More thoughts on upgrading

[jaxwired]

Big Chris started an interesting thread a few days ago about how frequent upgrading is often maligned when maybe it should be looked at as a pursuit of excellence. This touched a chord with me (no pun intended, lol) . Why do people get caught up in upgrade mania?

I acknowledge that there are many people who stick with their gear for many years unchanged. This post is for the rest of us. The reasons for this constant box swapping are obviously numerous and there is no single answer. However, after some thought I feel the following are 2 major factors.

1. When you first dive into hifi and you buy your first quality budget system, there is immediate gratification. The sound quality (SQ) improvement is typically pretty big. This big jump in SQ is one of the causes of upgrade mania. Once we experience this big jump in SQ, we want to achieve it again by spending more and moving further up the chain. Unfortunately, the biggest gains in SQ are typically in the budget category. SQ improvements are not linear with cost. High end gear tend to offer smaller and more subtle improvements. So chasing that initial SQ boost when you went from a cheap boombox to a NAD or CA setup is a bit elusive as you move up the chain in cost.

2. When you first move to a quality hifi system, your best recordings will sound even better, and your worst recordings will sound even worse. This is because distortion has been reduced and you can now more clearly hear the quality of the recording. So, rather than all your CD having a sound qaulity range of say 4 to 6 (on a 1-10 scale), now your worst recordings are a 2 and your best recordings are a 9. This is because a low end poor quality system makes everything sound somewhat similar. On a high quality system you can hear compression, sibilance, over blown bass, and many other recording anomalies that are masked by a low fi system. And truly great recordings will blow you away. So now your scale is much broader. You now want all your recordings to sound like a 9. Before you purchased a quality system, you were blissfully unaware of how good some recordings can sound. Now that you know, you want everything to sound that good and that creates dissatisfaction with your system. Unfortunately, it's often the fault of the recording and not the system so therefore it cannot be improved by upgrading, but people will still try.

Yes, I know, I'm over thinking this. LOL, it's what i do...

 

[plastic penguin]

I've touched on this before, and I concur. I find upgrading can be tedious, and how many have asked advice about changing amps that are effectively like-for-like? This is why I went from budget amp to a far more pricier model. For the extra sound quality it's worth spending a little extra.

Some will say what if we don't have the money to go that little bit extra? my answer is simple: Stick with what you've got until you can. It's so simple and logical, but we are all individuals with individual concepts. That's probably why we all love hi-fis.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Jax and pp,

I think you both make good points, but I think for some of us swapping 'like for like' isn't even about upgrading. I have kept myself busy with buying different (vintage) amps (see sig + Pioneer SA-7500 II, Pioneer SA-506, Onkyo A-22, Marantz PM-40SE, Marantz PM-4001 etc), cleaning and fixing them when necessary and after some period of time, selling them. I liked most of these amps, some of them very, very much, but I just think it's great to have a taste of so many different decent-to-great amps. If that makes sense.

Oh: and I never forget to just sit back and enjoy the music.

Jack

 

[plastic penguin]

Jack White:

Hi Jax and pp,

I think you both make good points, but I think for some of us swapping 'like for like' isn't even about upgrading. I have kept myself busy with buying different (vintage) amps (see sig + Pioneer SA-7500 II, Pioneer SA-506, Onkyo A-22, Marantz PM-40SE, Marantz PM-4001 etc), cleaning and fixing them when necessary and after some period of time, selling them. I liked most of these amps, some of them very, very much, but I just think it's great to have a taste of so many different decent-to-great amps. If that makes sense.

Oh: and I never forget to just sit back and enjoy the music.

Jack

True, I can associate that with clssic cars: Once upon a time I bought old bangers, made them roadworthy again; tremendous buzz. Didn't make any real money, just did it for the thrill.

Perplexed? well, when someone says, for example: "I have a Marantz and exchange it for a Cambridge 640V2" and expect hi-fi heaven - it doesn't happen.

 

[idc]

Hifi satisfaction can be found if you strip away all of the "audiophilia" that plagues the industry and drives it on by continually producing 'better' products which may have a nicer button to push, but probably sound very similar to the last range. Recent products have been worthwhile in terms of bringing PC based audio into the mainstream, but again sound quality has not actually changed that much. Hence the raging debates over the sound of vinyl, CD and music files that cannot come to any conclusion.

I think that sideways 'upgrades' can be worthwhile as you do not and cannot buy hifi by sound alone. You buy it with looks, image, reviews as much if not more than sound. So there could well be something about Marantz that makes you happier than Cambridge and happier means the mind is more likely to appreciate the sound.

 

[Anonymous]

plastic penguin:
True, I can associate that with clssic cars: Once upon a time I bought old bangers, made them roadworthy again; tremendous buzz. Didn't make any real money, just did it for the thrill.

That's a good comparison. For me hifi is also, at least partly, about the thrill of having a well crafted, working 'machine'.

plastic penguin:

Perplexed? well, when someone says, for example: "I have a Marantz and
exchange it for a Cambridge 640V2" and expect hi-fi heaven - it doesn't
happen.

That's true as well, but to be honest it also depends on your definition of hifi heaven. I know I cannot afford real high end kit, and realise that there is a limit to what my budget can buy. With that in mind I can be perfectly happy with a good combination of decent older kit that is more than the sum of its parts.

 

[Anonymous]

idc:
I think that sideways 'upgrades' can be worthwhile as you do not and cannot buy hifi by sound alone. You buy it with looks, image, reviews as much if not more than sound. So there could well be something about Marantz that makes you happier than Cambridge and happier means the mind is more likely to appreciate the sound.

Agreed. I somehow have a thing for 90s Marantz amps and 70s Pioneers, and feel a slight discomfort at my current Sony being, well, a Sony. But when I switch it on, look at the massive VU-meters lighting up, and play some music, I can look past that... for the time being!

 

[bluebrazil]

i think jax wants some morale support to buy the C1,s. my advice is worthless but here it is anyways, if you aint gonna starve your family and maybe tho next years holiday might have to be downgraded, at least you will have something that you always wanted.

 

[idc]

I like 1970s Japanese headphones. Currently listening to about 15 year old AKG K340s that are better than any other headphone I have ever heard.

Upgrading where you consider vintage kit as well as the latest model gives you so much more choice and possibilities.

 

[Anonymous]

Same with watches...buy your first watch......like TagHeuer, longines, ...and the "watch-eitis" comes around the corner.......

 

[ESP2009]

Personally, having only really been bitten by the upgrade bug very recently, I am having difficulty keeping my 'sensible head' on. I told myself it wasn't worth going beyond a certain level, but as Jaxwired said in the first place, once you take the first step it becomes so tempting to steal that extra decibel of quality and pleasure - somehow, anyhow!

I really, really wish that I had the time, the money, the opportunity to try out the vast number of possibilities out there. What I have now is good, but is it the best I can get at the price point? Is there something that sounds as good and looks better? What if I tried different combinations of all the components? If I could get away with it, would spending money on an improved mains supply squeeze even greater performance out of what I have? The list goes on. I would love to try them all.

But I can't...and I know that very soon I must stop this Quixotic quest for a system that sounds great with everything my partner and I throw at it, regardless of volume. The grass is always greener - live with it! Reading the forum posts does not help one iota. It just takes one member to post something about a piece of kit that is affordable and there I am again - wondering if I should give it a go.

So, great post - it makes you think.

 

[bluebrazil]

well done on the 19's, i dont think you can go wrong with atc's.

 

[ID.]

For those of us who don't get suckered into trading sideways there's the temptations of cables, isolators, stands, racks...to try and improve what we've got.

 

[the record spot]

Only ever interested in upgrading core kit, but have reached a sensible point at which to stop for now. The Sansui amp was such a step up, it was a surprise and with little to be gained in upgrading sources for the time being, it's easy for me to stop wondering how to improve a sound which is already excellent.

In fact, the thing earlier about making all the recordings sound good is a limitation most systems will have in as much as they're entirely at the mercy of the people making the recording and steering the mastering process thereafter. I'm at a point now where many of my recordings sound superb because I've clapped hands on the right versions. That, more than any ancillary upgrade, has reaped far greater rewards.