Nagaoka MP20 help

[Crusoe80]

Thanks for having me in the forum !
I’m in the UK and have an SME 3009 S2 Improved fixed head shell fitted with a Nagaoka SP20 cartridge and stylus on a Thorens TD 160B turntable.
The turntable deck has been in storage for approximately 20 years and I am just restarting my vinyl journey. On playing a record I’m not getting an output or it’s distorted.
Looking at the stylus (see photos - one with stylus not fully inserted) it seems to have very little to no projection beyond the bottom of the cartridge. Pulling out the stylus from the cartridge and the stylus seems to project correctly. Would you agree something is wrong when the stylus is inserted into the cartridge? How should I test where the fault lies - cartridge, stylus or both ? I don’t want to buy another but if necessary what are the recommendations ( price range approx £120-£200) Thank you.

 

[Al ears]

Thanks for having me in the forum !
I’m in the UK and have an SME 3009 S2 Improved fixed head shell fitted with a Nagaoka SP20 cartridge and stylus on a Thorens TD 160B turntable.
The turntable deck has been in storage for approximately 20 years and I am just restarting my vinyl journey. On playing a record I’m not getting an output or it’s distorted.
Looking at the stylus (see photos - one with stylus not fully inserted) it seems to have very little to no projection beyond the bottom of the cartridge. Pulling out the stylus from the cartridge and the stylus seems to project correctly. Would you agree something is wrong when the stylus is inserted into the cartridge? How should I test where the fault lies - cartridge, stylus or both ? I don’t want to buy another but if necessary what are the recommendations ( price range approx £120-£200) Thank you.View attachment 8431View attachment 8432

Thanks for having me in the forum !
I’m in the UK and have an SME 3009 S2 Improved fixed head shell fitted with a Nagaoka SP20 cartridge and stylus on a Thorens TD 160B turntable.
The turntable deck has been in storage for approximately 20 years and I am just restarting my vinyl journey. On playing a record I’m not getting an output or it’s distorted.
Looking at the stylus (see photos - one with stylus not fully inserted) it seems to have very little to no projection beyond the bottom of the cartridge. Pulling out the stylus from the cartridge and the stylus seems to project correctly. Would you agree something is wrong when the stylus is inserted into the cartridge? How should I test where the fault lies - cartridge, stylus or both ? I don’t want to buy another but if necessary what are the recommendations ( price range approx £120-£200) Thank you.View attachment 8431View attachment 8432

Possible suspension damage / failure. A new stylus will be necessary however it may be more sensible to replace the whole cartridge as it is ancient

 

[Crusoe80]

Thanks, was afraid as much- any recommendations on a replacement?

 

[Al ears]

Thanks, was afraid as much- any recommendations on a replacement?

How much do you have to spend?

 

[camcroft]

I have the MP20 cartridge body and I use a MP11 stylus which sounds fine. You can use quite a few different styli? from the range. I certainly wouldn't spend the money they are asking for the MP200 stylus. After Covid Nagaoka have priced themselves out of the market in my opinion and I find that the AT - VM95ML is a much better option.

 

[Crusoe80]

How much do you have to spend?

For complete replacement of stylus and cartridge then £120-200, but if I can get away with just the stylus then perfect.

 

[Al ears]

For complete replacement of stylus and cartridge then £120-200, but if I can get away with just the stylus then perfect.

It may well mean the whole cartridge so the VM95ML already mentioned or, for a little more the Sumiko Olympia would be good alternatives.
Not sure about replacement stylii but you might get away with it. The cartridge itself is quite old so I would be looking at replacing the whole thing because if you get a new stylus only to find that wasn't the issue it could be money down the drain.

 

[daytona600]

20years in storage new belt , new bearing oil & new cartridge/styli
Fitting a new cartridge can be a complicated chore much easier with a SME 3009 S2 just plug in a new one
£100/200 Ortofon concorde music red or blue & you can upgrade the stylus in the future

https://stereonet.com/reviews/ortofon-concorde-music-bronze-cartridge-review

 

[Crusoe80]

20years in storage new belt , new bearing oil & new cartridge/styli
Fitting a new cartridge can be a complicated chore much easier with a SME 3009 S2 just plug in a new one
£100/200 Ortofon concorde music red or blue & you can upgrade the stylus in the future

https://stereonet.com/reviews/ortofon-concorde-music-bronze-cartridge-review

It is a great idea but I have the SME fixed headshell so guess the Concorde cannot work ?

 

[Al ears]

It is a great idea but I have the SME fixed headshell so guess the Concorde cannot work ?

Correct.
You will require a conventional cartridge

 

[nopiano]

Correct.
You will require a conventional cartridge

And a lot of patience/care. The fixed headshell SME was a fiddly thing!

 

[Crusoe80]

And a lot of patience/care. The fixed headshell SME was a fiddly thing!

Yes and the Nagaoka has no inbuilt threads so the fun of working with tiny nuts - result a couple of cartridge connectors pulled off their wires needing re soldering:-(

 

[Al ears]

And a lot of patience/care. The fixed headshell SME was a fiddly thing!

no more than others I think.

 

[Al ears]

Yes and the Nagaoka has no inbuilt threads so the fun of working with tiny nuts - result a couple of cartridge connectors pulled off their wires needing re soldering:-(

assuming he needs to remove the cartridge then yes. Knowledge of how to align a new cartridge wasn't mentioned.

 

[nopiano]

no more than others I think.

It’s a while ago, but I recall a limited upward movement, and the knife edge bearings, made it much harder than say a generic Rega arm.

95% of the cartridges I fitted in my prime (!) were on removable head shells, like SME, Dual and Technics. Even a removable headshell I find tricky nowadays!

 

[nopiano]

Yes and the Nagaoka has no inbuilt threads so the fun of working with tiny nuts - result a couple of cartridge connectors pulled off their wires needing re soldering:-(

Oh, my caution was too late! They are a faff, so take care with the soldering!

 

[Crusoe80]

It’s a while ago, but I recall a limited upward movement, and the knife edge bearings, made it much harder than say a generic Rega arm.

95% of the cartridges I fitted in my prime (!) were on removable head shells, like SME, Dual and Technics. Even a removable headshell I find tricky nowadays!

It’s been probably 30 years since I first set up the Nagaoka into the SME and 40 years since fitting the SME up so will need to remind myself of how to do it - and to get hold of the guides for all the different alignments!

 

[Al ears]

It’s a while ago, but I recall a limited upward movement, and the knife edge bearings, made it much harder than say a generic Rega arm.

95% of the cartridges I fitted in my prime (!) were on removable head shells, like SME, Dual and Technics. Even a removable headshell I find tricky nowadays!

Perhaps, never had a removable cartridge until my current tonearm and wasn't aware it was removable until after I fitted the cartridge..... Ho hum! ,