:rockout: Hi guys! I need some info regarding bi-wiring. i need to know if i bi-wiring my front speakers will add more output power to the speaker. i am using an onkyo amp with 130w rms output power with bi-wiring capability. my floorstanders have a max handling power of 200w and they allow for bi-wiring. should i bi-wire, will my output power from my amp to the speaker stay at 130w or will it double to 260w rms? I am looking for more power/better loudness/bigger sound from my existing front speaker. what are ohms? my amp has impedance switching ranging between 4-6 ohms whereas my front peaker is rated at 8 ohms. my system is mainly used for heavy,hard bassy club music which i enjoy playing at loud volumes. :dance:
Bi-wiring
- Thread starter i8nm3gp
- Start date
The_Lhc
Well-known member
This is what i am trying to achieve "Many newer seven-channel surround sound receivers actually let you redirect the power from those unused rear surround channels to use in combination with the power from your front two channels. In effect, this gives you four dedicated amplifier channels to drive a single pair of compatible left and right front speakers (each of which must have two pairs of input terminals for this to work). This neat trick essentially doubles the available power, resulting in more dynamic, higher-quality sound from your now bi-amped front speakers." So will this increase the avaible rms output beyond the speakers max handling capabilities?
Don't rely too much on Watts. Withouth context, they mean nothing. You can more easily blow up 200W speakers with a 20W amp than with a 300W amp. The danger is in the clipping: once the amp can't feed the speakers proply anymore (can't handle the speakers) you will get clipping. This can irriversibly damage your speakers and is much more dangerous than feeding too much power to the speakers.
The output of receivers is often measured at 6 Ohms, with a thd of 1%, or even worse. Hifi-amps are often measured at 8Ohms, with a thd of <0.1%. This means your 130W Onkyo receiver measured by HiFi standards may well only be rated 80W (or even less).
A lot also depends on the track you are playing. Some tracks are very stressful for the speakers and can damange them, even at reasonable volumes. Some CDs even contain warnings for this.
Basically just listen to your system. As long as the music sounds smooth and clean, without any clipping, cracklink, distortions or whatever it means your amp/speaker combo can handle the volume. As soon as anything sounds even a bit "off", turn down the volume.
The output of receivers is often measured at 6 Ohms, with a thd of 1%, or even worse. Hifi-amps are often measured at 8Ohms, with a thd of <0.1%. This means your 130W Onkyo receiver measured by HiFi standards may well only be rated 80W (or even less).
A lot also depends on the track you are playing. Some tracks are very stressful for the speakers and can damange them, even at reasonable volumes. Some CDs even contain warnings for this.
Basically just listen to your system. As long as the music sounds smooth and clean, without any clipping, cracklink, distortions or whatever it means your amp/speaker combo can handle the volume. As soon as anything sounds even a bit "off", turn down the volume.
Here are some interesting reads:
http://www.polkaudio.com/polk-university/articles/the-truth-about-power-ratings
http://www.rayfes.com/caraudio/ampspec.php
http://www.prestonelectronics.com/audio/Impedance.htm
http://www.audioholics.com/frequent-questions/the-difference-between-biamping-vs-biwiring
http://www.polkaudio.com/polk-university/articles/the-truth-about-power-ratings
http://www.rayfes.com/caraudio/ampspec.php
http://www.prestonelectronics.com/audio/Impedance.htm
http://www.audioholics.com/frequent-questions/the-difference-between-biamping-vs-biwiring
Thanks, thats exactly what i do. i push it up until distortion point and most of the tracks played are highly stressful on the speakers with some sessions lasting 12hrs plus. i host a lot of house parties and I am in search of disco/club quality sound in my living room. Being a hardcore audiophile, i want to literally feel the music and not just merely listen to it as the sound waves travel in my living room. i have busted lightbulbs in the past due to the sound pressure- but i still think my floorstanders can sound better with bi-wiring/bi-amping! just need yours guys advice.
Bi-wiring won't make any difference. Passive bi-amping (what you are talking about) might help a little, but I wouldn't expect too much of it. Depending on which speakers you have, it could help to get a more powerfull amp.
If you want to play really loud withouth damaging your speakers, maybe it's best to get a PA system?
If you want to play really loud withouth damaging your speakers, maybe it's best to get a PA system?
i8nm3gp said:
that quite is referring to bi-amping (not bi-wiring). If your amp is capable of bi-amping then its worth doing - it won't double the output of the front speakers but it should give the onkyo more control over them by reducing the load on each amp, and it should improve the bass response. You'll need to check the manual though to be sure your onkyo will support bi-amping.
I have even approached Bose Pro with regard to speaker installation to be used as home theatre and to host house parties- the residential power supply would not allow for such speakers to be installed in my living room. and besides that, those club speakers are way too big and ugly.
TrevC
Well-known member
Ill have to buy a whole set of new speakers should i buy a more powerful amp because of handling capacities- and money would definately be an issue then. i bought my existing amp because WhatHifi gave it a five star rating and after auditioning many amps on the market with some even costing the price of a new car.
would it be wise to purchase a brand new set of floorstanders with a 300w handling capacity just to be safe and use my existing front speakers in a zone 2 set up? do you guys know of any good speakers to buy? any suggestions?
BenLaw
Well-known member
i8nm3gp said:
If you're approaching Bose for a custom install I'm guessing you have a decent budget - can you let us what it is?
It seems to me you should be going for what the clubs use, active pro speakers. I've heard these from ATC, which will effortlessly do what you're seeking. They don't come cheap but are better VFM than the equivalent passive setup with monster amps. Other makes will do similar.
I am currently using a pair of mordaunt-short mezzo 8 which is going to be upgraded to a pair of Jamo S718. iv got an apple mac mini connected to the HDMI input on the amp which is the media hub of my entire system. How do you guys rate the jamo S718's?
instruction manual. and you need to switch bi-amping/bi-wiring to on via your amplifier. and yes, you gonna need atleast two spare channels because what you do on the left must also be done on the right.
Why do so many confuse bi-amp and bi-wire? It's in the name!
I doubt the Jamos will play much louder than the Mezzo 8 and will be less refined although the 10'' woofer may add some low end. What about a sub or two? Else save your money and your ears
I doubt the Jamos will play much louder than the Mezzo 8 and will be less refined although the 10'' woofer may add some low end. What about a sub or two? Else save your money and your ears
Son_of_SJ
Well-known member
mmg said:
If it's necessary to explain the differing specified resistive loads of Audio-visual receivers (into 6 ohms) compared to hi-fi amplifers (which are measured into a load of 8 ohms) then it would certainly be necessary to explain that THD stands for Total Harmonic Distortion.
danspug206 said:
from looking at the user manual online that's a 5.1 receiver (ie its got 5 channels of amplification, plus an output for a powered sub), so it wouldn't support bi-amping (you'd need at least a 7.1 receiver for that, and then the receiver's speaker set-up options would have to be capable of being configured that way).
iv busted light bulbs and wine glasses running my sub at max which iv since reduced. i need to balance the upper end sound with the lower frequencies and the only way to do that is to bi-amp. im working on a budget at the moment for speakers. Why do i perceive my music/movies as sometimes too loud(just the way i like it) and sometimes too soft even though the settings remain the same? Do you guys also experience the same problem?
Ive sold all speakers except the sub. i bought me a pair of B&W 683's and two pairs of B&W 684's. im using all seven channels and the sound is absolutely amazing. the bass is perfectly matched with the mids and highs. At times i feel as though i dont need my digital drive subwoofer especially when i am using my amp in seven channel stereo. i dial the volume up to 50 and it pushes out just exactly what i was looking for- at that volume i cant hear the person next to me talking. iv got the 683's upfront and the 684's in the rear. :cheers:
now i need an amp that pushes out 150w into nine channels and have two subwoofer outputs so that i can bi-amp the 683's and feed her 300w as read in reviews. im gna sell this overly potent way too powerful digital drive and get me two entry level subwoofers. I am really impressed with my existing onkyo's performance. Since i bought it, i havent maxed the volume. at volume 50 and im drowning in the sound!
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