Question DACMagic 200M |How much of a difference can I expect?

[bofh]

I've got a Myryad MI120 playing through original Epos ES14 speakers. Currently it's fed by a £50 DAC connected over Bluetooth and Chord C-line RCA cables. So, basically a respectable mid-range combination fed by a relatively inexpensive DAC. I'm just wondering if anybody here has made a similar upgrade and what a difference it made? My music collection is nearly all FLAC ripped from CD.

 

[Revolutions]

The only way you'll really know is by listening, unfortunately. Do you have a shop nearby that stocks the DACMagic so you can take your current DAC along & compare? A home test would be preferable as the shop's equipment is likely to be pretty different from your setup, so worth exploring that option if possible.

 

[Stuart83]

DAC's can make a difference mostly when going from cheap to a better one but Bluetooth will always be a weak link, I have Bluetooth in my system via an Ifi-Zen with LDAC but still mothballed it in the end noticing it's limits and to me with my system a massive improvement using a Hegal dac straight from CD.

I'd imagine your upgrade is closer than you think and it's to do away with Bluetooth and get your music direct from "source" via a physical connection if your looking to improve sound quality over convenience, otherwise your quest for improvement will always be limited by your connections limitations,

 

[bofh]

DAC's can make a difference mostly when going from cheap to a better one but Bluetooth will always be a weak link, I have Bluetooth in my system via an Ifi-Zen with LDAC but still mothballed it in the end noticing it's limits and to me with my system a massive improvement using a Hegal dac straight from CD.

I'd imagine your upgrade is closer than you think and it's to do away with Bluetooth and get your music direct from "source" via a physical connection if your looking to improve sound quality over convenience, otherwise your quest for improvement will always be limited by your connections limitations,

Thanks for your advice, I'll give the 200M a miss for the moment then. My current DAC seems to have issues with the USB connection, whichever laptop I plug it into. My newest laptop dates back to 2013 but it never had an issue with the previous DAC. I'll look for something else used on the bay.

 

[nopiano]

If you have problems, then I’d certainly avoid Bluetooth. Are all your FLAC copies on a computer?
It depends on what you want to improve, but with your follow up it suggests that getting a dependable connection is the first step, rather than pondering over the audio qualities.

In the nicest way, I can’t imagine a 12 year old laptop is an ideal source for music. You could get a complete streamer with DAC for less than the RRP of a DAC Magic 200 and have access to millions of tracks for a tenner a month.

 

[bofh]

If you have problems, then I’d certainly avoid Bluetooth. Are all your FLAC copies on a computer?
It depends on what you want to improve, but with your follow up it suggests that getting a dependable connection is the first step, rather than pondering over the audio qualities.

In the nicest way, I can’t imagine a 12 year old laptop is an ideal source for music. You could get a complete streamer with DAC for less than the RRP of a DAC Magic 200 and have access to millions of tracks for a tenner a month.

I'd don't like streaming as either a business model or as a technology. The laptop isn't an issue - dual processors running at GHz have way more than enough capacity for processing audio signals. I'll stick with what I've got for the moment and look around on eBay for a secondhand DAC.

 

[Dave_]

In the nicest way, I can’t imagine a 12 year old laptop is an ideal source for music. You could get a complete streamer with DAC for less than the RRP of a DAC Magic 200 and have access to millions of tracks for a tenner a month.

Music streaming/playback is trivial.

A 12 year old laptop is a more than adequate source. Even a $5 Raspberry Pi Zero is a more than capable source.

I'd agree that Bluetooth is the weak link here....

Though sceptical you'd reliably be able to hear a difference under blind conditions.

 

[record_spot]

Get hold of one from the Cambridge Ebay store. They've been going for about £249 for the refurbished or Open Box models. There's also a coupon discount that brings the price down further and Cambridge give you a 30 day return period. That'd be my pick.

Personally, I think it's a great unit with excellent sound and ample connectivity.

Link to item below:-

Pardon our interruption...

 

[record_spot]

Though sceptical you'd reliably be able to hear a difference under blind conditions.

In my experience with the 200M, the Bluetooth performance was adequate, but outdone by recordings either streamed from Qobuz or direct from my phone via a wired connection.

 

[nopiano]

Music streaming/playback is trivial.

A 12 year old laptop is a more than adequate source. Even a $5 Raspberry Pi Zero is a more than capable source.

I'd agree that Bluetooth is the weak link here....

Though sceptical you'd reliably be able to hear a difference under blind conditions.

I wasn’t implying a lack of ‘power’ in the spec, I was thinking more an operating system that might be outdated, and the unwanted noise associated with a laptop. I realise I failed to spell that out.

And what are the issues the OP with a reliable connection?

Not clear how Bluetooth is involved either!

 

[Dave_]

I wasn’t implying a lack of ‘power’ in the spec, I was thinking more an operating system that might be outdated,

Not really an issue for music playback. Security is a different matter.

and the unwanted noise associated with a laptop. I realise I failed to spell that out.

If you mean from HDD and fans then fair enough, though been there and done that and I didn't find it an problem.

If you mean "electrically" then it's a non issue...

And what are the issues the OP with a reliable connection?

Unless I missed it the op didn't elaborate other than to mention they had issues with USB.

Not clear how Bluetooth is involved either!

I interpreted it as they're using BT because of whatever issue they're having with USB

 

[Stuart83]

Reading between the lines, I'm assuming perhaps it's a "Bluetooth/DAC receiver" being fed by a laptops native Bluetooth then wired into the amps RCA ?

If it is then It's a set-up I'm very familiar with being something I've done a couple of times in yrs gone by for convenience and again with a long since mothballed option incorporated into my current system for sending over music from my phone to the amp via Bluetooth, as most know yet some still deny the difference is night and day when switching to CD despite the usual barrage of hype over different codecs

The more localised your source is using a physical connection the better the quality

 

[Jasonovich]

In the nicest way, I can’t imagine a 12 year old laptop is an ideal source for music. You could get a complete streamer with DAC for less than the RRP of a DAC Magic 200 and have access to millions of tracks for a tenner a month.

Or Steamer DAC that allows you to input your USB Flash Drive/SSD, so you can listen to your music directly without the need of a laptop. 🙂

 

[Stuart83]

Or Steamer DAC that allows you to input your USB Flash Drive/SSD, so you can listen to your music directly without the need of a laptop. 🙂

👋🤗
So absolutely obviously a typo yet the infantile part of me chuckled at what a flawed concept a "Steamer DAC" would be from the inevitable, but in this world of convenience what an interesting way of keeping the kitchen uncluttered 😂

Although a streamer/dac that combines a usb connection is a good idea and gives an option to reconsider in the future, I know where I'd go with it 😁 after doing away with Bluetooth, the OP mentioned he doesn't like and won't be streaming media but does seem use existing CDs to rip to a HDD, that leaves the door wide open to two possible upgrades at once with one move,

A good budget CDP with usb input, but buyer beware some have a file limit and most only allow thumb drives and memory cards so it would depend on how many rips were talking about, I've never hit the limit with the CD 60 but it does have one.

Then again there's more options to connect a wired connection from a laptop straight to a dac then amp via RCA input but without "knowing" more it's impossible to say which would be best on paper at least, and all importantly if it would be a worth while improvement over the obvious, there's even a way of harvesting the digital signal from a laptops HDMI port (if it has one) then wired to the DAC 😕

But-

All that said I'd be exploring as to why your dac won't connect via USB, it's not usually a driver issue but reading between the lines with the age of your laptop and the possibility of having a non-class compliant DAC you would need to start by ensuring proper driver installation and sourcing the DAC as the laptops audio device in your system's sound preferences

I rather think you've already tried different USB ports and a different USB cable to rule out hardware issues and the old very, very technical switching the DAC off for awhile then the just as technical switching it back on again 😁.

It was possible to offer a deeper knowledge and extra help direct via the "private messages" option but it's been banned in all the silliness of the current climate but I'm sure if you wanted to give more info people's shared knowledge on here could get you connected or identify the DAC itself as you suspect faulty .

 

[Jasonovich]

👋🤗
So absolutely obviously a typo yet the infantile part of me chuckled at what a flawed concept a "Steamer DAC" would be from the inevitable, but in this world of convenience what an interesting way of keeping the kitchen uncluttered 😂

Although a streamer/dac that combines a usb connection is a good idea and gives an option to reconsider in the future, I know where I'd go with it 😁 after doing away with Bluetooth, the OP mentioned he doesn't like and won't be streaming media but does seem use existing CDs to rip to a HDD, that leaves the door wide open to two possible upgrades at once with one move,

A good budget CDP with usb input, but buyer beware some have a file limit and most only allow thumb drives and memory cards so it would depend on how many rips were talking about, I've never hit the limit with the CD 60 but it does have one.

Then again there's more options to connect a wired connection from a laptop straight to a dac then amp via RCA input but without "knowing" more it's impossible to say which would be best on paper at least, and all importantly if it would be a worth while improvement over the obvious, there's even a way of harvesting the digital signal from a laptops HDMI port (if it has one) then wired to the DAC 😕

But-

All that said I'd be exploring as to why your dac won't connect via USB, it's not usually a driver issue but reading between the lines with the age of your laptop and the possibility of having a non-class compliant DAC you would need to start by ensuring proper driver installation and sourcing the DAC as the laptops audio device in your system's sound preferences

I rather think you've already tried different USB ports and a different USB cable to rule out hardware issues and the old very, very technical switching the DAC off for awhile then the just as technical switching it back on again 😁.

It was possible to offer a deeper knowledge and extra help direct via the "private messages" option but it's been banned in all the silliness of the current climate but I'm sure if you wanted to give more info people's shared knowledge on here could get you connected or identify the DAC itself as you suspect faulty .

Well spotted, my 'R' did a runner! 🙂

You're right, I suspect it is software issue, possibly the chipset drivers on his the laptop require updating, should be an easy fix for the OP.

I use my Matrix Mini I-4 Streamer DAC mostly for networking my music via local storage, less for streaming. I actually have my music files on my digital transport connected to my Matrix using USB cable option, I can use the Streamer DAC but works better for me using my digital transport.

Probably not worth the hassle, the OP can also consider getting hold off dirt cheap mini PC, the one from Amazon cost £99 for basic Linux model (he would need a monitor though), he could then plug his USB drive to one of the available sockets. If the DAC is XMOS or generic he can install the appropriate drivers. He can use this instead of his laptop.
He can also download to mini PC streaming Apps like Spotify, should he have a change of heart, probably not 🙂

 

[Stuart83]

Well spotted, my 'R' did a runner! 🙂

You're right, I suspect it is software issue, possibly the chipset drivers on his the laptop require updating, should be an easy fix for the OP.

I use my Matrix Mini I-4 Streamer DAC mostly for networking my music via local storage, less for streaming. I actually have my music files on my digital transport connected to my Matrix using USB cable option, I can use the Streamer DAC but works better for me using my digital transport.

Probably not worth the hassle, the OP can also consider getting hold off dirt cheap mini PC, the one from Amazon cost £99 for basic Linux model (he would need a monitor though), he could then plug his USB drive to one of the available sockets. If the DAC is XMOS or generic he can install the appropriate drivers. He can use this instead of his laptop.
He can also download to mini PC streaming Apps like Spotify, should he have a change of heart, probably not 🙂

View attachment 9825

All good ideas 💡
It's strange one can get a mini pc cheaper than a decent "audiophile" streamer from that people can make their own assumptions but when feeding an existing decent dac with it's own "clock" then it's definitely a good solution to cut cost, also with added perks of having an open OS 😁
I know good DAC's reclock regardless of source like the Hegal I have that runs a master clock regardless of source nullifying any questions on a cheap pc's ability to mediate a source.

I picked up awhile ago you knew your onions with all things computing, it is good theorising over the possibilities regardless if the OP comes back to further look into the thread 😊

Not to whine on, but I was after enjoying getting to know you better send you a PM on such matters and knowing me a lot, lot more on such topics etc 🤣 to avoid littering up open threads and discussing things directly for all to see whilst the inevitable trolls circle which isn't ideal but as I genuinely enjoy talking to "you" and few others its something I'm prepared to endure, thread derails and things going way, way off topic is something the moderators will have to perhaps more understand and be more tolerant towards now knowing people here joined when PM's were one of the cornerstones of forming online friendships and likewise discussing things more in depth akin to being as such.

 

[Jasonovich]

All good ideas 💡
It's strange one can get a mini pc cheaper than a decent "audiophile" streamer from that people can make their own assumptions but when feeding an existing decent dac with it's own "clock" then it's definitely a good solution to cut cost, also with added perks of having an open OS 😁
I know good DAC's reclock regardless of source like the Hegal I have that runs a master clock regardless of source nullifying any questions on a cheap pc's ability to mediate a source.

I picked up awhile ago you knew your onions with all things computing, it is good theorising over the possibilities regardless if the OP comes back to further look into the thread 😊

Not to whine on, but I was after enjoying getting to know you better send you a PM on such matters and knowing me a lot, lot more on such topics etc 🤣 to avoid littering up open threads and discussing things directly for all to see whilst the inevitable trolls circle which isn't ideal but as I genuinely enjoy talking to "you" and few others its something I'm prepared to endure, thread derails and things going way, way off topic is something the moderators will have to perhaps more understand and be more tolerant towards now knowing people here joined when PM's were one of the cornerstones of forming online friendships and likewise discussing things more in depth akin to being as such.

Kind words Stuart, really appreciate it. Thank you and likewise! 👍
PM was a great interface, where you can take the conversation outside the thread.
Don't wish to invoke the Wraith of the Klingon Dynasty by going off topic 😁 but I think it's fair to say, we have seen a great erosion of our personal liberties.
If we follow this trigonometry and project the reality in twenty years time, then I would find myself in shackles (if I'm still alive 😊) for my saucy thoughts which I was entertaining when I ran into my young neighbours wife.
Anyway, must zip it!

I have been PC enthusiast dating back to the 90s but even today, I get bamboozled by Microsoft.
Their latest OS update has messed up my USB SD card connection. Effectively no longer able to transfer my music on to TF (micro SD). Pain because I have more music I need to add on to my DAP

I have done the due diligence, updated the chipsets, updated USB hub, no joy.
My only option now is a clean install of Windows and don't want to do that, don't want to disturb my settings. Everything is backed up anyway on the NAS but I think better to let sleepy dogs lie.

I've decided to get a mini pc - see below, which I plan to use for SD/TF music transfer.
A little extreme I know but it's dirt cheap and takes almost no space.
It's also a cheap way to stream your music 😊

￡168.88 | MeLE Quieter4C N150 Fanless Mini PC 32GB LPDDR5 512GB Micro Desktop Computer,4K,Dual HDMI,All-in-One USB-C WiFi 5 BT5.1 Ethernet

MeLE Quieter4C N150 Lüfterloser Mini-PC 32 GB LPDDR5 512 GB Micro-Desktop-Computer, 4K, Dual HDMI, All-in-One USB-C WiFi 5 BT5.1 Ethernet - AliExpress 7

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

a.aliexpress.com

Ps. There is another option. I can connect my SD card via the NAS USB connections and do the music transfers via cloud ☁️ 🌨️ that might work? Worth a try 😊

 

[Stuart83]

Kind words Stuart, really appreciate it. Thank you and likewise! 👍
PM was a great interface, where you can take the conversation outside the thread.
Don't wish to invoke the Wraith of the Klingon Dynasty by going off topic 😁 but I think it's fair to say, we have seen a great erosion of our personal liberties.
If we follow this trigonometry and project the reality in twenty years time, then I would find myself in shackles (if I'm still alive 😊) for my saucy thoughts which I was entertaining when I ran into my young neighbours wife.
Anyway, must zip it!

I have been PC enthusiast dating back to the 90s but even today, I get bamboozled by Microsoft.
Their latest OS update has messed up my USB SD card connection. Effectively no longer able to transfer my music on to TF (micro SD). Pain because I have more music I need to add on to my DAP

I have done the due diligence, updated the chipsets, updated USB hub, no joy.
My only option now is a clean install of Windows and don't want to do that, don't want to disturb my settings. Everything is backed up anyway on the NAS but I think better to let sleepy dogs lie.

I've decided to get a mini pc - see below, which I plan to use for SD/TF music transfer.
A little extreme I know but it's dirt cheap and takes almost no space.
It's also a cheap way to stream your music 😊

￡168.88 | MeLE Quieter4C N150 Fanless Mini PC 32GB LPDDR5 512GB Micro Desktop Computer,4K,Dual HDMI,All-in-One USB-C WiFi 5 BT5.1 Ethernet

MeLE Quieter4C N150 Lüfterloser Mini-PC 32 GB LPDDR5 512 GB Micro-Desktop-Computer, 4K, Dual HDMI, All-in-One USB-C WiFi 5 BT5.1 Ethernet - AliExpress 7

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

a.aliexpress.com

Ps. There is another option. I can connect my SD card via the NAS USB connections and do the music transfers via cloud ☁️ 🌨️ that might work? Worth a try 😊

Sorry for not being able to reply properly as I'm still over busy and as you know I'm not one for giving a short machine like reply 🤖