Stand-mount speakers for classical music?

[cats_five]

I listen properly to one things, classical music, and am looking to replacing my speakers. I have a pair of Mission speaker stands, I don't want floor mounts for a variety of reasons.

The amp is an Arcam A65, the CD player an Arcam CD-73, and I sometimes stream from a server in the house using a Logitech Duet.

I'm looking for suggestions up to £500 per pair. My room has a hard wood floor but is a reasonable size, and sort of shoe-box shape. My chair is in the middle of the showbox looking along the length to the speakers, TV & front window. I have vertical blinds in the back & front windows.

 

[CnoEvil]

I would have 2 suggestions:

1. Kef R100 (ex-dem, as £100 over budget)

2. Q Acoustics Concept 20

 

[insider9]

I'd suggest having a look at Quad S-2 (RRP £599) but should be doable at £500 ex-demo or even less second hand. Very favourable review in Stereophile, I think your amp should just manage them.

 

[muljao]

As a left field idea, it is often said that actvive studi monitors pefrom exceptinally well with classical music (I am open to correction on this) I believe your amp has pre-outs so if you wer happy to plug each speaker into a mains socket you might do very well for 500 pounds. Off the top of my head these seem good value

https://www.gear4music.ie/Recording-and-Computers/Adam-Audio-T7V-Studio-Monitors-Pair/2B15

2 of these https://www.gear4music.ie/Recording-and-Computers/Mackie-MR624-65-Powered-Studio-Monitor/22FZ

or maybe these

https://www.gear4music.ie/Recording-and-Computers/PreSonus-Eris-E8-Active-Studio-Monitor/PQC

 

[Strictly Stereo]

I listen properly to one things, classical music, and am looking to replacing my speakers. I have a pair of Mission speaker stands, I don't want floor mounts for a variety of reasons.

The amp is an Arcam A65, the CD player an Arcam CD-73, and I sometimes stream from a server in the house using a Logitech Duet.

I'm looking for suggestions up to £500 per pair. My room has a hard wood floor but is a reasonable size, and sort of shoe-box shape. My chair is in the middle of the showbox looking along the length to the speakers, TV & front window. I have vertical blinds in the back & front windows.

When you say "middle of the shoe box" do you mean the centre of the wall or the centre of the room? How far away are your ears from the front of the speakers?

 

[gasolin]

Not the most power full amp but Q Acoustics 3050 with 6ohm and 92db should do the job pretty good.

 

[plastic penguin]

Having owned the Arcam A65+, I would suggest Q Acoustics and B&W 685 S2

 

[Al ears]

As well as PP's recommendations I would suggest a pair of Arcaydis EB2s or second-hand EB Acoustics EB2 speakers if you can find them for your budget.

 

[plastic penguin]

It's true, the A65 wasn't the most powerful but I had MA RS6s (6 ohms and 91db) without any real issues. Only problem was when you tried to crank it up above 11 oclock that it showed any signs it was struggling.

I've also powered PMC DB1i, at 8 ohms and 87db, minus any problems. At 40 watts per channel, the Arcam will always have its limitations.

 

[davidf]

The centre of any room is never the best place to sit. Try moving your seating position further back or further forwards. Imagine your room as sectioned into thirds, front to back. Then sit either a third back, or two thirds back.

For reflective rooms, I’d normally recommend either KEF or Amphion. Either the R100 or Q350 from KEF. Your budget is just below the Amphion Argon range, but you could look at the slightly cheaper Helium range, with the Helium 410, although I do have a pair of ex-demo Argon 0 for £550 (white).

The above models have a controlled HF dispersion, so you’ll hear less high frequency bouncing off the walls and more of the direct sound from the speakers.

 

[Blackdawn]

How about Wharfedale Reva 2 or Dynaudio Emit M10

 

[Al ears]

The centre of any room is never the best place to sit. Try moving your seating position further back or further forwards. Imagine your room as sectioned into thirds, front to back. Then sit either a third back, or two thirds back.

For reflective rooms, I’d normally recommend either KEF or Amphion. Either the R100 or Q350 from KEF. Your budget is just below the Amphion Argon range, but you could look at the slightly cheaper Helium range, with the Helium 410, although I do have a pair of ex-demo Argon 0 for £550 (white).

The above models have a controlled HF dispersion, so you’ll hear less high frequency bouncing off the walls and more of the direct sound from the speakers.

Heard of house rule No.11 David? 🙂

 

[Strictly Stereo]

Heard of house rule No.11 David? 🙂

Never sit in the middle of the room? [joke]

 

[davidf]

Heard of house rule No.11 David? 🙂

There’s been a number of rules broken by various retailers of the years, but reporting anything via the forum goes nowhere. I’m tired of being the polite one who doesn’t, only for those who do to gain. I don’t lead in this regard, I now follow.

 

[davidf]

Heard of house rule No.11 David? 🙂

Never sit in the middle of the room? [joke]

*biggrin*

 

[insider9]

Heard of house rule No.11 David? 🙂

Never sit in the middle of the room? [joke]

I'm surprised you know No.11...

All I know No.10 says "Brexit means Brexit"

 

[gasolin]

It's true, the A65 wasn't the most powerful but I had MA RS6s (6 ohms and 91db) without any real issues. Only problem was when you tried to crank it up above 11 oclock that it showed any signs it was struggling.

I've also powered PMC DB1i, at 8 ohms and 87db, minus any problems. At 40 watts per channel, the Arcam will always have its limitations.

11 oclock can be max power https://youtu.be/JhuWuTDZiuI?t=20m38s

 

[Al ears]

Heard of house rule No.11 David? 🙂

There’s been a number of rules broken by various retailers of the years, but reporting anything via the forum goes nowhere. I’m tired of being the polite one who doesn’t, only for those who do to gain. I don’t lead in this regard, I now follow.

Understood. It is indeed amazing what some people have gotten away with in the past. That's a poorly run forum for you.

 

[davidf]

Understood. It is indeed amazing what some people have gotten away with in the past. That's a poorly run forum for you.

I see it on other forums too. I tend to post under my own very conservative rules in the name of decency, but all I see are virtually every other retailer bending and breaking the rules and getting away with it - why compromise myself by being conservative? I have a business I want to succeeed becaise I enjoy doing it, so why shouldn’t I push the rules until I get a warning?

 

[emcc_3]

Think you can get 20% off Kef r series at the minute which would put it under budget.

 

[insider9]

As well as PP's recommendations I would suggest a pair of Arcaydis EB2s or second-hand EB Acoustics EB2 speakers if you can find them for your budget.

Good point. Completetly forgot about them. I wonder what I'd make of them nowadays.

 

[cats_five]

I mean from about half-way along the length and 1/4 in from one side. The speakers are about 3m away.

 

[cats_five]

I mean from about half-way along the length and 1/4 in from one side. The speakers are about 3m away.

PS I know about the rule of thirds for photography, never heard of it applied to sound before.

BTW the Q Aoutstics 3050 are floor standing which isn't suitable here for a variety of reasons best not gone into. I think what I need is to find somewhere preferably in Edinburgh where I can do some listening. I did when I brought the last satisfactory pair of speakers but believe they are not really into HiFi these days. Could go to Glasgow but it's a longer journey for me. Perth, Stirling & Dundee are all possible as well.

 

[Strictly Stereo]

I mean from about half-way along the length and 1/4 in from one side. The speakers are about 3m away.

Does that mean that one speaker is further away from you than the other? As a rule of thumb, you want to have both speakers the same distance from your listening position and the same distance from the front and side walls. Otherwise you can end up with one channel being delayed relative to the other one, more sound reflected from one side wall than the other, more boundary reinforcement on one side than the other etc. You then have to either deal with these problems or put up with them.

The "rule of thirds" as applied to speaker and listening positions, has more to do with acoustics than aesthetics, but the idea is the same as with photography. It calls for the speakers to be placed one third of the way along the diagonals of the room. Your listening position should then be half way across the width of the room, along a line which intersects the two thirds positions. This is usually quite successful in determining a good sounding listening position, but with a smaller speaker, you will normally get better results by moving the speakers closer to the front wall. Moving the speakers closer to the wall does two things. It allows you to take advantage of boundary reinforcement, to support the bottom end. This is probably going to give you a more satisfying end result. It also pushes up the frequency at which speaker boundary interference from the front wall reflections causes a cancellation effect, which will usually make it less noticeable. The other benefit is of course that you will be tripping over the speakers and cables less often.

The centre of the room is best avoided. Without a lot of acoustic treatment, you will always get pressure building up halfway between any two parallel surfaces. You will no doubt have spotted that this contradicts the rule of thirds dictate about sitting halfway across the width of the room. The reason for this is that, all other things being equal, this is normally a better compromise than sitting off axis or losing the symmetrical speaker positioning.

In reality of course, real rooms are not simple boxes. Their various surfaces are made of different materials and they are filled with a variety of furniture and other stuff. Because of this, the models really only provide a guide. Some measurement or a lot of experimentation is required to get the best results.

 

[Burnsie]

Try HiFi Corner in Elm Row or Loud and Clear at Commercial Quay, always found both dealers very decent.