chebby
Well-known member
Andy Clough:Necessary? Not necessarily. Desirable? Yes.
Andy, what is your 'not necessarily necessary, but desirable' CD player then?
Andy, what is your 'not necessarily necessary, but desirable' CD player then?
When the time comes (i.e. I have another job and I can use some of my payoff redundancy cheque!) I plan to have the Marantz CDP opened up and modded - this is the SA7001 KI (£650 player) - there is a design on the web I picked up that adds new opamps, capacitros, etc., etc., but although the individual parts will be cheap, I don't know what the labour costs will be.
Anyway, that's all for anon. The point is, I'd like to see what this player could do with a better set of electronics, or at least, upgrading the weaker elements in what is a pretty impressive package already. The SACD compatibility will be retained.
I'd also like to invest in a DAC too though, not so much for the Marantz, rather for an existing Technics SLPG580A I bought back in 1996. I know the sound of that player pretty well and it's decent enough. The transport mechanism's good if not jaw dropping and the player reviewed well back then (5 star review in WHF of the day). I think this could become a very interesting comparison; the modded Marantz against the DAC/Technics combo.
DACs of choice would be the Beresford 7520, an older Cyrus model I can get for about £250 and the CA DACMagic 2.
Should be an interesting contest!
Anyway, that's all for anon. The point is, I'd like to see what this player could do with a better set of electronics, or at least, upgrading the weaker elements in what is a pretty impressive package already. The SACD compatibility will be retained.
I'd also like to invest in a DAC too though, not so much for the Marantz, rather for an existing Technics SLPG580A I bought back in 1996. I know the sound of that player pretty well and it's decent enough. The transport mechanism's good if not jaw dropping and the player reviewed well back then (5 star review in WHF of the day). I think this could become a very interesting comparison; the modded Marantz against the DAC/Technics combo.
DACs of choice would be the Beresford 7520, an older Cyrus model I can get for about £250 and the CA DACMagic 2.
Should be an interesting contest!
chebby: I think any DAC costing less than £900 would be right under the 'radar' to most of them. These guys would use a couple of Hi-Caps (and another Naim Fraim of course) for an iPod docking station if Naim made one!
Hi chebby, you are right, I feel poorer just reading the threads! There is one guy on that forum who sold his 555 CD player worth over £10K after buying a Lavry DA10 DAC (under £900), and a few other traded in cheaper Naim CDPs (if any of their CDPs can be so described) for the same reason. Check out the Lavry threads when you dare venture there again
Hi chebby, you are right, I feel poorer just reading the threads! There is one guy on that forum who sold his 555 CD player worth over £10K after buying a Lavry DA10 DAC (under £900), and a few other traded in cheaper Naim CDPs (if any of their CDPs can be so described) for the same reason. Check out the Lavry threads when you dare venture there again
John Duncan
Well-known member
Andy Clough:Necessary? Not necessarily. Desirable? Yes.
Indeed. My wife likes the way the drawer goes in and out.
Indeed. My wife likes the way the drawer goes in and out.
"Is a cd player necessary in your set up anymore?"
Mmmm.... It'd certainly make playing my CDs a hell of a lot harder if I didn't have it......
Mmmm.... It'd certainly make playing my CDs a hell of a lot harder if I didn't have it......
idc:Time to start paying attention to what DAC is in what, especially if some DACs have the same DAC as some CDPs. So is Burr-Brown better than Wolfson than Texas? After all, there may be a few red faces where the CDP which was ditched in favour of the Beresford or whatever had the better DAC in it.
The DAC chip itself is only part of the story. The output stage, as modded in my Beresford TC-7510 thread, also has a big influence on the quality of the sound produced. And there have many who have rolled their opamps in the TC-7520 and claimed significant improvements. Something like ungunning the quality of the power supply will also add improvements.
What I'm trying to say here is, that once you get up to the £1K CDP more factors come into play. The DAC, when used with lossless files, has an advantage but this is eroded by the quality components/design of the more expensive CDP. Solution? Upgrade the DAC components, where feasible, eg the output stage, power supply, etc. However, sometimes it is easier just to buy a more expensive DAC which has a better design/components and therefore greater potential.
For me, the sound quality is only one aspect of the argument here. Using PC based music has been extremely liberating and has re-invigorated my listening experience. Over a single sitting, I can listen to a much wider range of music and artists......far more than I ever could with my dusty CDP.
Is a CDP necessary? I don't think so. Will I buy another CDP? No.
The DAC chip itself is only part of the story. The output stage, as modded in my Beresford TC-7510 thread, also has a big influence on the quality of the sound produced. And there have many who have rolled their opamps in the TC-7520 and claimed significant improvements. Something like ungunning the quality of the power supply will also add improvements.
What I'm trying to say here is, that once you get up to the £1K CDP more factors come into play. The DAC, when used with lossless files, has an advantage but this is eroded by the quality components/design of the more expensive CDP. Solution? Upgrade the DAC components, where feasible, eg the output stage, power supply, etc. However, sometimes it is easier just to buy a more expensive DAC which has a better design/components and therefore greater potential.
For me, the sound quality is only one aspect of the argument here. Using PC based music has been extremely liberating and has re-invigorated my listening experience. Over a single sitting, I can listen to a much wider range of music and artists......far more than I ever could with my dusty CDP.
Is a CDP necessary? I don't think so. Will I buy another CDP? No.
chebby:
AKL:chebby, you might have visted the Naim Forum now that you own some of their kit and you may have come across quite a few posts from people who have given up theirÿCDPs worth many thousands of poundsÿafter listening to a fewÿDACs costing less than £900, makes very interesting reading.
I have joined the Naim Forum but to be honest it is often a bit 'rich' for my blood over there. One guy flew two people from his dealer out to Vienna for a long weekend to make some changes to his system. Entertainments included fine dining and a visit to the casino. (Last time I needed some cables made up I went across the road from my dealers for a bacon roll and a cuppa whilst they did the necessary soldering!)
That particular dealer also contributes on the forum (an outfit called UHES) and they get 50 'slots' per year allocated by the authorities for customers to land their helicopters! (Not sure how many slots get used though.)
There are endless references to acronyms I only have a faint understanding of (except that they are probably too expensive for me) and everyone seems to have at least 10 Naim boxes spread across numerous Naim 'Fraim' equipment racks that themselves probably cost more than I have spent on hifi in my lifetime.
I think any DAC costing less than £900 would be right under the 'radar' to most of them. These guys would use a couple of Hi-Caps (and another Naim Fraim of course) for an iPod docking station if Naim made one!
I will have another look for the threads you mention but the furthest up the Naim 'food-chain' I am ever likely to get is to the Nait XS (maybe) if I am lucky.
As much as I like their kit I don't necessarily want to hang out too much on a one-brand forum. Not that much to say to them really.
I enjoy reading the Naim forum, even if the only Naim items I own are NACA5 cables. Certainly there are a lot of wealthier people than I on the forum, but it's usually a lively, entertaining forum whose threads cover a wide range of topics from washing machines to Portugese music. It has a lot of overseas contributors, too, and it's interesting to hear views from outside the UK.
Highly recommended for a browse, particularly the music threads.ÿ
AKL:chebby, you might have visted the Naim Forum now that you own some of their kit and you may have come across quite a few posts from people who have given up theirÿCDPs worth many thousands of poundsÿafter listening to a fewÿDACs costing less than £900, makes very interesting reading.
I have joined the Naim Forum but to be honest it is often a bit 'rich' for my blood over there. One guy flew two people from his dealer out to Vienna for a long weekend to make some changes to his system. Entertainments included fine dining and a visit to the casino. (Last time I needed some cables made up I went across the road from my dealers for a bacon roll and a cuppa whilst they did the necessary soldering!)
That particular dealer also contributes on the forum (an outfit called UHES) and they get 50 'slots' per year allocated by the authorities for customers to land their helicopters! (Not sure how many slots get used though.)
There are endless references to acronyms I only have a faint understanding of (except that they are probably too expensive for me) and everyone seems to have at least 10 Naim boxes spread across numerous Naim 'Fraim' equipment racks that themselves probably cost more than I have spent on hifi in my lifetime.
I think any DAC costing less than £900 would be right under the 'radar' to most of them. These guys would use a couple of Hi-Caps (and another Naim Fraim of course) for an iPod docking station if Naim made one!
I will have another look for the threads you mention but the furthest up the Naim 'food-chain' I am ever likely to get is to the Nait XS (maybe) if I am lucky.
As much as I like their kit I don't necessarily want to hang out too much on a one-brand forum. Not that much to say to them really.
I enjoy reading the Naim forum, even if the only Naim items I own are NACA5 cables. Certainly there are a lot of wealthier people than I on the forum, but it's usually a lively, entertaining forum whose threads cover a wide range of topics from washing machines to Portugese music. It has a lot of overseas contributors, too, and it's interesting to hear views from outside the UK.
Highly recommended for a browse, particularly the music threads.ÿ
Well my Cambridge 640 CD player has stopped reading discs again. It's been removed from the rack and I currently have no CD player.
When I get my EBay rating up a little higher it will be sent off to be fixed and sold on along with a cupboard full of other kit.
I won't miss it and never anticipate buying a CD player again.
When I get my EBay rating up a little higher it will be sent off to be fixed and sold on along with a cupboard full of other kit.
I won't miss it and never anticipate buying a CD player again.
idc
Well-known member
PJPro:..... Using PC based music has been extremely liberating and has re-invigorated my listening experience. Over a single sitting, I can listen to a much wider range of music and artists......far more than I ever could with my dusty CDP. Is a CDP necessary? I don't think so. Will I buy another CDP? No.
Totally agree with this point. I am still using an ipod or Spotify as a source, but will soon be up and running with the full PC based setup. I have nothing against CDPs, but I too will never look back for one. Future upgrades will centre around the DAC, since, from everything I have read and heard, the DAC is the key to the best sound.
Totally agree with this point. I am still using an ipod or Spotify as a source, but will soon be up and running with the full PC based setup. I have nothing against CDPs, but I too will never look back for one. Future upgrades will centre around the DAC, since, from everything I have read and heard, the DAC is the key to the best sound.
There is alot of talk on this topic about sound quality, which I know is the most important thing. I know some of you still buy cds and then rip them and store away the cds, but you speak of not bothering with cds when downloads become a decent quality,
Would you not miss the actual physical purchase of the cd? Artwork, sleevenotes, limited edition boxsets etc?
I know I would. I am in the middle of an LP buying spree at the moment and I love the sleeves and feel I am getting more than just music. I feel the same,to a slightly lesser degree with cds.
Am I one of the few who think that racks of records, cds and dvds look good?
Would you not miss the actual physical purchase of the cd? Artwork, sleevenotes, limited edition boxsets etc?
I know I would. I am in the middle of an LP buying spree at the moment and I love the sleeves and feel I am getting more than just music. I feel the same,to a slightly lesser degree with cds.
Am I one of the few who think that racks of records, cds and dvds look good?
idc
Well-known member
I do think rows of CDs look good. But practically, space becomes the issue and children. As for artwork, not with CDs. The joys of a gatefold album, with the lyrics have been lost.
I never use my CDP anymore. My routine is now:
1. Buy the CD
2. Rip the CD to FLAC using EAC and save to main HDD
3. Convert (batch conversion is possible) the FLAC file to MP3 using Foobar 2000 and backup to portable USB HDD
4. Tag music, adding album art etc. using mp3tag (and sometimes mediamonkey)
5. Add new music folders to itunes and re-scan Squeezecenter
6. Update ipod
7. Update playlists
Somewhere in between I do actually listen to the new music too! My Squeezeboxes have completely transformed my music listening habits and will probably never use the CDP again, other than to bung a new CD in if I'm too busy to start ripping.
1. Buy the CD
2. Rip the CD to FLAC using EAC and save to main HDD
3. Convert (batch conversion is possible) the FLAC file to MP3 using Foobar 2000 and backup to portable USB HDD
4. Tag music, adding album art etc. using mp3tag (and sometimes mediamonkey)
5. Add new music folders to itunes and re-scan Squeezecenter
6. Update ipod
7. Update playlists
Somewhere in between I do actually listen to the new music too! My Squeezeboxes have completely transformed my music listening habits and will probably never use the CDP again, other than to bung a new CD in if I'm too busy to start ripping.
I've recently upgraded my 2 channel equipment with a Roksan K2 amplifier and CD player, and Epos M16i speakers, and I'm completely happy with the sound. But last week I bought an airport express (so only £70), and today I've spent some time comparing it with K2 cd player (around £700)...I've used some cd that I know really well, in lossless apple format, with the airport express connected to the amplifier through the analog output and some QED cables. What can I say? I can hear some differences (the sound from the Roksan is more deep, clean, transparent) but not 10 times better! I must admit that the airport sound is good, really "musical", not fatiguing at all. I can't wait to plug an external DAC through the optical output!! Now I know for sure this is my last CD player.
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