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Question Floorstanders choice and amp

Kamran90

Active member
Feb 8, 2020
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Hi everyone in What Hifi community.
I'm now choosing components for my first Hi-Fi system for listening on vinyl and network streaming.
Besides the choice of streamer and record player (which I already did, thanks to What HiFi articles and reviews), the question on choosing the right pair of speakers is still an issue.
I'm now choosing between Klipsch RP-4000F and Wharfedale Diamond 240.
My living room is 6m x 6m , so there's plenty of space.
I listen primarily to classic rock bands, post-punk, gothic, heavy metal and sometimes modern metal genres.
Standing out guitar sound is crucial for me.
One famous website had a function of online sound comparison between two, so I tried it through my earphones and what general picture was, that Klipsch would be sounding much more detailing, although missing some bass, whilst Wharfedales were sounding neutral, but one thing I noticed - heavy metal sample was sounding as a one big mass due to bass overflow, guitar solo was sounding somewhere in background completely lost in bass flow.
Again, it is sample listened to through low-end earphones, but that was an impression. Other genres sounded better on Wharfedales, whilst Klipsch were too bright and razor-sharp to my ears in some high-frequencies.

Still, I wouldn't rely too much on this kind of comparison and would like to hear from you, guys, what would be a recommendation. Music is the only intend of the system, so no home cinema applications.

Another question will be, if, say, Klipsch is too bright, can it be solved by bass/treble configuration from an amplifier? Can amplifier equalizer cut some of sharp edges, if treble is slightly reduced?

Amplifiers I'm looking into are Yamaha A-S501 (is there any need for 701?) and Denon PMA-600NE (is there any need for 800NE?) I can stretch my budget into more hi-end things like Rega Brio / Elex-R if that really brings value in terms of sound quality.

Thanks in advance, sorry, if the post is long and confusing.
P.S. There's absolutely NO Hi-Fi dealers in my town, so the best option of listening to both and choosing is not applicable.
P.S.2. I'm more of music fan, than an "audiophile".
 
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anort3

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Dec 8, 2019
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I haven't heard the Warfedales to compare but I am a fan of the Klipsch house sound and I have Klipsch speakers. However I'd go with something like the RP600M over the RP 4000f for music. The smaller Klipsch speakers can be bright where as I don't find that to be the case with the 6" woofers and up. They're still very forward and dynamic but they aren't 'bright' like the smaller offerings. The 4000f would make a fine base for a home theater though. The RP600M should be roughly the same price as the 4000f. And the A-S501 should be a very nice pairing.
 

Kamran90

Active member
Feb 8, 2020
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Thanks for the explanation, anort3.
So, if I understood you correctly, if I still want to stay with floorstanders (RP600M are bookshelf, some issues with the design of the interior allows more room for floorstanders than standmounts), I can just look at 5000f instead of 4000f, as they have two 5.25" woofers and still posses the same clarity, right?
 

Kamran90

Active member
Feb 8, 2020
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Yamaha A-S501 has 85 + 85 W amplification in its specs, is it considered "pure" watts and enough to drive 5000f ?

Additionally, I recently read, that SOME of modern integrated amps (particularly Naim Uniti Atom, not an amp, but you can use it as the one for playing vinyl though separate phono-stage), that they take analog signal from line input, convert it through their ADC, then send it to their DAC, and only then to speakers. Is it the same with Yamaha-AS501 / Denon 800NE or they just take analog and send it to speakers with no conversions?
 
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anort3

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Dec 8, 2019
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Yes again. Klipsch speakers tend to be very efficient and the A-S501 has plenty of power for them. Is there something 'better' at the same price range? Possibly. But I don't know what it would be. I haven't seen any blind A-B comparisons in the price range.
 

Kamran90

Active member
Feb 8, 2020
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Surprising, how many different opinions you hear, when digging into Hi-Fi, even of entry level. :)
My initial option was of B&W 606 bookshelf speakers and an audiophile friend of mine was insisting, that those should be powered with top A/B amplification from separate components (Naim NAC 202 + NAP 200 with separate power supply etc.).
I was bitten by that bug, but later realized that I want to listen to music, not the equipment.
 
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anort3

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Dec 8, 2019
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I'm here for the music as well. I tend to buy whatever is the best rated within my budget based on reviewers I trust. If I like it I keep it. If not it goes back and I try again. Other than buying and returning I don't have access to a large selection of speakers, amps and DACs like some of the posters on this site who actually own audio companies and have paired every speaker you have ever heard of with every amp. Also I'm in the US and while the brand access is somewhat the same, some brands are more common based on where you are. Klipsch is quite popular here and I've heard a fairly large selection of their speakers over the years.

My take is that in the last few years even 'budget' speakers have gotten very good. And as such will reward very good DACs and amplification. So your friend may be right. :)
 

k77stan

Well-known member
Dec 21, 2012
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Surprising, how many different opinions you hear, when digging into Hi-Fi, even of entry level. :)
My initial option was of B&W 606 bookshelf speakers and an audiophile friend of mine was insisting, that those should be powered with top A/B amplification from separate components (Naim NAC 202 + NAP 200 with separate power supply etc.).
I was bitten by that bug, but later realized that I want to listen to music, not the equipment.
Hi, as a fellow metalhead i would advise against B&W as imo they are too nice and relaxed for serious distorted guitar riffing. I use jbl and nad combo, but thinking of upgrading in a years time once we move. I personally would give monitor audio a go, they even had Tony Iommi advertising their speakers a few years ago and are capable of producing a sound metalheads crave for. My choice of amp would be roksan k3 as it complements ma pretty well, but yeah when it comes to rock and metal not every amp/speaker fancies it.. 🙈 I went to a friend of mines recently whos got a very very expensive Meridian set up and played him the new Tool album. It sounded precise and detailed, in fact you can hear almost forensically but guitar was too mellow for my liking, so there you go.. Hope you find what you are looking for and please let us know as theres not much info on rock/metal set ups..
 

Kamran90

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Feb 8, 2020
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theres not much info on rock/metal set ups
Exactly, never found any setups tested on this genre. Too warm will result in one bass wave cloud due to the nature of how bass line is played in metal, where all guitar riffs and even solos will be lost in. Too bright will result in rhythm guitars sounding like chainsaws and drums will be sharp af.
I guess, that listening to metal/rock sruff will require amp with bass/treble/EQ knobs available, to tune it for this type of music, as you do when playing guitar, whilst all other genres should be more or less well-balance with amp's out-of-box settings.
 
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k77stan

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Dec 21, 2012
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I can see your point about the knobs, i never seem to use mine but on some 80's or 70's recordings unless properly remastered i guess you might have to, otherwise it does sound a bit flat.. Stuff recorded in the last 20 years or so should have no such needs. I employ a downfiring 8'' REL sub, fed from the same signal as my speakers, instead of the separate sub out. This way it blends better and it really helps where double bass is concerned. I know proper audiophiles despise subs, but in my case it clearly helps and i always correct its volume depending if its really needed.. 👍
 

smbmetal

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Sep 8, 2007
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Interesting @k77stan, I think B&W speakers are excellent with rock and metal music. I’ve had a pair of 602 S3 speakers for 10 years which were great. I‘ve recently changed to the new 603 Floor Standers and am very pleased with them with Rock and Metal music.

I’m not sure I’d call B&W speakers relaxed either. So much so What Hi-Fi in their review said that they‘re not the most relaxed sound.


Big Chris (RIP) who used to be a regular forum member also rated B&W for rock/metal music if my memory serves me correctly.
 
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anort3

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I've mellowed a bit over the years but I grew up in the 80s listening to thrash. Metallica, Megadeth, Slayer, Testament, Exodus, Overkill, Anthrax etc. Klipsch is an excellent match. The RF7's in particular are one of the best rock/metal speakers I've ever heard.
 

Kamran90

Active member
Feb 8, 2020
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The thing is due to absolutely no Hi-Fi dealers in our country, I have to order everything from Amazon UK/US through freight-forwarders and those items (including delivery) have to cost less than $1000, otherwise fined by customs services. RF7's create and impression of very serious investment, which I would've made, if not transportation.

please let us know as theres not much info on rock/metal set ups..
As I'm into Klipsch 5000f most likely, which should be sounding pretty neutral with some portion of brightness, I looked through reviews on matching neutral amps. What I could get so far:
Yamaha's - all of them are completely neutral and have those treble/bass correction knobs onboard.
More audiophile grade Rega Brio / Elex-R create an impression of wider stage and brightness.
Naim integrated's (XS2/3, 5si) seem to receive feedback of completely neutral and sound as close as possible to original recording.
One thing to bear in mind is that I want to start the journey into vinyl, and those recordings, even properly remastered have reputation of lacking bass initially.

Please correct me , if I'm wrong.
 

k77stan

Well-known member
Dec 21, 2012
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Interesting @k77stan, I think B&W speakers are excellent with rock and metal music. I’ve had a pair of 602 S3 speakers for 10 years which were great. I‘ve recently changed to the new 603 Floor Standers and am very pleased with them with Rock and Metal music.

I’m not sure I’d call B&W speakers relaxed either. So much so What Hi-Fi in their review said that they‘re not the most relaxed sound.


Big Chris (RIP) who used to be a regular forum member also rated B&W for rock/metal music if my memory serves me correctly.
Fair enough @smbmetal..it goes to show audio is not an exact science and we all hear differently, but point taken nevertheless 🤘🤘🤘
 

DougK

Well-known member
Speaker manufacturers do not manufacture speakers for a certain type of music so the only way you are going to know is to ask owners and then audition a short list for yourself. Our ears are all different. Buy blind/deaf and it's your problem.

I have yet to find any remaster that sounds better than the original regardless of format, unless you are prepared to pay a good chunk cash.

As for recordings sounding better over the last 20 years, if you like your music compressed to death then yeah. Personally, no thank you, I tend to steer clear of anything recorded after '95, and all remasters, they are all too loud.

But I guess the above is okay if it's head-bangers music.
 
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insider9

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Sep 20, 2016
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Hi, as a fellow metalhead i would advise against B&W as imo they are too nice and relaxed for serious distorted guitar riffing. I use jbl and nad combo, but thinking of upgrading in a years time once we move. I personally would give monitor audio a go, they even had Tony Iommi advertising their speakers a few years ago and are capable of producing a sound metalheads crave for. My choice of amp would be roksan k3 as it complements ma pretty well, but yeah when it comes to rock and metal not every amp/speaker fancies it.. 🙈 I went to a friend of mines recently whos got a very very expensive Meridian set up and played him the new Tool album. It sounded precise and detailed, in fact you can hear almost forensically but guitar was too mellow for my liking, so there you go.. Hope you find what you are looking for and please let us know as theres not much info on rock/metal set ups..
Roksan... yes. Monitor Audio... oh no, absolutely never. Try Dali instead. At least not for Rock/Metal
 

Kamran90

Active member
Feb 8, 2020
11
1
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Another question that arose:
If speakers have more of "bright" characteristic, should they be paired then with "warmer" sounding amp for balance? Thus, some reviews prefer Marantz PM 6006 over Yamaha-AS301, to get more balanced sound.
 

Kamran90

Active member
Feb 8, 2020
11
1
25
Hi guys,

so I ultimately purchased Klipsch RP-280F, a pair of speakers with horn-loaded tweeters and 2x 8" Woofers.
Now, the question is, speakers have 4x RCA on each, so I would assume bi-amping is an option.
Is it a really thing a have to look at, when choosing amplifier?

Choosing between Cyrus One (no bi-amping, no USB, but BT Aptx onboard) and Yamaha A-S801 (capable of bi-amping, USB onboard, no Bluetooth).

I wanted a single device, to be honest, capable of handling vinyl, bluetooth streaming and USB for laptop music transfer (as PC in close to the place, where amp will be, USB cable is feasible). Is there any options I overlooked?
 

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