Images on American and European LCD TVs exactly the same?

[DRW-DVD]

:rofl:

I tried to have a bit of fun with the let me google that for you link

LMGTFY is funny only if Google shows the answers right in the first few results. Like in

"Can you tell me what are the teachings of Scientology?"

"Have a look: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=teachings+Scientology"

If your joke includes: "Go to the second result (which has a generic title that isn't related to the specific problem, so there's no reason why you should have looked for that text in the first place or why you should click that link now), there read the article and click on the ~40 links at the end of the page. In one of those links, you will eventually find your answer", then the whole "A simple Google search would have solved it" pretty much falls flat and your joke doesn't work.

so don't try play the victim card.

I don't. You were the one who started crying because you didn't like my behavior. I don't play the victim card, I merely told you that you shouldn't complain if you're no better yourself.

 

[cheeseboy]

:rofl:

I tried to have a bit of fun with the let me google that for you link

LMGTFY is funny only if Google,....blah blah blah

As i said, I responded accordingly and yet still managed to answer your questions. Just because I don't reply how you'd like doesn't mean that I wasn't actually trying to help. But it's up to you I guess if you want to read it or not.

 

[abacus]

It’s long but contains all you need to know http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/1262241/television-TV

If you still want your other questions answered (Although they are fully covered in the article) then let me know, and I will put something together when I get back from work tonight.

Hope this helps

Bill

 

[DRW-DVD]

Thanks. I'll read it later.

I guess in the moment, I just need one more question answered: What do you mean with the following sentence?

in digital form 50, 60, 500 makes absolutely no difference as it is not relevant to the digital domain of LCD/Plasma

This sounds like Hertz values wouldn't exist at all for LCD values anymore. But an LCD screen can still be set to concrete values (and there are values and combinations that it cannot display, like some of the refresh rates listed in Windows when I disable the "only show compatible modes" option). So, when I press a specific button, the monitor still tells me: "1024 x 768, 60 Hz".

 

[Paul.]

Plasmas and LCD can only operate if the pannels refresh rate is a multiple of its input frequency.

For instance, your average plasma will have a refresh rate of 600hz. It has to operate at this rate, it wont cycle faster or slower. What happens is for a 50hz image the processor/controller will lock the pixel for 12 cycles, or for 60hz it will display the same colour for 10 cycles. Arbitrary frequencies therefore wont work.

Thats why tricks such as 3 2 method mentioned above are employed.

 

[DRW-DVD]

That's interesting. Is 600 Hz only for plasma or also for LCD? (And can I find out the actual, definite value for my specific monitor?) Because if it's also for LCD, why can't I set the monitor to a higher value?

For example when I play video games on an emulator and I enable vertical sync or triple buffering (so that scrolling doesn't produce tearing), then the game will produce input lag. The game is fixed at 60 FPS, so vsync will produce a slight input lag of one frame every few frames and triple buffering will produce a three frame lag. Now, if I could set the monitor to 120, 180 etc. Hz, the lag should disappear. (Because the emulator has two or three "cycles" to sync the gamepad input with the output screen). But 75 Hz is the highest value I can set (which again doesn't work for smooth scrolling, so I would have to use a multiple of 60).

 

[Paul.]

LCD tvs tend to max out at around 240hz. Plasma goes up to around 3200hz. Some manufacturers can be a little cagey about giving out actual panel rates rather than 'motion rates'.

You may have some luck with this site BB posted earlier in the week, it is intended for input lag results but it also shows panel rates.

http://www.displaylag.com/display-database/

Edit: Can I just confirm we are still talking about TVs, or have we moved on to monitors? Monitors don't sample in the same way TVs are designed to. Computer monitors may have more than one selectable refresh rate, but the input frequency will not change, the GPU in the PC locks the input frequency down to match the display frequency.

 

[DRW-DVD]

I thought LCD monitors and LCD TVs work the same. That's why I didn't make a distinction. (The game I of course play on the monitor, but the DVDs shall be watched on a TV.)

So, what would be the difference here?

By the way, when I say input lag, I'm not talking about the natural input lag that LCD screens have in comparison to CRT. I'm talking about additional input lag in games when you enable vsync.

 

[Paul.]

The panels function in the same way, but the fundamental difference is where the processing occurs. A monitor will leave your image vanilla, it wont add anything extra to the image other than colour calibration. Your graphics card will be managing the source. On a TV, it will be managing your sources and doing all sorts of gubbins in the background. This processing is what is causing the higher input lags on TVs rather than monitors.

As I understand it, if a graphics card sends a higher frame rate than the pannel can handle to a monitor, it simply starts drawing the current frame as it recieves it. It does none of the pulldown or sampling tricks a tv will to get to the correct frame rate. Thats where wierd tearing effects come from.

 

[abacus]

The variable frequency on computers came about for CRT screens as if it is too low it gives users headaches, hence monitors started to use high frequency’s which the graphics card could easily provide.

With the advent of LCD the frequency was no longer relevant as it does not scan like a CRT, thus you will find all LCDs default to 60 Hz.

To get the best from an LCD use the resolution setting that is specified by the manufacture, as that way no scaling is involved.

The fps in games constantly varies depending on how intense the on-screen action is, and is determined by the power of the computer and graphics card. (The more powerful the computer and graphics card the higher settings you can use in the game)

To all intents and purposes you can ignore the frequency with a computer and LCD screen and just leave it at the default 60 Hz as changing it will not change the performance of the monitor.

Once you have read the article in the link I posted all will become clear.

Hope this helps

Bill

 

[DRW-DVD]

Alright, I read the article now. Thanks for it.

However, I didn't find anything about the topic concerning LCD displays and the way it handles Hertz values. Did I miss something?

 

[abacus]

If it’s really bugging you have a read of the replies on this forum http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/238761-28-monitor-refresh-rate but to be quite honest leave it a 60 Hz and forget about it, as it has no relevance with digital transmission.

Hope this helps

Bill

 

[DRW-DVD]

No, it's not bugging me. I believe what you told me about it. Thanks for that.

What is a bit strange though is the following: I connected my TV (LG 19LH2000) with a DVD player through HDMI. Both devices were bought in Germany. I started a DVD. This DVD is an American one, from the United States, region code 1 (that's why I had to rip a chapter from the DVD and burn it to a DVD-R, so that the region code is removed and the DVD player accepts it). Now, when I checked the refresh rate, the TV told me that it's set to 50Hz. How is that possible?

Another question. It's only marginally related to the original topic, but while we're at it:

This cable:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RCA_jack

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Composite_video

Is there any difference between such a cable when I buy it in Germany or when I buy it in the United States? I.e. if I connect an American NES to an American CRT TV and use a German composite/RCA/cinch cable, might it produce different results than when I use an American one? Or are these cables identical all throughout the world?

 

[abacus]

Some DVD players output NTSC 30 fps (60 Hz) with a US disc; however others convert it to the equivalent PAL version 25 fps (50 Hz), your TV just registers whatever the DVD player sends it.

Cables remain the same no matter where you purchase them in the world, just be careful with really cheap ones as they can be poorly made which can cause problems. (Particularly when it comes to longevity)

Hope this helps

Bill

 

[DRW-DVD]

So, the DVD players are not the same everywhere? That sucks. I want to watch my American DVDs as it is intended. I don't want the player to convert it to PAL.