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When should you upgrade your hi-fi? How to control ‘upgradeitis’
CD-format to be abandoned by major labels by the end of 2012
- Thread starter Cypher
- Start date
umbucker
Well-known member
matthewpiano
Well-known member
Hmmm... There really doesn't seem to be any substantiated evidence or substance to this story at all.
Cannot see it. Singles are almost entirely digital but there must still be hundreds of millions of pounds in CD sales in the UK yearly despite the decline.
umbucker
Well-known member
I don't think it will happen in the next 7 - 10 years at least! I think true music lovers will always strive for a physical format of some sort. In my personal opininion I think music is becoming too avalable these days. When an album was costing £12 a time it limited one to a decision in music making true music fans. Noel gallagher said recently the whole blur and oasis thing (apart from press hype) was drawn up from people having the money to buy an album and having to make a decision . These days with the likes of spotify everyone can choose anything making the music industry too diluted.
I do use spotify but as a trail basis if I like an album I hear I buy the cd
I do use spotify but as a trail basis if I like an album I hear I buy the cd
matthewpiano
Well-known member
Some more thoughts on this issue.
It is inevitable that CD will become an increasingly niche product over time, though I'm not at all convinced that a major shift will happen as early as 2012. There are still large numbers of collectors out there who enjoy having a physical object and building a real collection as opposed to a virtual one.
Certainly in terms of mainstream chart music, I don't see much of a future for CD. Much of this music is purchased on a disposable basis - downloaded to iTunes, sync'd to an iPod and deleted when it isn't listened to any more.
The number of times the record companies can re-package classic albums and actually sell them is also finite, and I feel many albums are probably receiving their last CD releases now. The latest Pink Floyd remasters, the Beatles remasters, the new 40th Anniversary stereo re-mix of Jethro Tull's 'Aqualung' are all examples of this. Where can future CD releases of these possibly go and who would buy them?
Likewise in the classical market, the labels are utilising bargain priced box sets as a way of getting a last gasp from re-issues of classic recordings and there is terrific value to be had by collectors. However, the value to the record labels is slowly being squeezed out and they won't be able to reverse that now.
For the time being these remasters, box sets and special presentations will keep the CD alive and even when the majors do look towards giving up on the format, the independent specialist labels will more than likely keep it going as a niche product. Whether it will last as long as vinyl is debatable.
Interestingly I feel that Spotify is a short-term thing and I envisage an industry back-lash against music being provided free through this kind of streaming. Coldplay have already kept their latest album off Spotify and there are big gaps in what's on offer - the Pink Floyd albums aren't there for example. I also doubt whether Spotify's owners can make it work as a business model long-term.
Will be interesting to observe!
It is inevitable that CD will become an increasingly niche product over time, though I'm not at all convinced that a major shift will happen as early as 2012. There are still large numbers of collectors out there who enjoy having a physical object and building a real collection as opposed to a virtual one.
Certainly in terms of mainstream chart music, I don't see much of a future for CD. Much of this music is purchased on a disposable basis - downloaded to iTunes, sync'd to an iPod and deleted when it isn't listened to any more.
The number of times the record companies can re-package classic albums and actually sell them is also finite, and I feel many albums are probably receiving their last CD releases now. The latest Pink Floyd remasters, the Beatles remasters, the new 40th Anniversary stereo re-mix of Jethro Tull's 'Aqualung' are all examples of this. Where can future CD releases of these possibly go and who would buy them?
Likewise in the classical market, the labels are utilising bargain priced box sets as a way of getting a last gasp from re-issues of classic recordings and there is terrific value to be had by collectors. However, the value to the record labels is slowly being squeezed out and they won't be able to reverse that now.
For the time being these remasters, box sets and special presentations will keep the CD alive and even when the majors do look towards giving up on the format, the independent specialist labels will more than likely keep it going as a niche product. Whether it will last as long as vinyl is debatable.
Interestingly I feel that Spotify is a short-term thing and I envisage an industry back-lash against music being provided free through this kind of streaming. Coldplay have already kept their latest album off Spotify and there are big gaps in what's on offer - the Pink Floyd albums aren't there for example. I also doubt whether Spotify's owners can make it work as a business model long-term.
Will be interesting to observe!
6th.replicant
Well-known member
If, and it's a big 'if', these dowloads are going to be 16/44, or higher (DHYB), then OK(ish).
But I still like a little booklet to hold and read.
But I still like a little booklet to hold and read.
6th.replicant
Well-known member
Still beats me why the record industry doesn't replace Redbook CDs with hybrid Blu-ray audio discs, containing a 16/44 Redbook layer and a Studio Master 24/98-192? :?
From a Linn blog:
"Neil Young ... is meeting with other musicians, producers and executives, and inviting them to hear the [24/192] difference for themselves. From what I gather, he's been filming people and interviewing them before and after, in order to capture genuine, emotional reaction to hearing music at studio master quality for the first time."
Full blog here:
http://blogs.linn.co.uk/mt/mt-search.cgi?blog_id=11&tag=Harvest&limit=20
From acorns...ray:
From a Linn blog:
"Neil Young ... is meeting with other musicians, producers and executives, and inviting them to hear the [24/192] difference for themselves. From what I gather, he's been filming people and interviewing them before and after, in order to capture genuine, emotional reaction to hearing music at studio master quality for the first time."
Full blog here:
http://blogs.linn.co.uk/mt/mt-search.cgi?blog_id=11&tag=Harvest&limit=20
From acorns...
ray:it sounds to me like there trying to force buying downloads on all of us.
microsoft tried to say a while back that physical media is dead and everyone will be streaming etc.
its not gonna happen not for me anyway im never going to pay to download anything.
i prefer physical media and what happens to all your downloads when your hard drive fails, imagine trying to re-download 300 cd`s, 400 dvd`s and 500 blu ray films
if this is true then im going to get a pirate flag on my roof download it from one of a hundred site and record it to disc myself
at the moment i buy all my stuff on disc and just hope they dont change it
microsoft tried to say a while back that physical media is dead and everyone will be streaming etc.
its not gonna happen not for me anyway im never going to pay to download anything.
i prefer physical media and what happens to all your downloads when your hard drive fails, imagine trying to re-download 300 cd`s, 400 dvd`s and 500 blu ray films
if this is true then im going to get a pirate flag on my roof download it from one of a hundred site and record it to disc myself
at the moment i buy all my stuff on disc and just hope they dont change it
Nice comments Matthewpiano...just a personal question: how do you find your cazur 650a+marantz cd6003 with MA/MS speakers??I have the intention to purchase the same combo.....THANKS
lee37 said:
All hard drives will eventually fail. The problem is easily avoided by backing up your 'live' drive with an offline backup. USB Terabyte HDDs are now extremely cheap. You do this already for your other PC files?
I am not sure the technology is quite there for DVDs or Bluray yet. CDs are relatively small in comparison. File size and transfer times are too big to easily handle with video. Also not sure I see the benefit yet of having DVDs or Bluray ripped - playing style is very different. I may dip into a CD to hear one track, I dont dip into a film to watch 5 minutes.
In the long run CDs will end up the same way as LPs. A niche product collected by enthusiasts.
matthewpiano
Well-known member
hortensio said:
Just on my way out to work so will answer more fully this evening, but I'm very pleased. The 650A has just replaced a Marantz PM6003 and it has opened up the sound with better dynamic range and more confident soundstaging without becoming overly bright. I'm surprised at how much better the 650A is than the Marantz actually. I did have a 650A some time ago but used it with some Q 1030i floorstanders and it didn't quite work, but with the better quality MS and MA speakers you really get to hear how good this amp is. I've actually auditioned a Rega Brio-R in the same system and found that the Cambridge really loses nothing to the more expensive amp. It sounds different with the two pairs of speakers and I'll describe those differences more later, but both the MS and MA sound excellent in their own way. I will eventually decide on one of them and sell the other on.
Hey matthewpiano, where do you buy your equipment?
Think I might try to buy some shares in the shop
Think I might try to buy some shares in the shop
I can't see it happening that early, but in the end, sales (or lack of) will drive it. I personally very rarely buy CDs these days. Mostly I buy downloads (mostly in FLAC format). For 90% of my music I use Spotify.... I simply add a playlist for each album I like, and they are all stored in sub-folders on the main GUI.
It doesn't bother me that I don't own the CD. I look at my existing collection of 1000+ albums and if I'm honest, more than 80% of them never get played any more.
If I want artist info, album info, album art, I can look on the PC, or if I'm sofa listening, load up the info on my phone if I really want it.
It doesn't bother me that I don't own the CD. I look at my existing collection of 1000+ albums and if I'm honest, more than 80% of them never get played any more.
If I want artist info, album info, album art, I can look on the PC, or if I'm sofa listening, load up the info on my phone if I really want it.
--CA: good amps...
I'm sure labels would love us all to buy mp3s and save them the expense of producing CDs.
I've never bought an mp3 download and don't think I ever will.
Especially now, when there is so much music available through so many different streamed services at equal quality to a purchased mp3 (Spotify is great but it's just the tip of the iceberg). Why go to all the trouble of storing "your" mp3s and worrying about your HDD going up in smoke and losing your investment?
If there's something I particularly like, I'll buy the CD for (slightly) higher quality playback and backup.
The best thing about "the death of CD" is that they are now available from online retailers at realistic prices and often cheaper than the corresponding mp3 download. I'm buying more CDs than I did in the past and I see that trend continuing.
If there's a replacement for CDs, what is it? SACD/DVD audio has never really taken off. Hi-res downloads? Not for me at the kind of prices the industry wants to charge...mainstream labels can't even release well mastered 16/44 music, how will 24/96 help the listener? It's just another excuse for labels to charge more.
Sour grapes maybe, but I used to buy a lot of vinyl back in the day. At £5 or £6 a pop it was just about affordable from pocket money. When CDs came out, they were cheaper to produce and you didn't get the nicer artwork yet the labels tripled the prices to nearly £15 in some cases in a short period of time. If CDs had been £3 or £4 (like the Naxos classical range), everyone could have been happy. But as it was CD sales declined, hi-speed broadband came along, and everyone ended up ripping their CD collections and sharing them on P2P networks. The greedy labels were left crying about "lost" profits.
I think the idea of charging CD prices for mp3 downloads, or inflated prices for hi-res downloads is just another attempt at industry profitteering.
I'll be sticking to Spotify/iPlayer (and many, many more services) and buying reasonably priced CDs of the artists I really like.
I'm sure labels would love us all to buy mp3s and save them the expense of producing CDs.
I've never bought an mp3 download and don't think I ever will.
Especially now, when there is so much music available through so many different streamed services at equal quality to a purchased mp3 (Spotify is great but it's just the tip of the iceberg). Why go to all the trouble of storing "your" mp3s and worrying about your HDD going up in smoke and losing your investment?
If there's something I particularly like, I'll buy the CD for (slightly) higher quality playback and backup.
The best thing about "the death of CD" is that they are now available from online retailers at realistic prices and often cheaper than the corresponding mp3 download. I'm buying more CDs than I did in the past and I see that trend continuing.
If there's a replacement for CDs, what is it? SACD/DVD audio has never really taken off. Hi-res downloads? Not for me at the kind of prices the industry wants to charge...mainstream labels can't even release well mastered 16/44 music, how will 24/96 help the listener? It's just another excuse for labels to charge more.
Sour grapes maybe, but I used to buy a lot of vinyl back in the day. At £5 or £6 a pop it was just about affordable from pocket money. When CDs came out, they were cheaper to produce and you didn't get the nicer artwork yet the labels tripled the prices to nearly £15 in some cases in a short period of time. If CDs had been £3 or £4 (like the Naxos classical range), everyone could have been happy. But as it was CD sales declined, hi-speed broadband came along, and everyone ended up ripping their CD collections and sharing them on P2P networks. The greedy labels were left crying about "lost" profits.
I think the idea of charging CD prices for mp3 downloads, or inflated prices for hi-res downloads is just another attempt at industry profitteering.
I'll be sticking to Spotify/iPlayer (and many, many more services) and buying reasonably priced CDs of the artists I really like.
CD-format to be abandoned by major labels by the end of 2012 = utter rubish!
Not everyone can stream/download music, its taken me 3 years to teach my mum to press play on her Blu-ray player (and she still manages to get it wrong).
I don't think record companys are that stupid! talk about cutting your nose off despite your face..
Not everyone can stream/download music, its taken me 3 years to teach my mum to press play on her Blu-ray player (and she still manages to get it wrong).
I don't think record companys are that stupid! talk about cutting your nose off despite your face..
Can't see this happening myself. There are far too many people who buy CDs - and don't even know how to download music. No record company in their right mind would cut off such a large part of the market.
For me personally they can stop making CD's. They should make FLAC files available which you can pay for.
I just bought a Denon DNP-720AE. It sounds fantastic (better than any CD player I had) and it's so easy to play files from a USB stick. Flac, mp3, aac, wav........it doesn't matter, it reads everything.
In life you have to look forward, not backwards. For me streaming is the future.
I just bought a Denon DNP-720AE. It sounds fantastic (better than any CD player I had) and it's so easy to play files from a USB stick. Flac, mp3, aac, wav........it doesn't matter, it reads everything.
In life you have to look forward, not backwards. For me streaming is the future.
Frank Harvey
Well-known member
Streaming might be becoming popular, but it's not that popular yet. It'll be at least 5 years before it disappears, I think.
Some good posts there, personally I think that most ppl want ease of access these days so pop in your iPhone (yuk) or plug in your HD and away we go...are these same ppl a bit deaf? The terminology also seems to be wasted on them when you say 'too compressed' or 'no dynamic range'. I rip my cd's for convenience in flac format and I CAN tell the difference. If I REALLY want to HEAR things then its the CD, no contest. Now maybe us hi-fi buffs are becoming the niche market along with CD's? Who knows, but hopefully not, ever. I, and many more ppl, will listen to an album online and if I find just one track worth getting, I'll order the CD; as someone said the prices are what they should've been years ago. I've just ordered a dozen CD's and 4 DVD/BD's, I don't see those formats coming to an end soon either.
chebby
Well-known member
paulkebab said:
About as informed as me suggesting that compression of words (like 'ppl' for 'people') makes one a bit illiterate.
andy8421 said:
yes i could easily back up my music on my hard drive but i already have backups of :-
2x 1tb hard drive with a drive copy of both of my windows 7 installs on.
2x 2tb hard drives with 16 years of pc programs data files etc
1x 1tb hard drive of old computer games on cbm64, amiga etc
3x 500gb WD my passport portable HDD of important stuff
and loads of other stuff i cant be bothered to type in
in my main computer at the moment it has a total of 8tb which is 3/4 full.
i recently lost a 2tb hdd and it was a nightmare as only half of it was backed up
so why should i have to back up more stuff because i am forced to download music instead of buying cd`s
i have approx 500 cd`s which i do not need to back up and which i would not buy or playback on anything less than cd quality so mp3 is out of the equation, try getting all the music you like on LPCM, FLAC or Wave at 1,411.2 kbit/s
@ paulkebab ;
How can you hear a difference between a CD track and a flac file ? They are identical.
How can you hear a difference between a CD track and a flac file ? They are identical.
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