Linn Sneaky or stay with laptop

[SteveR750]

Yep. I can gracefully withdraw.

Means I could potentially get the 10 yr old Alfa 166 V6 lurking in the garage across the road from me maybe.... >)

 

[Overdose]

Why not replace the DACMagic Plus with the Stream Magic 6? That would seem to be an ideal solution, although I doubt you'd notice any significant sound quality differences, you would get all of the inputs/outputs of your DACmagic, but also have the ability to stream, without the additional cost of a hig end badge.

Also, as the SM6 has a digital pre amp, you could use it to control a power amp or two. A couple of M2 power amps perhaps. 8)

 

[tino]

Laptop?... Streamer? ... CD player? ... NAS? why not just put them all in one box ...

Just stumbled across this .... http://www.trigon-audio.de/index.php?id=150&L=1 ... reckon it'll be pricey though.

http://www.trigon-audio.de/index.php?id=150&L=1

 

[SteveR750]

@Overdose, I'd thought of this solution also. Solves the need to avoid relying on a laptop, but no improvement is SQ. I am probably more inclined to upgrade the DAC and keep the PC.

I haven't really decided on anything yet, too busy at work, family, cycling, blah blah...

 

[Overdose]

Well it looks like my sub has just packed up, with no prospect of replacement (on account of it being superceded), so the DACmagic plus is a step closer.

 

[moon]

Bit of a shame it has no remote, not a problem if its a desk system.

 

[acalex]

To be honest I went from PC-->DAC to Streamer (Logitech SBT) because I was fed up of having to switch the pc on every time I wanted to listen to music. I had a fixed pc only as a player. I like more to have a tool which is exclusively dedicated to music and I can switch on and off with a remote in a few second.

I am not a big fun of leaving stuff on all the time so a cheap laptop dedicated doesn't work for me. I bough a SBT and a NAS and it works perfectly fine...only advantages

 

[SteveR750]

To be honest I went from PC-->DAC to Streamer (Logitech SBT) because I was fed up of having to switch the pc on every time I wanted to listen to music. I had a fixed pc only as a player. I like more to have a tool which is exclusively dedicated to music and I can switch on and off with a remote in a few second.

I am not a big fun of leaving stuff on all the time so a cheap laptop dedicated doesn't work for me. I bough a SBT and a NAS and it works perfectly fine...only advantages

This was one of the reasons I was considering a streamer, but assume dthat there *might* be a sonic improvement too. If not, then i cannot jsutify spedning extra just for cenvenience, especially as with the PC all of my music (FLAC and spotify) is portable, which is extremely useful as I spend every other weekend away from home

 

[poldo]

I used to have a macbook pro, alac, amarra junior to my dac but when I tested the Naim UnitiServe it was a big difference, I kept the UnitiServe. The Naim ND5xs is a very nice source too.

A good digital interlink will upgrade the sound too when you use the UnitiServe, you have nice speakers so you need a good source. :dance:

 

[paradiziac]

This was one of the reasons I was considering a streamer, but assume dthat there *might* be a sonic improvement too.

It's quite possible, depending on the actual kit. The idea that there can't be any difference "because it's all a bit perfect digital file" doesn't square with most people's experience.

I've heard improvements each time I upgraded aspects of my computer set-up (e.g. computer itself, USB converter/re-clocker, digital leads...). That said, it's only been a fairly small improvement--the analogue bit of the DAC is more significant.

I can quite see that a hi-end streamer could be technically advantageous, however...most folks with systems up to 5K seem happy with Squeezeboxes or computers so the difference can't really be that massive.

 

[Craig M.]

i wonder if any of these improvements would stand up to a blind test? i think the only dac that would show genuine differences between bit perfect streams would be something that didn't reject jitter properly, which most modern ones do, because what else is there? for instance, Steves dacmagic+ is just about flawless in this regard and over usb is (iirc) about 100x better than my benchmark - which also rejects jitter perfectly well!

 

[poldo]

If you want to read some honest reviews, try this website.

http://www.hifi-advice.com/

I did blind test a lot of stuff, apple tv, macmini, macbook pro, acer tower pc, streamers and rippers. I never get good results with usb/toslink the sound is way to thin and liveless (my taste). squeezebox sounds ok, but not great, unitiserve was perfect, better than my cd transport on the same dac.

 

[Craig M.]

If you want to read some honest reviews, try this website.

http://www.hifi-advice.com/

I did blind test a lot of stuff, apple tv, macmini, macbook pro, acer tower pc, streamers and rippers. I never get good results with usb/toslink the sound is way to thin and liveless (my taste). squeezebox sounds ok, but not great, unitiserve was perfect, better than my cd transport on the same dac.

i'd look at a new dac then, one that rejects incoming jitter would've saved you a lot of money.

and that review site doesn't contain any blind tests that i can see, so is completely useless and unreliable to me. you're at the mercy of what side of the bed he got out of, or what he had for lunch, and that's before we get anywhere near any preconceived ideas he may have.

 

[paradiziac]

i wonder if any of these improvements would stand up to a blind test? i think the only dac that would show genuine differences between bit perfect streams would be something that didn't reject jitter properly, which most modern ones do, because what else is there? for instance, Steves dacmagic+ is just about flawless in this regard and over usb is (iirc) about 100x better than my benchmark - which also rejects jitter perfectly well!

:roll:

I've ABX-ed digital files, but to ABX anything else properly requires a way to do level matching and to swap components over within a couple of seconds. Suffice to say, if over time, I believe something doesn't make an audible difference or isn't worth the extra cost, it doesn't stay in the system.

 

[poldo]

well I did a blind test, an no review is useless, please .... :wall:

I tested new exposure + naim dac, not the worst you can get and much better then CA dac.

 

[Craig M.]

well I did a blind test, an no review is useless, please .... :wall:

I tested new exposure + naim dac, not the worst you can get and much better then CA dac.

how did you conduct the blind tests? were they as paradiziac mentions in his post, a/b-x and all level matched? much better than a dacmagic+? show me the measurements that prove they reject jitter better than the dm+.

and i did say in my post that to me, those reviews are indeed useless for the reasons i gave. to deny the outside influences that can alter the way we perceive sound is foolish imo, and the reason only a blind ab/x means anything to me.

 

[poldo]

well I did a blind test, an no review is useless, please .... :wall:

I tested new exposure + naim dac, not the worst you can get and much better then CA dac.

how did you conduct the blind tests? were they as paradiziac mentions in his post, a/b-x and all level matched? much better than a dacmagic+? show me the measurements that prove they reject jitter better than the dm+.

and i did say in my post that to me, those reviews are indeed useless for the reasons i gave. to deny the outside influences that can alter the way we perceive sound is foolish imo, and the reason only a blind ab/x means anything to me.

you sound like.....is this your own opinion or someone else, did you demo these products by yourself? I know products who prove low jitter but in practice it sounds different to other.

Or do you think apple tv / squeezebox will sound the same as a Linn on the same dac? Well it does not, sorry.

 

[Craig M.]

is what my opinion? the fact that the dm+ is pretty much flawless in its rejection of jitter? no, it's a fact.

is it my opinion that 'audiophile' streamers are yet another hifi version of the emporers new clothes? yes, it is. when i see one pass an ab/x test, i'll take notice. if the maker is so confident it's better, they should submit one for testing, it would put the matter to bed, or at least lend some credence. it is the dac that's important and they needn't cost much at all (relatively) to be excellent.

do i think a mac or something equally 'non-audiophile' will sound the same as a linn? haven't tried a linn into my dac, but every single other digital transport i've tried through it, as well as the qbd76 i had before it, sounds exactly the same. with the right equipment it is easy to measure the jitter, and if that is at an inaudible level then that is good enough for me, i can't hear what isn't there. which leaves the bit stream, even a cheap dvd player can get that right. so, as you can see, no need to apologise, i have a load of inconvenient facts and blind listening tests to back up my opinion and you have your opinion. at the end of the day though if it all floats your boat, then fill your boots.

 

[John Duncan]

I'm not sure I'd trust Ken Rockwell to measure a 12" ruler...

 

[moon]

How did this thread get into ABX testing?

 

[moon]

Give it a week and every thread in this forum will end like this! :rant:

 

[CnoEvil]

do i think a mac or something equally 'non-audiophile' will sound the same as a linn? haven't tried a linn into my dac, but every single other digital transport i've tried through it, as well as the qbd76 i had before it, sounds exactly the same.

Craig, am I right in thinking you are talking about using the Linn as a transport into your Dac?......if this is the case, it (imo) only makes sense if you use the Linn as it was intended ie. as a streamer through its own Dac.

 

[Craig M.]

Or do you think apple tv / squeezebox will sound the same as a Linn on the same dac? Well it does not, sorry.

cno, it was in response to this. i agree that there would be no point in doing this.

 

[CnoEvil]

Or do you think apple tv / squeezebox will sound the same as a Linn on the same dac? Well it does not, sorry.

cno, it was in response to this. i agree that there would be no point in doing this.

Sorry, I understand now. Thx

 

[paradiziac]

OK, I'm not trying to convince Craig as I can't properly ABX my gear, but for any other interested bystanders who will accept a lesser standard of "proof"...

I dusted off my old NAD521i, test track Nitin Sawhey "Tides". Co-ax out from NAD into Au51 DAC. Result, muddy all-round. No separation/layering of instruments, extension of soundstage outside speakers, looser, muddy bass, cymbals don't shimmer and decay like they should.

Then CD into a £20 USB DVD drive-->iTunes on the Macmini-->Art Legato USB converter-->same coax lead into same DAC. Result, no comparision, you'd be deaf not to tell the difference and everything missing above is back. For a laugh, I then played the track on Spotify. On a casual listen I can't tell the difference from the CD i.e. even Spotify through the Mini/Legato killed the CD transport into the same DAC.

Maybe there's something wrong with my DAC :rofl: