Pathos vs Icon Audio

[FennerMachine]

Pathos vs Icon Audio

Any similar cost items vs each other

Which one and why?

 

[Hi-FiOutlaw]

Pathos vs Icon Audio

Any similar cost items vs each other

Which one and why?

to what models are you referring...?

 

[Al ears]

I think you are going to find it hard to do a 'compare and contrast' thing with these two manufacturers.

Pathos provide extremely well built high output integrateds and, up to a point, so does Icon audio, but after that point you would have to go down the pre amp/power amp route with Icon Audio to get the equivalent of the Pathos Logos say.

This puts a big gap in costs.

Virtually the only item comparable in their ranges would be the Pathos Classic 1 v. the Stereo 60 (both in range £2000-2500)

I have heard neither so cannot help you there (did hear a Stereo 40 once and it sounded 'brill)

 

[stevebrock]

The only valve amp I have ever heard is an ST40 MK3 with KT88s £1695, Had one on demo for 5 days - its gone back now............I now realise just how good valves sound - no not warm & mushy the ST40 excels in everyting bass, detail, imaging PRaT - it blows a very good Brio R out of the water (Elicit R too)

Just counting down the days until I get mine - hopefuly next weekend.

Maybe I should of demoed more valve amps, but for the money I dont think anything else can touch it

 

[matthewpiano]

Steve, I think once you find something that you really enjoy listening to there is little point in endlessly demo-ing alternatives. IMO you have done the right thing - found an amp that suits you, your music, and your system and made a committment to it. It is what I did with the Exposure and, for once in relation to my hi-fi, I have absolutely no regrets.

 

[stevebrock]

Steve, I think once you find something that you really enjoy listening to there is little point in endlessly demo-ing alternatives. IMO you have done the right thing - found an amp that suits you, your music, and your system and made a committment to it. It is what I did with the Exposure and, for once in relation to my hi-fi, I have absolutely no regrets.

Your right - I have had a lot of advice from valve owners here, the general opinion is that the ST40 at its price is a no brainer - within a few sides of LPs I knew it was going to be a keeper!

 

[Hi-FiOutlaw]

The same happened to me when I heard the Pathos with the rest of my system, and a ex demo just for 850€ less 1400€ then retail price, how good was that???

whit 70wpc to drive my Dyns to is best! 8)

 

[Happy_Listner]

Icon Audio made in China

Pathos made in Italy

For environmental, political, econoimic, and worker rights reasons I would choose Pathos.

 

[stevebrock]

Icon Audio made in China

Pathos made in Italy

For environmental, political, econoimic, and worker rights reasons I would choose Pathos.

the components are made in China yes but they are assembled in leicester

 

[plastic penguin]

Maybe I should of demoed more valve amps, but for the money I dont think anything else can touch it

:?

 

[Al ears]

From what I am led to believe Icon Audio design and distribute their products from Leicester. They are built in China.

Installation of the valves and final tweaking is what is done in Leicester but who's counting?

They are very reliable and ultimately easily repairable amps designed for longevity, as, no doubt are the Pathos designs.

Best just try to audition what you can, ultimately it will come down to amount you want to spend on them.

 

[stevebrock]

Maybe I should of demoed more valve amps, but for the money I dont think anything else can touch it

:?

Come to think of it maybe not the ST40 is a beaut

 

[CJSF]

Steve, I think once you find something that you really enjoy listening to there is little point in endlessly demo-ing alternatives. IMO you have done the right thing - found an amp that suits you, your music, and your system and made a committment to it. It is what I did with the Exposure and, for once in relation to my hi-fi, I have absolutely no regrets.

Your right - I have had a lot of advice from valve owners here, the general opinion is that the ST40 at its price is a no brainer - within a few sides of LPs I knew it was going to be a keeper!

The way I see it Steve, if I may take your case as an example, you took a long time to come round to even listening to 'valves', once sat down and doing it, it was a no brainer. Now that has to be put against cost, valves are not cheap compared with SS, one can get a 'Croft integrated line input, hybrid' for £850, Croft dont do remotes, for a MM valve type phono stage, ad £150. One quality amp for the price IMHO.

Something like the ST40 is the next step up, however, having had a Croft for 2 years, still have it up stairs, if I had to go back to it, I would not be that unhappy, the lack of a remote is not an issue for me. The problem is getting some one to sit down and listen to a valve amp, the bias against them soon falls away, then its a simple matter, 'is it what I want, does it work for me and can I afford it'?

Not everyone will like valve amps, but equally, few people listened to them objectively . . . thats with an open mind and put the bais to one side. Most people have the preconceived idea of how valve amps sounded back in the days of Quads II's and the like, modern designs dont sound like that, often sounding better than the equivalent SS . . . but you have to listen to know?

Lots of opinion, often uninformed?

:? CJSF

 

[plastic penguin]

Maybe I should of demoed more valve amps, but for the money I dont think anything else can touch it

:?

Come to think of it maybe not the ST40 is a beaut

Bit surprised you've only heard the Croft before plumping for the Icon. Before buying the Leema spent almost two years (not in one continuous audition) auditioning most SS amps under the sun, including Class A, up to around the £1800 mark.

 

[stevebrock]

PP

I see where your coming from but there's not competition around the price of the ST40, I listened, I loved, I bought........ End of story Bear in mind I am still hugely disappointed with the Elicit saga and to be honest couldn't stomach any more demos.

btw I failed to disclose after the 4th Elicit went back I demoed a creek destiny 2 and Primare both nice amps but to my ears falling short to the ST40

 

[CJSF]

Icon Audio made in China

Pathos made in Italy

For environmental, political, econoimic, and worker rights reasons I would choose Pathos.

In this modern age that in my opinion is not a good reason to choose a product. Be honest, we all want low cost . . . I do, I live on a fixed pension. The amount of goods that come from China etc, is staggering, if not complete, the components, almost impossible avoid it. I feel it is hypocritical or at best, naive to talk of 'only buying British made' . . . it is the ideal but a dream, we have become so greedy, Mr average would not be able to live, certainly as far as the world of hifi, electronics and computers are concerned.

Thats of course unless you were happy to take an enormous pay cut to make the product or the service you are involved in 'affordable' . . . that one is a 'chicken or egg' :?

The other side of course, why should workers in these countries have to work for pennies . . . ??? not a nice thought by our standards, however we cannot judge their circumstances by our standard of living, if it were to happen . . . it probably will and I believe standards should rise, then we will be back to 'cant afford it' :? Those who can, cast your mind back 50 years 'made in Japan' . . . ????????????

That said, quality is my concern, I bought Croft, a true British product? . . . where did the components come from? I use PMC speakers, certainly the ones I have were 'made in Luton', again, where did the components come from? I now use an Icon amp, made in China, designed and finished in the UK . . . so it goes on. We are tied to China, is there a way out?

CJSF

 

[plastic penguin]

PP

I see where your coming from but there's not competition around the price of the ST40, I listened, I loved, I bought........ End of story Bear in mind I am still hugely disappointed with the Elicit saga and to be honest couldn't stomach any more demos.

btw I failed to disclose after the 4th Elicit went back I demoed a creek destiny 2 and Primare both nice amps but to my ears falling short to the ST40

I know about the Creek Destiny and the Primare, from memory, you spoke about.

Good luck to ya, Steve. Genuinely pleased you like the amp so much. Now just concentrate on the forthcoming baby.

 

[Richard Allen]

That said, quality is my concern, I bought Croft, a true British product? . . . where did the components come from? I use PMC speakers, certainly the ones I have were 'made in Luton', again, where did the components come from? I now use an Icon amp, made in China, designed and finished in the UK . . . so it goes on. We are tied to China, is there a way out?

CJSF

In a nutshell, No!!. We started it back in 1997 when we gave back Hong Kong and the Portugese gave back Macau. Nothing wrong in that as far as it goes but in the rush to buy cheap and maximise profits we made one mistake. We let the infrastructure go that we had here. Businesses come and go but without the infrastructure and skills, they're gone for good.

Now, as Chinese wages rise from the initial bowl of soup and a fish head per week to real world amounts, plus the ever increasing shipping costs, plus the duty payable at the docks when the stuff arrives, tot that little lot up and in the next couple of years or so we could be looking at parity with having it all done here. It's a sad fact but it's true. But we can't do it here can we?. No infrastructure. To rebuild that would cost an arm and a leg.

Whether we like it or not CJSF, we're stuck with it.

EDIT: Just remembered another thread on here from not so long ago. Some people on here just don't give a Hoot where it's made so there you have it my friend.

 

[CJSF]

As you say Richard, no one gives a hoot, 'cheap' is the buy-word!!!. . . . I cast my mind back '50 years' . . . one has watched manufacturing give over to paper shuffling. The town I lived in had a healthy industrial section, the factories have been systematically knocked down and replaced with glass office type buildings, cant see it going back the other way?

Its a sad state we are in, importing more and more, exporting less and less :? We are being sold fairy tails . . . I'm old enough not to care, feel sorry for the young'ns, when they are approaching my age, they will still be expected to work, trouble is no one will want to employ them, frightening. Watch out, I could not do a full days work now . . .

The writing is on the wall, no one is taking any notice . . . :wall:

CJSF

 

[matthewpiano]

Being in the piano industry I am all too aware of these geographical and manufacturing issues. We once had a thriving piano building industry in this country and names like Challen, Broadwood, Chappell, Rogers, Collard & Collard, Hopkinson, Kemble, Knight, Danemann etc. were producing large quantities of instruments and finding buyers for them. Now we have virtually nothing, especially since Yamaha closed their Milton Keynes factory in 2009 and moved production of Kemble and Yamaha P-series pianos to their factory in Jakarta. All these names are now either gone completely or are simply transfer names used for pianos built in the Far East. The most painful twist is that many of these instruments are heavily based on old British frame designs.... With manufacturing costs increasing every year in China we are approaching a point where building in the UK could possibly be in prospect again, if only we had kept the skills and infrastructure alive on any sort of scale. We never competed with the German makers on all-out quality, but we made some very good pianos nevertheless and it is sad that getting back to the point would now be virtually impossible.

On the flip side, as a consumer, there is no way I could have bought a British made amplifier at the same price range that would come anywhere near the Exposure 1010, which is made at the company's factory in Malaysia. Being very familiar with both amplifiers I have to say the Exposure is in a different league to the still good Rega Brio-R, which is the shining example of what British manufacture can achieve at reasonable price points. Like most here, and as mentioned by CJSF, I am on a tight budget and I have to get the best I can for the money. However, my turntable and CD player were both made in Britain, and my speakers were made in Denmark so I am doing my bit to support British and European industry and I don't feel too guilty about the Malaysian made amp.

 

[Happy_Listner]

It sounds like you gave up already CJSF.

Keep thinking that way along with millions of other people and the day will come when workers in China will continute not being able to afford the very products that they make themsleves.

But most importantly for you and for your family is that you also will not be able to afford the things they make in China, no matter how cheap these products are, because you won't have a job.

If you think manufacturing jobs should go where labour is the cheapest then this will happen and the U.K. along with the rest of the West will become Second and even Third World economies and countries.

Think education and service jobs will save everyone in the West? China, India and others are investing just as much or more than Western countries are into Education.

If too many manufacturing and service jobs go to low wage countries then your wages will also have to go down. It will be the only way for you to compete in the world as a worker in the U.K.. Plain and simple.

What are you going to buy with your two pounds an hour job?

It's all just an economic Race to the Bottom!

Buy your audio gear from First World countries and support your economy and your way of life.

Support Democracies, Freedom and Liberty, Environmental protection and Workers Rights.

In most of these categories many low wage countries are lacking.

 

[CJSF]

It sounds like you gave up already CJSF.

Keep thinking that way along with millions of other people and the day will come when workers in China will continute not being able to afford the very products that they make themsleves.

But most importantly for you and for your family is that you also will not be able to afford the things they make in China, no matter how cheap these products are, because you won't have a job.

If you think manufacturing jobs should go where labour is the cheapest then this will happen and the U.K. along with the rest of the West will become Second and even Third World economies and countries.

Think education and service jobs will save everyone in the West? China, India and others are investing just as much or more than Western countries are into Education.

If too many manufacturing and service jobs go to low wage countries then your wages will also have to go down. It will be the only way for you to compete in the world as a worker in the U.K.. Plain and simple.

What are you going to buy with your two pounds an hour job?

It's all just an economic Race to the Bottom!

Buy your audio gear from First World countries and support your economy and your way of life.

Support Democracies, Freedom and Liberty, Environmental protection and Workers Rights.

In most of these categories many low wage countries are lacking.

Yep, I have given up, I dont have a family (that I recognise . . . or perhaps that they dont want to recognise me?) Retired, so dont have a job to worry about. Yeh, I certainly have nothing to worry about personally.

However, new 'English' doctors and nurses cant find jobs, graduates cant find a job . . . people wont work becaus they get to much off the state . . . others wont work because the job offered is below them . . . you know it dont stop there . . . Take you pick, why should I care. Britain is on the way down, on the skids at a rate knots!!!

As I say, we are being sold a fairy tail . . . lied to and we take it . . . 'Writing on the wall', there are some serious repercussions not far round the corner? In the mean time we can fiddle while Rome burns?

CJSF

 

[Happy_Listner]

CJSF,

I can understand your postition and agree with most of you wrote in your last post.

I am still going to do what I can, no matter how small of an impact it is, knowing that I fought the good fight.

Cheers :cheers:

 

[FennerMachine]

I've not demoed Pathos amps. Thought about it but never got around to it.

Icon Audio Stereo 40 with my Quad 21L2 speakers is the best combo of amps/speakers I have heard to date.

I can't remember why I started this topic – I think I read Pathos mentioned in another one about Icon Audio and wondered what other's experience was.

I think my quest is over. Icon Audio Stereo 40 it is then!

 

[stevebrock]

Yeeehaaaa

The beast has arrived!