My 1st vinyl experience

[hybridauth_Facebook_664715932]

Hi all,

yesterday i went to one of my friends house for a listening session. We both got into hifi in early 90s and he still has his technics stacks from then.

recently he came back from india with some old vinlys from 60s 70s and 80s which he bought 2nd hand from street vendors in kolktata. He also bought a turntable , a basic 1 (£70) from RS, which he connected via aux with rca.

in comparison to the digital source i found the sound to be remarkably different. first thing that came to mind when we played the vinyls was how rich the music sounded, there was more music and less sound, everything we played seemed to have more life in them. Considering the system setup and quality of the vinyls: sound was still very impressive and i can imagine how good the sound must be with half decent system with better quality vinyls.

vinyl is definately something i would like to get into in future. Its a shame the kind of music i listen to is not readly available in vinyl format.

thanks for reading

 

[plastic penguin]

Hi all,

yesterday i went to one of my friends house for a listening session. We both got into hifi in early 90s and he still has his technics stacks from then.

recently he came back from india with some old vinlys from 60s 70s and 80s which he bought 2nd hand from street vendors in kolktata. He also bought a turntable , a basic 1 (£70) from RS, which he connected via aux with rca.

in comparison to the digital source i found the sound to be remarkably different. first thing that came to mind when we played the vinyls was how rich the music sounded, there was more music and less sound, everything we played seemed to have more life in them. Considering the system setup and quality of the vinyls: sound was still very impressive and i can imagine how good the sound must be with half decent system with better quality vinyls.

vinyl is definately something i would like to get into in future. Its a shame the kind of music i listen to is not readly available in vinyl format.

thanks for reading

Pleased you liked it, Animesh. I've always said that vinyl replay is no better or worse than any other format - it's different, and if possible, should be a part of anyone's collection.

Unlike you I don't find my budget Pro-ject warm, but is a little more emotive. This could be because I've upgraded the cartridge.

Any decent budget TT is a good place to start if you've never experience vinyl before.

 

[Gazzip]

The last Hifi audition I did ended early so the dealer, knowing that I have no record deck, offered to spin some vinyl for me. Couldn't see the harm in it so I accepted and some familiar tunes were duly spun. It was a high end Avid setup from memory and it sounded very impressive. Way more life to the sound than its digital counterpart. Maybe placebo who knows, but it set my interest running. If I had room for a turntable I would definitely invest in a basic model to see how I got on with it. Sadly having just downsized my system to save space I think that adding another box would be out of the question. For now.....

 

[MeanandGreen]

At the start of the year, a Pro-Ject Elemental in my main system. I enjoy records so much since getting it that I've added another Pro-Ject to my second system in my office.

Decent budget decks are surprisingly good and certainly sound good enough to be enjoyed and to live with. As an entry into vinyl I don't really think there is much to complain about.

 

[davedotco]

The last Hifi audition I did ended early so the dealer, knowing that I have no record deck, offered to spin some vinyl for me. Couldn't see the harm in it so I accepted and some familiar tunes were duly spun. It was a high end Avid setup from memory and it sounded very impressive. Way more life to the sound than its digital counterpart. Maybe placebo who knows, but it set my interest running. If I had room for a turntable I would definitely invest in a basic model to see how I got on with it. Sadly having just downsized my system to save space I think that adding another box would be out of the question. For now.....

That is probably a waste of time, and money.

Cheap record players do not sound like vinyl, they sound like cheap record players,

By that I mean that the dominant factor in the sound is the player, not the vinyl. Fine if you are a 'hipster' or want a bit of nostalgia, if you are serious, spend some money or let it go.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Vinyl hipster here and lovin' it *biggrin*

 

[plastic penguin]

The last Hifi audition I did ended early so the dealer, knowing that I have no record deck, offered to spin some vinyl for me. Couldn't see the harm in it so I accepted and some familiar tunes were duly spun. It was a high end Avid setup from memory and it sounded very impressive. Way more life to the sound than its digital counterpart. Maybe placebo who knows, but it set my interest running. If I had room for a turntable I would definitely invest in a basic model to see how I got on with it. Sadly having just downsized my system to save space I think that adding another box would be out of the question. For now.....

That is probably a waste of time, and money.

Cheap record players do not sound like vinyl, they sound like cheap record players,

By that I mean that the dominant factor in the sound is the player, not the vinyl. Fine if you are a 'hipster' or want a bit of nostalgia, if you are serious, spend some money or let it go.

Wrong! Don't agree one little bit. Compare a £300 CDP with price compatible turntable and the latter has more realism and musical involvement IMO. Cheap is cheap regardless of the aforementioned format.

Generally speaking I like reading your posts, but over the last few months you have been scathing of us "clueless individuals" was one term you used. It is us 'clueless individuals' that have made you a good living for many years.

The second point is you are always dismayed that people ask you for an opinion on their system. Tough! You put yourself up as the 'great white hope' in hi-fi, people will automatically ask for your opinion. That's the nature of the business. Same with me, people who have no wish to buy any of my products ask for my opinion - I just roll with it.

I think enthusiasts deserve a little respect regardless of how good or bad you think their choices/knowledge is.

 

[knaithrover]

The last Hifi audition I did ended early so the dealer, knowing that I have no record deck, offered to spin some vinyl for me. Couldn't see the harm in it so I accepted and some familiar tunes were duly spun. It was a high end Avid setup from memory and it sounded very impressive. Way more life to the sound than its digital counterpart. Maybe placebo who knows, but it set my interest running. If I had room for a turntable I would definitely invest in a basic model to see how I got on with it. Sadly having just downsized my system to save space I think that adding another box would be out of the question. For now.....

That is probably a waste of time, and money.

Cheap record players do not sound like vinyl, they sound like cheap record players,

By that I mean that the dominant factor in the sound is the player, not the vinyl. Fine if you are a 'hipster' or want a bit of nostalgia, if you are serious, spend some money or let it go.

Hipster? Haha, guilty.

 

[MajorFubar]

Wrong! Don't agree one little bit. Compare a £300 CDP with price compatible turntable and the latter has more realism and musical involvement IMO. Cheap is cheap regardless of the aforementioned format.

Unfortunaely I haven't found that to be the case. At the low end of the spectrum, to my ears digital formats (CDs, streaming, whatever) wipe the floor with analogue because it costs a lot of money to get analogue right. It's all about the quality of the engineering, which doesn't come cheap. That said, it completely depends on the sound you're looking for.

 

[davedotco]

The last Hifi audition I did ended early so the dealer, knowing that I have no record deck, offered to spin some vinyl for me. Couldn't see the harm in it so I accepted and some familiar tunes were duly spun. It was a high end Avid setup from memory and it sounded very impressive. Way more life to the sound than its digital counterpart. Maybe placebo who knows, but it set my interest running. If I had room for a turntable I would definitely invest in a basic model to see how I got on with it. Sadly having just downsized my system to save space I think that adding another box would be out of the question. For now.....

That is probably a waste of time, and money.

Cheap record players do not sound like vinyl, they sound like cheap record players,

By that I mean that the dominant factor in the sound is the player, not the vinyl. Fine if you are a 'hipster' or want a bit of nostalgia, if you are serious, spend some money or let it go.

Wrong! Don't agree one little bit. Compare a £300 CDP with price compatible turntable and the latter has more realism and musical involvement IMO. Cheap is cheap regardless of the aforementioned format.

Generally speaking I like reading your posts, but over the last few months you have been scathing of us "clueless individuals" was one term you used. It is us 'clueless individuals' that have made you a good living for many years.

The second point is you are always dismayed that people ask you for an opinion on their system. Tough! You put yourself up as the 'great white hope' in hi-fi, people will automatically ask for your opinion. That's the nature of the business. Same with me, people who have no wish to buy any of my products ask for my opinion - I just roll with it.

I think enthusiasts deserve a little respect regardless of how good or bad you think their choices/knowledge is.

And yes, they are often (on some subjects anyway) presented in a provocative way, gets a reaction and sometimes gets people thinking. I am happy to get some of the responses I do and, believe it or not, I do take them on board.

I hope I am not scathing to those who post views that are different to my own, or offer comment on my 'style' (like you PP), but I will continue to 'call' those who, though woefully uninformed, offer advice and opinions that will lead others astray.

In my own defence, I can point to numerous threads where I have attempted to help people starting in this hobby with clear, straightforward advice that I hope will be worthwhile and done so without pushing any particular agenda.

In addition, I rarely comment on the sound quality of specific components or systems, my views are some way off the mainstream so that would be overly contentious, though I do occasionally react to posters who do nothing but plug their current favourite brand in every situation.

 

[unhalfbricking]

OK...vinyl. Do I miss the 'snap, crackle and pop' of indifferent pressings, off-centre pressings, background noise, dust, sound quality degradation towards the end of an album side, stylus wear, static, dust-cleaning devices, and boxes of records taking over the room? No. Absolutely not.

Are there occasions when I think that a particular CD sounds a tad thin and 'clinical' compared to listening to the same album on vinyl. Yes. Is vinyl worth all the faff and the hassle for that occasional intangible improvement in sound quality? Not for me, I'm afraid. I do miss my old singles though!

 

[plastic penguin]

The last Hifi audition I did ended early so the dealer, knowing that I have no record deck, offered to spin some vinyl for me. Couldn't see the harm in it so I accepted and some familiar tunes were duly spun. It was a high end Avid setup from memory and it sounded very impressive. Way more life to the sound than its digital counterpart. Maybe placebo who knows, but it set my interest running. If I had room for a turntable I would definitely invest in a basic model to see how I got on with it. Sadly having just downsized my system to save space I think that adding another box would be out of the question. For now.....

That is probably a waste of time, and money.

Cheap record players do not sound like vinyl, they sound like cheap record players,

By that I mean that the dominant factor in the sound is the player, not the vinyl. Fine if you are a 'hipster' or want a bit of nostalgia, if you are serious, spend some money or let it go.

Wrong! Don't agree one little bit. Compare a £300 CDP with price compatible turntable and the latter has more realism and musical involvement IMO. Cheap is cheap regardless of the aforementioned format.

Generally speaking I like reading your posts, but over the last few months you have been scathing of us "clueless individuals" was one term you used. It is us 'clueless individuals' that have made you a good living for many years.

The second point is you are always dismayed that people ask you for an opinion on their system. Tough! You put yourself up as the 'great white hope' in hi-fi, people will automatically ask for your opinion. That's the nature of the business. Same with me, people who have no wish to buy any of my products ask for my opinion - I just roll with it.

I think enthusiasts deserve a little respect regardless of how good or bad you think their choices/knowledge is.

And yes, they are often (on some subjects anyway) presented in a provocative way, gets a reaction and sometimes gets people thinking. I am happy to get some of the responses I do and, believe it or not, I do take them on board.

I hope I am not scathing to those who post views that are different to my own, or offer comment on my 'style' (like you PP), but I will continue to 'call' those who, though woefully uninformed, offer advice and opinions that will lead others astray.

In my own defence, I can point to numerous threads where I have attempted to help people starting in this hobby with clear, straightforward advice that I hope will be worthwhile and done so without pushing any particular agenda.

In addition, I rarely comment on the sound quality of specific components or systems, my views are some way off the mainstream so that would be overly contentious, though I do occasionally react to posters who do nothing but plug their current favourite brand in every situation.

Have to remember that this site was originally set-up for amateurs or people who've not ventured into the strange world of hi-fi retail. I know many times yours have been helpful - based purely on opinion. That's the same for all of us. But there have been times, let me re-word the phrase, where your views on certain subjects have been "less than complimentary".

Sometimes it's good to let some people make their own mistakes. I've lost count the amount of times since 2008 I've given advice and they haven't taken it - again, that's the nature of forums, and usually when they have found the right combo I'm the first to applaude them, even if I've had experience of their choice and not particularly liked it.

Back on topic. When I first purchased the Pro-ject I ahd the Arcam CD73T. Very good CDP in its day but the basic Xpression, after upgrading the cartridge, when comparing like-for-like had more realism. It was audible to Mrs. P. She was the first to mention the difference... she has no interest in hi-fis whatsoever.

 

[chebby]

PP, I wouldn't bother if I were you. Enjoy what you can afford.

Dave is talking about TTs like his old SME (and similar exotica that he has owned and sold as a dealer) and he is right about their capabilities to create vast, holographic sound spaces that can even stretch behind the listener's head (even beyond the room) with a properly chosen system. I have witnessed it just once or twice and know what's possible with a few tens of thousands of pounds (that was early 1980s £s) spent on something from Oracle and Koetsu played through Audio Research and Krell's finest.

Whereas I survived (and continued to derive much pleasure from far more prosaic gear) Dave's 'bar' has remained permanently stuck very high and a budget deck will never do it for him.

 

[Vladimir]

We are forgeting that vinyl will have a different mastering than CD. But I do agree many of those that went the vinyl revival path will enjoy the sound more from their LPs than from a perfectly mastered CD. Pure water is boring and sometimes you want soda, beer, wine, tonic. No fansy advertising and packaging for water and no fizzy and busy tastes. No doubt about it they are more interesting. If your whole life is limited to 300 albums going on repeat, you need something to spice things up.

 

[davedotco]

PP, I wouldn't bother if I were you. Enjoy what you can afford.

Dave is talking about TTs like his old SME (and similar exotica that he has owned and sold as a dealer) and he is right about their capabilities to create vast, holographic sound spaces that can even stretch behind the listener's head (even beyond the room) with a properly chosen system. I have witnessed it just once or twice and know what's possible with a few tens of thousands of pounds (that was early 1980s £s) spent on something from Oracle and Koetsu played through Audio Research and Krell's finest.

Whereas I survived (and continued to derive much pleasure from far more prosaic gear) Dave's 'bar' has remained permanently stuck very high and a budget deck will never do it for him.

I have to say that there is some truth in what you say but I think/hope I am able to have a degree of perspective when it comes to the high priced exotica. I know that it is beyond many peoples means and the prime reason I gave up on vinyl playback some 15-16 years back was the cost, both the initial purchase and the very necessary maintenance.

Trying to be realistic, I think the market is really missing what I call 'entry level hi-end' players, the modern equivilent of a Xerxes or PT with the Rb300 arm or even, God forbid, the early Linn Basik setup. These players were, and I think still are, significantly better than the simple 'plug and play' devices that dominate todays budget and mid range players but they came at a cost.

Not just a financial price, but a price in terms of time and expertese by the dealer, the price of a proper support, setup in the home and other factors that are no longer considered viable in the current market.

 

[Vladimir]

The most expensive and highest end exotica TT is less accurate than the cheapest portable CD player.

 

[Vladimir]

Half my post gone missing. Nevermind.

I was saying that it doesn't matter how great the player is since it cannot surpass the limitations of the media. No turntable can be more accurate than any CDP because of the limitations of vinyl. Invest milions in it with laser guidance and hydraulics and whatever, it will still be playing a $2 poorly smashed bit of plastic.

On the other end have the cheapest ASDA CDP and play a well mastered and well recorded music on CD, it will be superior in all possible ways. This is not because the player is so well made, it's the media.

 

[chebby]

Half my post gone missing. Nevermind.

I was saying that it doesn't matter how great the player is since it cannot surpass the limitations of the media. No turntable can be more accurate than any CDP because of the limitations of vinyl. Invest milions in it with laser guidance and hydraulics and whatever, it will still be playing a $2 poorly smashed bit of plastic.

On the other end have the cheapest ASDA CDP and play a well mastered and well recorded music on CD, it will be superior in all possible ways. This is not because the player is so well made, it's the media.

Devil's advocate? Thompsonuxb impersonation? What are we today?

I can't read you 'straight' any more.

 

[Vladimir]

Half my post gone missing. Nevermind.

I was saying that it doesn't matter how great the player is since it cannot surpass the limitations of the media. No turntable can be more accurate than any CDP because of the limitations of vinyl. Invest milions in it with laser guidance and hydraulics and whatever, it will still be playing a $2 poorly smashed bit of plastic.

On the other end have the cheapest ASDA CDP and play a well mastered and well recorded music on CD, it will be superior in all possible ways. This is not because the player is so well made, it's the media.

Devil's advocate? Thompsonuxb impersonation? What are we today?

I can't read you 'straight' any more.

What part of it you are struggling to comprehend?

 

[chebby]

Half my post gone missing. Nevermind.

I was saying that it doesn't matter how great the player is since it cannot surpass the limitations of the media. No turntable can be more accurate than any CDP because of the limitations of vinyl. Invest milions in it with laser guidance and hydraulics and whatever, it will still be playing a $2 poorly smashed bit of plastic.

On the other end have the cheapest ASDA CDP and play a well mastered and well recorded music on CD, it will be superior in all possible ways. This is not because the player is so well made, it's the media.

Devil's advocate? Thompsonuxb impersonation? What are we today?

I can't read you 'straight' any more.

What part of it you are struggling to comprehend?

Comprehension is easy. It's a very easy to understand argument, but I don't know which 'you' is making it.

 

[Covenanter]

Half my post gone missing. Nevermind.

I was saying that it doesn't matter how great the player is since it cannot surpass the limitations of the media. No turntable can be more accurate than any CDP because of the limitations of vinyl. Invest milions in it with laser guidance and hydraulics and whatever, it will still be playing a $2 poorly smashed bit of plastic.

On the other end have the cheapest ASDA CDP and play a well mastered and well recorded music on CD, it will be superior in all possible ways. This is not because the player is so well made, it's the media.

Devil's advocate? Thompsonuxb impersonation? What are we today?

I can't read you 'straight' any more.

What part of it you are struggling to comprehend?

Comprehension is easy. It's a very easy to understand argument, but I don't know which 'you' is making it.

Does it matter which Vlad it is? It is fundamentally true, vinyl is inherently inaccurate. I know people love it but as on the thread here about accuracy, etc it's about "nice noise" rather than accuracy.

Chris

 

[BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW]

CD is more clinical, but I'll never understand how a series of ones and noughts can contain the emotions and subtleties in recorded music, it can't.

 

[Vladimir]

Half my post gone missing. Nevermind.

I was saying that it doesn't matter how great the player is since it cannot surpass the limitations of the media. No turntable can be more accurate than any CDP because of the limitations of vinyl. Invest milions in it with laser guidance and hydraulics and whatever, it will still be playing a $2 poorly smashed bit of plastic.

On the other end have the cheapest ASDA CDP and play a well mastered and well recorded music on CD, it will be superior in all possible ways. This is not because the player is so well made, it's the media.

Devil's advocate? Thompsonuxb impersonation? What are we today?

I can't read you 'straight' any more.

What part of it you are struggling to comprehend?

Comprehension is easy. It's a very easy to understand argument, but I don't know which 'you' is making it.

Now everytime my grammar is not up to snuff I'll get paranoid responses. Great...

 

[drummerman]

Half my post gone missing. Nevermind.

I was saying that it doesn't matter how great the player is since it cannot surpass the limitations of the media. No turntable can be more accurate than any CDP because of the limitations of vinyl. Invest milions in it with laser guidance and hydraulics and whatever, it will still be playing a $2 poorly smashed bit of plastic.

On the other end have the cheapest ASDA CDP and play a well mastered and well recorded music on CD, it will be superior in all possible ways. This is not because the player is so well made, it's the media.

Devil's advocate? Thompsonuxb impersonation? What are we today?

I can't read you 'straight' any more.

What part of it you are struggling to comprehend?

Comprehension is easy. It's a very easy to understand argument, but I don't know which 'you' is making it.

Now everytime my grammar is not up to snuff I'll get paranoid responses. Great...

It may have something to do with the endless (but admittedly often funny) sarcasm of yours ... .

 

[Al ears]

Half my post gone missing. Nevermind.

I was saying that it doesn't matter how great the player is since it cannot surpass the limitations of the media. No turntable can be more accurate than any CDP because of the limitations of vinyl. Invest milions in it with laser guidance and hydraulics and whatever, it will still be playing a $2 poorly smashed bit of plastic.

On the other end have the cheapest ASDA CDP and play a well mastered and well recorded music on CD, it will be superior in all possible ways. This is not because the player is so well made, it's the media.

I take your point but only up to a point. The term 'well recorded' when it comes to a lot of CDs is a misnomer these days which is why I prefer most on well mastered and well pressed vinyl.

You tend to get a lot more idea on the quality when reading into the making of a particular LP, there is little info on the actual quality of a CD and, quite a bit recently, I have felt that I have wasted my money on CDs.