which these days is a bit of a red herring at the best of times as manufacturers only have to quote average consumption but perhaps somebody can put me right on this one). Power is also quoted into a 6ohm load. This would, in theory make it a 40watt amplifier into 8ohm and around 80watts into 4 as this kind of amplifier is usually nearly doubling power into lower loads but has traditionally limited headroom. This should make it plenty powerful for reasonably efficient speakers, many of which use a 4ohm bass unit and 8ohm tweeter. - The crossover can mess things up though and I somewhat doubt that the Marantz micro has the current to control larger woofers efficiently. This may explain why something like Rega's R3S, as used by chebby, is a good match with its minimalist xover.

For sheer volume and control, there is no substitute for swinging volts/good dynamic headroom and/or current when things get trickier as is often the case when using different speakers and their associated networks.. However, this alone doesn't guarantee good sound. Low distortion/intermodulation is just as important.

regards

 

[drummerman]

I happen to agree that in these days of cheap, good digital sources a good quality amplifier is as important as the speakers.

regards

 

[davedotco]

The MCR 610 for example has a power supply rated at just 55 watts, the PM6004 a more repectable 150 watts, but both the Creek and the Croft have power supplies rated at 350 watts. That is going to make quite a difference.

Not disagreeing on the importance of a good power supply but the Marantz 610 uses, as far as I know, a much more efficient switch mode power supply and 'digital' amplifier section which may go some way towards explaining the low consumption (which these days is a bit of a red herring at the best of times as manufacturers only have to quote average consumption but perhaps somebody can put me right on this one). Power is also quoted into a 6ohm load. This would, in theory make it a 40watt amplifier into 8ohm and around 80watts into 4 as this kind of amplifier is usually nearly doubling power into lower loads but has traditionally limited headroom. This should make it plenty powerful for reasonably efficient speakers, many of which use a 4ohm bass unit and 8ohm tweeter. - The crossover can mess things up though and I somewhat doubt that the Marantz micro has the current to control larger woofers efficiently. This may explain why something like Rega's R3S, as used by chebby, is a good match with its minimalist xover.

For sheer volume and control, there is no substitute for volts into a known load and/or current when things get trickier. However, this alone doesn't guarantee good sound. Low distortion/intermodulation is just as important.

regards

There is no doubt that the Marantz engineers have done very well with this design, with sensible speakers the peak capability of the 610 is it's stong point, sounding much more potent than expected.

The issue is continuous power, not that big an issue with 'sensible' speakers and normal volume levels but step outside the box and you could be in trouble. A slightly less efficient speaker, a point or two of bass boost and tuning up the volume a couple of notches and you will be asking far too much.

However efficient the power supply conversion is it is still only 55 watts maximum, in reality 20-25 watts for each channel and will not be able to keep up if the amp is worked hard. Power supply voltage will drop and the amplifier will clip, often a long way below rated output which is why you need to be sensible.

 

[ISAC69]

Several of these posts represent the 'modern' trend where the amplifier is considered less important. A lot of people have this view and this thread reflects that.

Personally, as you can probably guess, I really do not subscribe to this view, in fact I find it misguided and one of the prime reasons that I find so many systems in this price sector, pretty much unlistenable.

+1

Many systems in this price sector looks very nice and impresive but pretty much unlistenable .It's better to wait till you can buy reasonable system

and not to compromise with a low budget one .

 

[davedotco]

Several of these posts represent the 'modern' trend where the amplifier is considered less important. A lot of people have this view and this thread reflects that.

Personally, as you can probably guess, I really do not subscribe to this view, in fact I find it misguided and one of the prime reasons that I find so many systems in this price sector, pretty much unlistenable.

+1

Many systems in this price sector looks very nice and impresive but pretty much unlistenable .It's better to wait till you can buy reasonable system

and not to compromise with a low budget one.

This is not a popular view isac, I suggest you keep your head down....... :hand:

 

[PAULCHRISTOPHER]

"Tongue in Cheek" ;-
Reasonable system :-
Turntable £1000
CD Player £1000
Network Audio Player £1000
Amplifier £1000
Speakers £1000
Headphones £1000
!!!! Cables & Mains
conditioning!!!! £1000
Total £7000
When my premium Bonds come up I will tell you what I have bought.
Paul

 

[davedotco]

"Tongue in Cheek" ;- Reasonable system :- Turntable £1000 CD Player £1000 Network Audio Player £1000 Amplifier £1000 Speakers £1000 Headphones £1000 !!!! Cables & Mains conditioning!!!! £1000 Total £7000 When my premium Bonds come up I will tell you what I have bought. Paul

Far to much spent on odds and sods.

Rip everything to a NAS drive, buy a Devialet 110 and a pair of Cremona Auditors (while the speakers are still available at a reduced price)

Far more effective way of spending that sort of money....... :cheers:

 

[PAULCHRISTOPHER]

"Tongue in Cheek" ;- Reasonable system :- Turntable £1000 CD Player £1000 Network Audio Player £1000 Amplifier £1000 Speakers £1000 Headphones £1000 !!!! Cables & Mains conditioning!!!! £1000 Total £7000 When my premium Bonds come up I will tell you what I have bought. Paul

Far to much spent on odds and sods.

Rip everything to a NAS drive, buy a Devialet 110 and a pair of Cremona Auditors (while the speakers are still available at a reduced price)

Far more effective way of spending that sort of money....... :cheers:

Nice gear!. Refering to the OP's question I will qualify my original answer in that the Marantz PM6004 works well with the Q Acoustics 2050i's up to 12 0'clock on the volume control with the speakers well away from the corners or walls of a room amout 5 meters by about 4 meters.You can always push the foam bungs in to tighten up the base. Above this it might struggle and in any case would be Just too loud for our terrace house!The Whathifi review of these speakers said that they were too polite for their taste and I understand that comment. My main genres I listen to are jazz, Swing- big band sound, pop/jazz (Caro Emerald ,Amy Winehouse Manhattan Transfer etc.) and Classical (Wagner) & Opera (Puccini).I usually have the volume at just over 9 o,clock and I am very happy with the sound from CD's , Vynil & downloads. If I had a bigger room then one of the bigger Marantz amplifiers with outputs more to the top end of the 25 to 150 watt speaker range say 100 watts per channel would presumably be more suited to the 2050i's or indeed another make of amplifier as you suggest .

 

[cse]

"Tongue in Cheek" ;- Reasonable system :- Turntable £1000 CD Player £1000 Network Audio Player £1000 Amplifier £1000 Speakers £1000 Headphones £1000 !!!! Cables & Mains conditioning!!!! £1000 Total £7000 When my premium Bonds come up I will tell you what I have bought. Paul

I think you need to spend more on the speakers in this kind of system.

 

[ISAC69]

"Tongue in Cheek" ;- Reasonable system :- Turntable £1000 CD Player £1000 Network Audio Player £1000 Amplifier £1000 Speakers £1000 Headphones £1000 !!!! Cables & Mains conditioning!!!! £1000 Total £7000 When my premium Bonds come up I will tell you what I have bought. Paul

You are so cynical |(

You can find reasonabe systems in 1500-2000 £ total .

 

[the record spot]

Indeed. Total cost of my system to me - £1200. Patience and shopping around make all the difference!