BIG UPGRADE from B&W 685 to what?

[kingnothing83]

Current setup is B&W 685 fronts, HTM62 centre, 684 rears and Rel T2 sub, wuth a Marantz 5007 av amp. I recently moved house and had an upgrade in mind so got some pretty decent speaker cables - QED Revelation. I've had stereo amps and listened to CD's/FLAC audio in the past but now i'm just looking for an easy time so my primary source is music from spotify (in extreme quality mode) streamed via airplay. I do use speakers a lot for home theatre too.

Question is, where do I go next? I could afford something like the CM10's and heard they are awesome so that appeals, but what I couldnt afford to do is to upgrade the centre or amp. So if i got some CM10's to use as fronts, could my amp adequately drive them? And would there be much value having a sub? Would the Rel T2 be good enough to keep up or would I be best just leaving the bass to the CM10's? I have neighbours either side so always play bass as low as possible anyway.

If the CM10's would require a new amp/sub, does anyone have other suggestions to complement my setup ? Would prefer flootstanders ideally

Cheers!

 

[Ben123]

Floorstanders would sound great but would probably blow the neighbours away if im honest. If you wanted to stay with B&W I highly recommend the CM1/CM5 as theyre a much better speaker than the 685's when i demoed. Theres also the PM1 for 2k. I think i would prefer the PM1's with PV1D sub as opposed to floor standers. At lease that way you could turn off the bass when watching stuff that doesnt require bass (the news for example)

Audition is absolutely necessary when spending this much paper of course

 

[kingnothing83]

Thanks for input! The reason I think floorstanders may be the only option is that I'd like these speakers to last many many years, with the possibility of children around the corner I thought that floorstanders may be less dangerous/likely to be toppled over, but actually - I don't suppose floorstanders are going to be 100% secure and would definitely do more damage if they topple over!

could I keep my centre and sub with your three suggestions or would I need to upgrade those too?

 

[Ben123]

Hifi and children will probably spell out trouble and theres no easy answer other than wall mounting ! Kids love to push in tweeters on expensive speakers. When neices/nephews visit i have no choice but to take my speakers out of the living room - seriously! I have my CM1's on FS700 stands which are made of cast iron (extremely heavy). The speakers can be bolted to the stands also but if a child really want to push them over - they could. I would worry that if a speaker stand went over and landed on a child it would do serious damage. Same goes for floorstanders i suppose. B&W CM speakers are very heavy due to the excellent cabinet construction. A lot heavier than your 685's.

On a positive note i have seen some tweeter protectors for the Cm series. If you have set your heart on floorstanders and want a leaner bass then the CM7 although packed with more speakers is a bit more focussed on the mids and bass is lean. Again, i have no solution for stopping them being pushed over though.

I would say you could keep your centre and sub in the short term. You dont have to spend all your cash in one go as you can do incremental upgrades - which i think is more fun anyway. The main thing is choosing speakers your happy with and build the system around that. I have not heard your paticular centre but the matching CM centre sounds excellent when i demoed it.

The PV1D sub is expensive at 1200 but has a DSP on it which can be tailored to whatever B&W speaker range you have. I have not heard the PV1d sub but a friend whos ears i trust said it is an amazing sub.

 

[seemorebtts]

i had b&w 684 home cinema set up with the b&w sub and arcam avr 400 and qed revelation speaker wire.this sounded great for movies but always lacked in the music department.i wouldnt buy 2 cms it would sound bad with 5.1.save a buy all cms or change the amp or upgrade to 684s but 684s ent going to make you music better.i bought all cms in the end second hand from ebay wow what an upgrade.:bounce:

 

[kingnothing83]

I think the best plan then is to audition some pm1's, maybe against something from the CM range to see whether I can justify the extra expense. if I like them what is the next thing on the upgrade path?

Replace rel t2 with b&w pv1 sub

upgrading my htm62 centre to a CM centre

upgrading my sr5007 receiver (to what I don't know)

adding a stereo amp to my sr5007 (it has pre outs)

thanks for all the advice so far

 

[WishTree]

I am not too sure why standmounts are recommended in this thread. In my experience, it is a completely different and fuller experience with floorstanding speakers. The only reason I would opt for standmounts is for space reason as they tend to occupy lesser floorspace and might be less fussy in working relatively closer to walls.

If there are no such constraints, then floorstanders are the way to go. I used to have CM9s with which I parted ways for different reasons. I have experienced several standmounts (Dynaudio Contour S1.4, Proac D Two, CM5 etc) and I am always impressed with the floorstanders in the same range. Infact, I prefered the sound of Tannoy DC6T to Proac D Two as there is much more happening to music with bigger cabinet and drivers of floorstanding speakers. All the time standmount speakers are always used with PV1 subwoofer. So, it is not the case of not getting enough low frequency. The only standmounts that I liked are Kef Reference 201/2 and the current Anthony Gallo Stradas. Stradas are completely different so I will not put them in this category.

My issue with CM series was that the tweeters are too metallic sounding to my taste. If this is not an issue, then they are very good in the other areas. You might not even need a sub, depending on the kind of music you would be listening.

I would not change the SR5007, but go for a Stereo Power Amp to have better control on the speakers, especially if/when you get some floorstanders.

 

[kingnothing83]

Thanks for the input, I think the reason this discussion was veered towards standmounts is the general view that bass may be over the top with floorstanders and a standmount plus sub would give more control. But I'm just reflecting the views of others here, I've only ever owned standmounts. What I'm really looking for is an upgrade in terms of clarify, soundstage and quality but without overpowering bass as I live in a flat. Incidently seen some cm5's second hand for £500 which sounds tempting...

 

[RobinKidderminster]

I never understand the children/floorstanders issue. Ok, my tweeters have gauze/wire covers now but as my kids grew up they never touched my speakers nor did any of their friends etc. I find fs more stable than my rear stands. IMO fs look more like furniture. Some say stands are better in smaller rooms with better control. Choice is a great thing

 

[Ben123]

Ok its sounds like you know what you want which is good...

"What I'm really looking for is an upgrade in terms of clarify, soundstage and quality but without overpowering bass as I live in a flat. Incidently seen some cm5's second hand for £500 which sounds tempting"

I believe either the cm5 or pm1 will give you what you want. I would advise against buying speakers without listening but at least if you buy second hand and dont like them you can sell them on without losing much. If you live in a flat i'll stand by my recommendation for standmounts as you will not make any friends out of the neighbours with floorstanders. My only worry is you may even find the CM1/CM5 is too bassy (my CM1's are bass monsters).

Clicky for an example.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZ4fXTSwX6M

If you read the comments you will see people asking him what sub he is using - but he isnt using one, thats actually what they sound like!

When i demoed for a couple of hours i demoed the 685's, CM1, CM7, Monitor Audio RX2 and some Neat motive 3's (£800).

Fristly i felt the CM series are in my eyes a massive upgrade over the 685's and was pretty much sold straight away. The slightly metallic tweeter is about the only minor shortfall i can hold against the cm range - in fact at the price i do not even consider it a shortfall. However, all the other speakers i demoed had far greater weaknesses. They were either too slow (RX2), didnt have enough bass (CM7), or were just ugly (Neat Motive 3). CM in gloss piano black is thing of beauty IMO.

The only way your going to get a better tweeter is to step up to the PM1 but your going to pay 2k for the privilege. I believe the PM1 will be my next speaker purchase but i will keep my cm1s for rears in a 5.1 setup. Some expensive rear speakers but hey i like my music

Let us know how you get on.

 

[WishTree]

They were either too slow (RX2), didnt have enough bass (CM7), or were just ugly (Neat Motive 3). CM in gloss piano black is thing of beauty IMO.

The only way your going to get a better tweeter is to step up to the PM1 but your going to pay 2k for the privilege. I believe the PM1 will be my next speaker purchase but i will keep my cm1s for rears in a 5.1 setup. Some expensive rear speakers but hey i like my music

Let us know how you get on.

CM series is really beautiful.. At home, I was so happy with the finish of them. I had CM7 in lightwood, CM5 in Rosewood and CM9 in piano black. I must say that all the colors / finishes are top notch especially with the magnetic grills (which means no visible holes for the grills). Brilliant fit & finish

 

[kingnothing83]

Brilliant thanks for the help that's great advice

the bass from the cm5 is a slight worry, but if it's too much then my amp should be able to curb that by adjusting the crossovers with the sub and adjusting the levels

ill see if I can pick up a bargain...

 

[kingnothing83]

Ok, done the unthinkable and bought the cm5's without auditioning...feeling ok about it though as I love the b&w sound generally, and got a bargain at £500 delivered for ex demo with 2 years warranty

Fingers crossed! Will share my thoughts and pictures once they're delivered thanks everyone!

 

[Ben123]

Yeah when i ordered the gloss blacks the dealer leant me the rosewood till mine arrived. The rosewoods were gorgeous too, the online pictures never do them justice. Works of audio art!

Oh and congrats to the OP on the cm5 purchase, enjoy! :cheers:

 

[kingnothing83]

Does anyone have experience with an av receiver with audyssey and new speakers? I painstakingly set up this with my current setup, so will I need to do so again with the new fronts? They'll be in the same place and are roughly the same size as the old ones but is it necessary to re-run setup or will I be best just tweaking crossover settings?

 

[Paddyfin]

Always run the Audyssey test. it never hurts and will take 10 mins

 

[kingnothing83]

Just thought I'd give my opinion on the upgrade. I've put the bungs in the back because the bass was a little overpowering but wow, what an upgrade!

The clarity is a big step up from the 685's, the stereo imaging seems much greater too but the surprising thing is the integration with the Rel T2 amp. The amp seems much more dialed in than it was when matched with the 685's.

The only problem is that my HTM62 is struggling, it doesnt seem well matched to the CM5's at all, so maybe worth saving up to upgrade to a CM Centre

Here's a picture for anyone who's extra, might make a post with some pictures on the My Setup part of the forum too

Cheers for all the advice!

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5500/10492061894_4dc0f47dd5_z.jpg