Apple Music now lossless over Airplay 2?

[as286]

Reports are circulating that Apple Music now finally streams lossless over Airplay 2 (as opposed to AAC 256 as used to be the case). See here. If so, this would a new and welcome development. Is there anybody who could convincingly (i.e. on the receiving end) test whether this is true?

 

[Zantron3000]

I have the very same question and hope this is now addressed. It seems like an avoidable glitch that could be fixed on Apple’s side. It’s almost gross negligence you can’t stream lossless on Apple Music via Airplay2!

I too had seen that link, but not seen any confirmation since.

I have a great Triangle AIO Twin setup in the living-room (Airplay 1) but I’d like to connect the Twins to Sonos using a Wiim mini (Airplay 2) - but seems silly to have the music downsampled to lossy AAC.

Hope this is resolved!

 

[AndrewF]

My streamer has been showing Apple Music streaming CD quality (as stated in that link) for quite some time now. Thankfully, I am utterly unable to detect any difference between that and potentially even larger formats.

 

[Tinman1952]

My streamer has been showing Apple Music streaming CD quality (as stated in that link) for quite some time now. Thankfully, I am utterly unable to detect any difference between that and potentially even larger formats.

Hi. Does your streamer show the bitrate being received? Seeing 16/44.1 does not mean it is CD quality....it could still be AAC. 🤔

 

[AndrewF]

Hi. Does your streamer show the bitrate being received? Seeing 16/44.1 does not mean it is CD quality....it could still be AAC. 🤔

This is all getting very Schrodinger’s cat…

whatever the heck it is, it sounds brilliant. And I am unable to detect any difference between whatever it is and the highest possible resolution files fed directly in from a wired connection. Your mileage may vary, as they say in the advertisements.

 

[as286]

Thanks, Andrew, that is helpful. I agree with you, the fact that you cannot tell the difference on your good equipment probably means that it is finally lossless. Do you remember what your streamer was showing previously?

This has been a problem for a lot of people for a while. A reasonably good equipment could pick up the difference between AAC and lossless.

 

[AndrewF]

Thanks, Andrew, that is helpful. I agree with you, the fact that you cannot tell the difference on your good equipment probably means that it is finally lossless. Do you remember what your streamer was showing previously?

This has been a problem for a lot of people for a while. A reasonably good equipment could pick up the difference between AAC and lossless.

I don't really recall when it changed. A few months ago, I think. When I first got the CXN V2, it reported AAC 256. I was using an old Ipad wired to it for a while for Hi-Res. But, that was a bit of a hassle, and my daughter needed the Ipad, so I went back to AirPlay 2, and it was reporting CD quality. October, perhaps?

I definitely don't wish to open this can of worms, but I have to admit that I side with the skeptics about whether we truly can tell the difference. My feeling has always been that I will try to play the best quality source I can, without making myself crazy about the whole thing.

 

[manicm]

From what I understand Airplay is not always lossless, it will down sample automatically according to conditions, and you have no control over it

Essentially if you want guaranteed lossless do not rely on Airplay or Chromecast.

 

[as286]

From what I understand Airplay is not always lossless, it will down sample automatically according to conditions, and you have no control over it

Essentially if you want guaranteed lossless do not rely on Airplay or Chromecast.

That used to be the case, you are absolutely right. You always had some control over it in that you could have the fortune of using Airplay 1, which was always lossless, see here and here (although, bit perfect is a better term to use, I think).

The debate above is whether we can now be sure that Airplay 2 is now permanently lossless too. If yes, that would be good news as Apple does not seem to be interested in an "Apple Connect" solution and sees Airplay as its main way of communicating with HiFi equipment.

 

[Dave_]

If yes, that would be good news as Apple does not seem to be interested in an "Apple Connect" solution and sees Airplay as its main way of communicating with HiFi equipment.

Which is inferior to Casting/Connect because it requires a device sat in the middle to act as server/push content to a client/endpoint.

 

[as286]

Which is inferior to Casting/Connect because it requires a device sat in the middle to act as server/push content to a client/endpoint.

You can see it as a less convenient approach, yes, I would agree with you completely and would prefer an "Apple Connect" solution any time. I use both Tidal and Qobuz with different audio devices and they are so much simpler than the uncertainty of what you get with Airplay.

Having said that, bit perfect is what is says on the tin: bit perfect. The bit perfect you get through a proper Airplay implementation should not sound different from a Connect solution for the delivery of the same source file. If they do, it is for different reasons.

 

[AndrewF]

You can see it as a less convenient approach, yes, I would agree with you completely and would prefer an "Apple Connect" solution any time. I use both Tidal and Qobuz with different audio devices and they are so much simpler than the uncertainty of what you get with Airplay.

Having said that, bit perfect is what is says on the tin: bit perfect. The bit perfect you get through a proper Airplay implementation should not sound different from a Connect solution for the delivery of the same source file. If they do, it is for different reasons.

Perhaps the device in the middle imparts friction, and the bits end up a bit smaller.

 

[Hificurious]

I am confused. In regards with digital files residing in your computer played through iTunes/Apple Music through airplay 2, what is the streaming quality? I thought it was 24 bit 48 kHz, but I would hope at least 16 bit 44.1 kHz. Does anyone one know for sure what the quality would be? I mainly play from the files stored in my computer.

If I did play songs that reside on my iPhone and are 24 bit and 48 kHz, would would the bit and sampling rate be for that through airplay 2. I am currently playing through a Onkyo with airplay 2 and 2 Sonos era speakers.

 

[as286]

I am confused. In regards with digital files residing in your computer played through iTunes/Apple Music through airplay 2, what is the streaming quality? I thought it was 24 bit 48 kHz, but I would hope at least 16 bit 44.1 kHz. Does anyone one know for sure what the quality would be? I mainly play from the files stored in my computer.

If I did play songs that reside on my iPhone and are 24 bit and 48 kHz, would would the bit and sampling rate be for that through airplay 2. I am currently playing through a Onkyo with airplay 2 and 2 Sonos era speakers.

My understanding is that it should play the files in the maximum resolution the protocol allows. This is one of the few instances when lossless functions without funny downgrades. BTW, the Airplay 2 on Apple Music is, contrary to some reports, still not lossless. On some streamers it shows 16/44.1 but it remains AAC.

 

[My2Cents]

This thread is getting a bit old.
Airplay 2 is capable of 24 bit 48kHz but you can't use it (except on 2nd gen. HomePods) and possibly with the latest 14 and 16 inch MacBook Pro's (and you would have to select lossless as an option in the Music app.). Downloaded files would have to be re downloaded.
Apple's official advice is on their support page:

About lossless audio in Apple Music - Apple Support

Learn about lossless audio in Apple Music and how to turn it on or off for your device.

support.apple.com