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Processor to replace Arcam AV9

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Hi gregvet

Datasat (formerly DTS) is also entering the home consumer market and their new RS20i processor :twisted: featuring Dirac Live Room Optimization :twisted: is also worth consideration :)

http://www.datasatdigital.com/consumer/products/rs20i.php

http://www.datasatdigital.com/

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft
 
Hi gregvet

Datasat (formerly DTS) is also entering the home consumer market and their new RS20i processor :twisted: featuring Dirac Live Room Optimization :twisted: is also worth consideration :)

http://www.datasatdigital.com/consumer/products/rs20i.php

http://www.datasatdigital.com/

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft
 
Hi gregvet

Datasat (formerly DTS) is also entering the home consumer market and their new RS20i processor :twisted: featuring Dirac Live Room Optimization :twisted: is also worth consideration :)

http://www.datasatdigital.com/consumer/products/rs20i.php

http://www.datasatdigital.com/

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft
 

Frank Harvey

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WishTree said:
David - I would really like to know your opinion on this. I am planning to get the SSP 800. I might get it as well. But, if the SQ jump is not that much, especially in Stereo / music, then better to save some money and get the 8200AP

I'm interested too. I can't see the Audiolab standing up to the SSP800 for quality, but hey, you never know! I'll probably end up with an 8200AP for now until I'm in a position to separate AV and hi-fi. But to move on from there, I'd be looking at either the Bryston SP3 or Classe SSP800. I know which clinches it for looks for me :)

Also, in Stereo performance, how good is 8200AP compared to M-DAC (based on this I can have some reference as I currently have the M-DAC as DAC in my system)

I have to admit I've not tried the 8200AP directly against the M-DAC, but I would expect the M-DAC to have the potential to be better. When I tried the 8200AP at home, it made my AV system sound a lot more like a hi-fi system as far as 2-channel performance was concerned. I think if you heard both in different places at different times, you'd be hard pushed to tell them apart.

That is right - I have read some where that there is AV7007 to be out. It would be great to have these four back to back compared. I keep saying this again and again but I am keen to see the performance differences in 2 channel reprodcution !

I'd be more worried about hearing the difference :)
 

Frank Harvey

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WishTree said:
I moved from RMB 1075 to Arcam P7 and I noticed that a lot of top end harshness is removed.

Do you have some inputs on RMB 1075 vs 1575 on high frequency performance?

The Arcam amplification will always be smoother in the top end than Rotel. I feel Rotel is more neutral, and for me, the Arcam is a little too restrained for my tastes. Rotel amps do need some warming up before use, otherwise they can be a little bright.

The 1075 and 1575 are quite different. The 1075 is a conventional Class A/B amplifier, whereas the RMB1575 is a Class D amplifier. You can Google the technical differences, but basically, the 1575 is a high efficiency amplifier that runs cooler and uses less electric than Class A/B. There is a sound difference though. I was introduced to Class D amplification by Pioneer's SCLX AV receivers, and found that they sounded more neutral then Class A/B amps, and possessed more grip too, being able to drive more awkward loads (4ohms in particular) better than equivalently priced AV receivers. When I upgraded from my SCLX85, I didn't want to move away from the sort of sound I had, so decided to stick with Class D, although there wasn't a great choice. The Rotel fitted perfectly and wasn't silly expensive, and with 500wpc on tap into 4ohm loads, that was way more than what I was used to, but I like to prepare for any eventuality :)

Tonally, as I say, the 1575 is more neutral, lacking the warmth and fullness that the 1075 will have in comparison. The 1575 is quite 'fast' in comparison too. This can come across to some people that the higher frequencies are a little more prominent, which some people will class as bright, some might even say harsh, but for me it just sounds more accurate. Because there's no whacking great transformer either, it tends to reduce the noise floor, making music sound particularly clean and clear. If you're susceptible to higher frequencies, the 1575 may not be for you, but there should be enough adjustment in any quality processor to tame that, even if the room EQ doesn't.

As I am considering the Rotel RMB 1565 only for other channels (beyond Front L & Front R).

Also, last question,

I noticed that in Stereo performance I am getting better results with a dedicated stereo amp when compared to a multi channel amp (I compared the P7 stereo performance against PM-Pearl from Marantz and the Classe CAP-2100)

Do you think this is a normal possible situation or one of a case?

It'll partly depend on how the amplifier has been designed. Some multi-channel power amplifiers will use a single large transformer to supply all channels, whereas you'll find the more 'higher end' ones may be of a mono construction - so they'll have five individual amplifier modules (boards) each with their own transformer. This type of design tends to sound better than the former, but as we know, there's the theory, then there's the practice. A dedicated 2-channel power amplifier may well have more current on tap than a multi-channel one, hence the fact it was probably driving your speakers better. In a mutli-channel system that needs to be top notch for 2-channel, I would install a dedicated 2-channel power amplifier for the front pair, and add in a multi-channel power amplifier for the rest of the speakers, as long as space isn't a consideration, of course.

I am guessing the main reason is the asymmetrical speaker set up (front L & R floor standing) apart from the dedicated amplifier for Stereo means more tolerances are built into the amp for peak handling when compared to a multi channel amp? (just guessing)

Yes, the two channel amp may well have greater headroom and current delivery.

I read some where that you use the R300 for all channels (please correct me if I am wrong) and that automatically makes me read your posts with great interest! (as I have noticed that my center channel speaker not being exactly identical with Front L & R, there is some missing synergy - if I am listening to critically. Though after a while the movie engrosses me to forget this)

Yes, I use identical speakers all round, as this is the only way to guarantee a consistent soundfield, and exact timbre matching - of course, youre then down to the mercy of your room :)

Some people don't really hear the sound issues caused by so called 'matching' centres, and if you don't, that's great, as you've saved yourself money and probably space! Not only is there the issue of different cabinet volumes and quite possibily different sized drivers (sometimes different drivers altogether!), but there's also the issue of dispersion. In a system like mine, all five speakers have exactly the same dispersion patterns, but in most systems, dedicated centres lie in their side for convenience purposes, and because the mid/bass drivers are either side of the HF unit, this will have different dispersion to a normal speaker where the mid/bass drivers will normally be above and/or below the HF unit.

You are right that once you are engrossed in a movie, little things can be forgotten about or not noticed, but when they're addressed properly in the first place, they'll probably never be noticed, unless you find your mind wondering because the film is a little boring. But once you notice an issue... :)

Hope this helps :)
 

WishTree

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FrankHarveyHiFi said:
Hope this helps :)

Thanks David for patiently sharing your experience.

In the meanwhile, I got myself a Classe SSP 800 and just bought the CP 800 hoping to have a little experience by myself.

Yes, the SSP 800 is really at a different level. No way I can claim that my multi channel set up is that good to resolve but the little at hand, I can still hear the wonderful clarity of SSP 800.

It is now getting very tricky to explain in words what I am getting but I will stil give it a try. There is a definete realness to the sound and it feels more believable be it more voices or instruments. The DACs and the other things in the SSP 800 make the sound very alive especially more in voices. It feels like million dollars and I can imagine it be doing wonders in a properly balanced 7.2 systems with identical 7 speakers, 7 amplifiers and 2 sub woofers.

The reason why I bought the CP 800 (yet to receive it) is to see what else new can happen in a 2 channel mode. It looks most probaly that I might just keep one of the two (SSP 800 or CP 800) and sell the other but if I am seeing a clear benefit and can justify the extra money then I might keep both.

Now the electronics are set it gives me time to focus on the speakers
 

Frank Harvey

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It would be nice to have both, but even if I found somewhere with the space, I doubt I could stretch that far. The CP800 is supposed to be a top notch pre, and hopefully I'll find out very soon. If the SSP800 can get very close, I'd just go for the processor. Hopefully the SSP800 is as stupidly flexible as the CP800 is. Do let me know your findings.
 

WishTree

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I can imagine and the money is the main reason for making a choice if the difference is not that much.

Just based on retail prices CP800 is half as much as SSP800 but also the latest iteration from Classe. So there is a huge savings when two channel music listening takes priority but the SSP800 is one stop solution for the front end.

Regarding flexibility I guess both are at same level albeit CP800 caters to only two channel with a possibility to add a well equalized sub.

I have seen the SSP800 in action and PEQ is a brilliant thing. It is not purist approach but my limited understanding I am still able to make the sysem sound exactly the way I wanted it. The corrections were minor but very effective. CP800 offers same but only 2 channel domain

The contention will be the way the newer design of DAC over USB vs the HDMI based jitter reduction. This is what I will be looking at when I compare. I will keep us posted on a different thread just to ensure that OP's objectives are addressed on this thread.
 

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