Sign me up for the Musical Fidelity fanclub

[sthomas048]

Okay so i took a gamble of sorts and bought a second hand Musical Fidelity B200 intergrated amp. Wow. A revelation no less ! How can this amp sound so great ? My new Rega Mira 3 is now looking betrayed and forlorn in the corner of my listening room. The MF brings so much musicality and richness to my sound. Very different to the Rega amp. So maybe i dont need to spend loads on the latest hifi kit afterall ? Any other Musical Fidelity fans care to share their love of the house sound ?

Plus i can warm my takeaway up on the top of my B200 !

 

[idc]

Well I really liked my Mira (original) and I really like my MF amps. Originally I had the X-CANS connected to the Mira. It piggy backed it and got its signal from cassette, CDP and tuner via the Mira. So there was not much in the way of a difference, especially taking into account that is comparing headphones to speakers.

Since the Mira, CDP etc went and changed to PC/headfi, the MF kit has come into its own. But, I missed the extra drive and dynamic of the Mira. With the Fubar DAC and Supplier and mainly listening to Ogg Vorbis codec through Spotify I have added that extra dynamic. The new SHB interconnects have shifted the balance back towards the treble, but with no loss of dynamic to the bass. Hopefully, if what many report is true, once the SHBs have burned in, the bigger bass will return.

This is what Antony Michaelson has to say about the X-CANV8P;

Just a few listening notes on the V8P compared to the V2. Because the V8P has no effective voltage or current limit it will never clip into any headphone and always remain completely linier. This has a counter intuitive effect of possibly making it sound less "exciting" or "rhythmic". Its just that unlike any other headphone amp it doesn't limit. Most audiophiles are so used to the sudden peaks of distortion caused by limiting and clipping that they think that that is a hi-fi sound. Little could be further from the truth.

So truth be told, I am one of those audiophiles who was further from the truth! Each to their own. So sthomas, I am happy to be part of the fan club, so long as I get to tweek the MF sound to the way I like it.

 

[SHAXOS]

I got a MF kw550 and for the first time ever i have been completely content with my system. In fact the money that it would cost me to replace with something better is not even worth thinking about for me so i feel i have reached the best i can get. I must say the thing i love about my amp is the MASSIVE scale it gives! Im only using standmounters and its still a huge wall of sound. The amp perhaps doesnt time quite as well as some of the cyrus equipment ive had/heard in the past (althoug its pretty close without the hardness of the cyrus) but in all other areas i cant think of a single fault. Actually there is one, its absolutely bloody massive and weighs as much as me. I went from cyrus and belcanto and i do miss having less conspicuous boxes but the sound makes up for this "fault".

 

[aliEnRIK]

SHAXOS:I got a MF kw550 and for the first time ever i have been completely content with my system. In fact the money that it would cost me to replace with something better is not even worth thinking about for me so i feel i have reached the best i can get. I must say the thing i love about my amp is the MASSIVE scale it gives! Im only using standmounters and its still a huge wall of sound. The amp perhaps doesnt time quite as well as some of the cyrus equipment ive had/heard in the past (althoug its pretty close without the hardness of the cyrus) but in all other areas i cant think of a single fault. Actually there is one, its absolutely bloody massive and weighs as much as me. I went from cyrus and belcanto and i do miss having less conspicuous boxes but the sound makes up for this "fault".

Man ~ that IS a big amp. My dad has the kw500 (Very recently sent it back for an internal upgrade where they refit better components too)

Amazed you claim timings not spot on though. My dads has 'phenominal' timing (But then he uses the chord blu tranpsort and dac which might have a lot to do with it)

 

[Anonymous]

Not as grand as the last two post but I've got the A3.5 integrated and love it.

I used to have an X-A200-R but wanted more power. The 3.5 has 150w into 8 ohms.

 

[Anonymous]

Sometimes you just can't beat a bit of colour in a hifi, some call it musicality. It's usually the nature of an amp's power limitations and subsequent clipping behaviour with the speakers that gives an amp (with speakers) it's colour and therefore it's character. As AM from MF says, the power monsters they make are good for non-clipping and the low powered class A stuff good for coloured sound.

 

[idc]

igglebert:Sometimes you just can't beat a bit of colour in a hifi, some call it musicality. It's usually the nature of an amp's power limitations and subsequent clipping behaviour with the speakers that gives an amp (with speakers) it's colour and therefore it's character. As AM from MF says, the power monsters they make are good for non-clipping and the low powered class A stuff good for coloured sound.

I agree igglebert. In his explination of power, amps and clipping; http://www.musicalfidelity.com/news/letter.html I feel AM goes a bit over the top in his 'frustrating run-ins' with those who disagree with his view of what hifi reproduction should be. I want dynamic and lively music, not 'undynamic' and 'dull' though I do think that those terms are a bit emotive. I really enjoy the MF sound of detail and faithful reproduction with an emphasis on the midrange. But I want more colour/musicality, particularly with the bass.

I know to AM my attitude is like eating at the Fat Duck and asking for tomato ketchup to put on the 24 hour slow cooked longhorn beef main course. He may dispare, but hopefully he also realises I am having the best of experiences.

 

[shooter]

sthomas048:
Okay so i took a gamble of sorts and bought a second hand Musical Fidelity B200 intergrated amp. Wow. A revelation no less ! How can this amp sound so great ? My new Rega Mira 3 is now looking betrayed and forlorn in the corner of my listening room. The MF brings so much musicality and richness to my sound. Very different to the Rega amp. So maybe i dont need to spend loads on the latest hifi kit afterall ? Any other Musical Fidelity fans care to share their love of the house sound ?

Plus i can warm my takeaway up on the top of my B200 !

Great to see some happy MF users out their! A user myself albeit the Nu-Vista 3D CD and what a machine it is. Puts to shame many a player i've had the pleasure of listening to. Cant see myself hearing better. Quality.

 

[Kevin Stephens]

of course you will need to be very rich indeed to enjoy MF's only current offerings, hopefully they will produce some more real world priced gear in the not too distant future

 

[sthomas048]

Kevin, yes indeed. I read somewhere that originally MF's outlook was to provide good kit at relatively affordable prices. Tbh they have deviated from this with their current crop, as you say. All i can say to people looking for a certain sound in their system but are tied to a tight budget - the earlier MF products are well worth checking out. Infact there is lots of older kit by other companies out there that is worth trying out today. If you arent bothered about it looking dated or not having all the modern bells and whistles, then go for it ! Stuff like the Nad 3020, Pioneer 400x, the older Mission speakers etc;

 

[idc]

The pricing structure is a bit odd. The V range is £70 to £140 for its three products, then there is a big leap to the small X range and on into the thousands for the rest.

There is a the option of buying second hand and modding. But the X-CANV8P has had components glued in to stop this. But with older kit this is not a problem.

 

[Anonymous]

Excellent an MF Fan Club!! Woo!!

My System : http://community.whathifi.com/forums/t/223572.aspx

Clearly a Massive MF fan - my latest KW kit is simply stunning.

With reference to the upgrades that MF offer on most equipment, I have heard the KW500 which was upgraded - not only did the original model sound stunning - the upgrade came with impecible timing and the sound was even better.Excellent customer opportunity to offer upgrades on their equipment for a very reasonable price it must be said too.

Pure bliss with music the KW gear is. Bass notes so tuneful I wanted to hug my amplifier forever

Its actually amazing value for money as well - that kinda reference sound for what might be considered cheap in the hifi world?

 

[idc]

Regards the Fine-tuning service offered. I also dip into another forum where there is a great deal of modding and knowledge of electronics. The attitude there is that the £180 or so to mod the X-CANV8P is not good value. A number of the 'mods' are just simple changes that should have been part of the manufacturing in the first place they are that cheap. Only changing the valves, which is a straight forward enough job, is going to make a major difference.

To put that into perspective, my X-CANS mods by Rock Grotto cost about £110 and included all of the MF mods and more. So in effect you are paying £70 to have MF do it and a letter from AM to say you have had it done.

But, just as with my X-CANS, in about 7 or 8 years, as a means of servicing it and adding another 7 or 8 years to its life, I could justify using the Fine-tuning service for the V8P. Some of the other prices appear very steep indeed.

 

[sthomas048]

Well to fine tune my B200 would cost me £399. The amp itself only cost me £149. The list of stuff they do in the tuning seems thorough and its something i would consider maybe a few months. Here's the list of tuning on the B200 -

Fit premium grade gold plated operational amp sockets

Replace PSU and supply bypass caps with high grade polypropylene

Bypass all audio path electrolytics with high grade polypropylene

Adjust for minimum output DC offset

Customise output chokes for fine tuned matching

Service selector switch and volume control

Measure 4 output transistors for precision matching devices

Refurbish sockets, check for wear, replace if needed

Bypass PSU electrolytics with polycarbonate/polyester type

Check channel balance exceeds original specification

Replace decoupling caps polycarbonate/polyester type

Realign volume control

Pure copper noise nulling belly band screen fitted to mains transformer

Check PSU caps ESR, replace if needed

Replace operational amps with selected premium grade types

Check regulators for noise and voltage accuracy, replace if needed

Upload latest software specification

Realign power transformer

Replace internal L/S cables with LC/OFC low resistance type

Precision re-bias

Pure copper noise nulling screen fitted to PSU caps

Computer recalibration to confirm that unit exceeds original specification

Log owner name, model and serial number in Musical Fidelity archives

Issue certificate signed by Antony Michaelsonhs from now.

I think for older equipment like mine its worthwhile.

 

[Anonymous]

Well, for a grand total of £550 you'd have an amp you love that is refreshed and renewed to last a good while. Sounds reasonable to me.

 

[shooter]

Second that. Sounds very reasonable.

 

[idc]

To me the following reads like an impressive list of checks, the type that Halfords etc use in their servicing programmes. Most just involve looking at something or a quick check to see if it is working properly. Well, if it wasn't working properly, you would surely notice a problem. I've highlighted what appears to be actual upgrading.....

sthomas048:

Well to fine tune my B200 would cost me £399. The amp itself only cost me £149. The list of stuff they do in the tuning seems thorough and its something i would consider maybe a few months. Here's the list of tuning on the B200 -

Fit premium grade gold plated operational amp sockets
Replace PSU and supply bypass caps with high grade polypropylene
Bypass all audio path electrolytics with high grade polypropylene
Adjust for minimum output DC offset
Customise output chokes for fine tuned matching
Service selector switch and volume control
Measure 4 output transistors for precision matching devices
Refurbish sockets, check for wear, replace if needed
Bypass PSU electrolytics with polycarbonate/polyester type
Check channel balance exceeds original specification
Replace decoupling caps polycarbonate/polyester type
Realign volume control
Pure copper noise nulling belly band screen fitted to mains transformer
Check PSU caps ESR, replace if needed
Replace operational amps with selected premium grade types
Check regulators for noise and voltage accuracy, replace if needed
Upload latest software specification
Realign power transformer
Replace internal L/S cables with LC/OFC low resistance type
Precision re-bias
Pure copper noise nulling screen fitted to PSU caps
Computer recalibration to confirm that unit exceeds original specification
Log owner name, model and serial number in Musical Fidelity archives
Issue certificate signed by Antony Michaelsonhs from now.

I think for older equipment like mine its worthwhile.

I doubt that the parts that will be changed (as opposed to might be, but it is an upgrade, not a repair, so I will assume none of the checks will result in a part change) cost much more than £100. There is a huge profit margin for MF here.

However, to put another perspective on that. My upgraded X-CANS is pretty much as good as the V8P. The main area where the V8P wins out is soundstage. The X-CANS still sounds as if it is all inside my head.

 

[Anonymous]

I think you're spot on with your assessment of this 'upgrade' but unless you're both an electronics maintenance operator and clued up on the amp's design, you're not going to do much to it!

 

[Anonymous]

idc your looking at the concept of upgrading too much from a business and profit margin view. I agree with you that the cost of parts etc might be cheap BUT the most important thing is the value it adds to the customer. And also not to mention we are discounting the other costs, labour charges, research & development, marketing etc etc

Most MF people I have spoke to - whether it be through selling my equipment or looking to buy equipment from have always mention how good the upgrade is.

Its excellent that a customer can upgrade their amps/cd players etc to the latest spec - which in most cases increases the sound enjoyment. This can all be done without having to spend loads of money on purchasing a new amplifier.

Simply it means the MF fans have

's for longer

Its not just MF, like you said that offer upgrades - there are many firms out there that offer an upgrade service on MF equipment. Most of the firms provide excellent results. JS Audio Repairs are an excellent one man (i think) firm who has offered me excellent, and many others, advice. Lets not forget with an MF offical upgrade you get an additional guarentee added to your upgraded unit too.

 

[idc]

I just want eveything to be cheaper! I have also seen MF kit on ebay selling for a premium because it has been modded. I would be very interested in the views and description of a modded MF product on the forum.

 

[Anonymous]

idc:I just want eveything to be cheaper! I have also seen MF kit on ebay selling for a premium because it has been modded. I would be very interested in the views and description of a modded MF product on the forum.

My KW kit will all be upgraded late next year - I will happily give the forum feedback once this all happens. Long time away yet though.

ps I think we all want things cheaper

 

[idc]

Vinny7:

....... Lets not forget with an MF offical upgrade you get an additional guarentee added to your upgraded unit too.

Its one year. With Rock Grotto it is a minimum of a year up to life depending on the component with the exception of the valves.

 

[Anonymous]

Very Good idc - Do Rock Grotto do any of the KW equipment for upgrades? If not what sort of series do they modify? Thx

 

[idc]

Primarily X series and headphone amps in general, site here. So not the rest of the range, sorry. The JS modding service looks good, especially as he is ex MF service manager. I could not find any prices though. Another company, of which I have no experience of is http://www.underwoodhifi.com/mods.html . I found it when I was looking to mod my X-CANS.

 

[method man]

igglebert:Sometimes you just can't beat a bit of colour in a hifi, some call it musicality. It's usually the nature of an amp's power limitations and subsequent clipping behaviour with the speakers that gives an amp (with speakers) it's colour and therefore it's character. As AM from MF says, the power monsters they make are good for non-clipping and the low powered class A stuff good for coloured sound.

I read something like this explaination a month or so back elsewhere. so are you saying 'colour/musicality' is actually distortion? so you are losing the very 'fidelity' of Hi-Fidelity?