Anyone use a record clamp?

[6and8]

I'm considering using a record clamp with my turntable (Pink Triangle LPT). Does anyone here use a clamp? As I've never used one I'm wondering if a clamp will deliver appreciable improvements in sound quality. Does the weight of the clamp have any adverse effect on the platter's spin speeds? Is there a clamp that will work with my TT? Any wisdom on the matter appreciated.

Pink Triangle LPT / RB300 / Nagaoka TS-11, Moth 30 phono stage, Arcam FMJ19, Audiolab 8200CD, Musical Fidelity MC4s, Van Den Hul Clearwater

 

[Chris Munden]

II have heard conflicting views on clamps from well regarded turntable sources, so I don't bother with a clamp, but this is not to say it won't be of benefit, try one and see, but don't spend too much!

Chris

 

[Al ears]

As with most things you have a choice, and don't confuse a clamp with a 'stabiliser' as it is these that are weighted.

I use a screw down clamp on my deck as it is an integral part of the design.

On non-suspended decks such as yours you could use a clamp like the one made by Michell which actually clamps to the spindle or you could use a stabiliser of reasonable weight. Some of these come with handy extras like a spirit level built in.

One of reasonable weight should not effect RPM.

I would say try it and see. Depending on your collection if you don't have warped records or most of your collection is heavyweight vinyl (180 - 200gm) then I really wouldn't see the need to use one.

The only way to get appreciable improvements in sound from a turntable is to upgrade the cartridge.

 

[Freddy58]

The only way to get appreciable improvements in sound from a turntable is to upgrade the cartridge.

I did hear that somewhere *smile*

 

[EekOZ]

Agree with Al Ears.

I too have a screw down record clamp which forms part of the players design, and I've tried both with or without the clamp and personally found no improvements to sound quality.

Cartridge is probably the best way for a sure-fire improvement, but depending on your current setup, a different mat might also give you some sound improvements and/or differences (depending preferences of course). With my previous turntable I found a cork mat to be quite an improvement over the felt one it came with.

 

[Chris Munden]

I'v had similar advice from several experts in the Hi Fi trade, best improvement will be a cartridge upgrade and possibly a different mat.

 

[chebby]

Only use a clamp if it's an integral part of the turntable's design. This kind of screw-down clamp can serve it's part in reducing or eliminating warps but how many people buy warped records nowadays without immediately sending them back? If the warps are your own fault (bad storage) then you shouldn't be in charge of a collection or a turntable in the first place.

There were so-called 'cures' involving ovens and sheets of glass but I always felt that taking it back and getting a flat one was a lot easier. (But there's always one!)

In almost 30 years of buying LPs I only got a few warped ones and they were back at the shop for exchange the same day usually.

 

[6and8]

Thanks for all the helpful comments, I can now cross a clamp off the list. I know that upgrading the cartridge will improve the sound, that's also on my list of things to do. As it's been a while since I bought a cartridge I'm out of touch with what's available and appropriate to the set up I have. Will have to investigate.

As for platter mats, the Pink Triangle LPT has an acrylic platter, I seem to remember that PT's philosophy was that contact between the acrylic and the vinyl was integral to the LPT's sound. But maybe I could experiement.

And while my record collection is properly stored these days, that hasn't always been the case. I started collecting records when I was 11, (I'm 65 now), some of my older records have been around a bit. And I often trawl secondhand record shops, record fairs and car boot sales. Finding great (and rare or long gone) music is my priority and I'm often looking to get the best out of what are not always perfect records.

 

[Al ears]

Thanks for all the helpful comments, I can now cross a clamp off the list. I know that upgrading the cartridge will improve the sound, that's also on my list of things to do. As it's been a while since I bought a cartridge I'm out of touch with what's available and appropriate to the set up I have. Will have to investigate.

As for platter mats, the Pink Triangle LPT has an acrylic platter, I seem to remember that PT's philosophy was that contact between the acrylic and the vinyl was integral to the LPT's sound. But maybe I could experiement.

And while my record collection is properly stored these days, that hasn't always been the case. I started collecting records when I was 11, (I'm 65 now), some of my older records have been around a bit. And I often trawl secondhand record shops, record fairs and car boot sales. Finding great (and rare or long gone) music is my priority and I'm often looking to get the best out of what are not always perfect records.

Yes, the record trawling is becoming harder these days, it's a while since I managed to find anything significant.

As I recall you're right about the LPT and no mat.

Which cartridge do you have at the moment? Maybe we could be of assistance when you come to look for a new one.

Meanwhile enjoy what you have.

 

[stevebrock]

I use the Orbe Clamp upgrade on my Gyrodec - personally I think it has been a good upgrade.

It really does flatten out all warps even 180g by removing the small centre ring.

The design is integral to the platter of the Gryrodec and ensure the entire surface of the record is in contact with the platter.

I dont use much pressure unless needed to flatten a record out as I think the presentation is more forward the tigher that clamp is screwed down.

 

[Jim_W]

Thanks for all the helpful comments, I can now cross a clamp off the list. I know that upgrading the cartridge will improve the sound, that's also on my list of things to do. As it's been a while since I bought a cartridge I'm out of touch with what's available and appropriate to the set up I have. Will have to investigate.

As for platter mats, the Pink Triangle LPT has an acrylic platter, I seem to remember that PT's philosophy was that contact between the acrylic and the vinyl was integral to the LPT's sound. But maybe I could experiement.

And while my record collection is properly stored these days, that hasn't always been the case. I started collecting records when I was 11, (I'm 65 now), some of my older records have been around a bit. And I often trawl secondhand record shops, record fairs and car boot sales. Finding great (and rare or long gone) music is my priority and I'm often looking to get the best out of what are not always perfect records.

Yep, me too: music is my priority and finding rare records, whatever their condition, is the biggest thrill. I keep a few spare cartridges and styli for those in less than very good condition. I have quite a few warped records, usually those purchased from markets, but they're all playable and, until I can find a better copy, they'll do fine. I love finding battered rarities and getting a decent sound out of them.

 

[drummerman]

I have a light weight screw-on aluminium clamp similar to the Michell which I often use on my Thorens.

It makes a discernable difference, often for the better, sometimes not but it's a cheap accessory I'd rather not be without.

 

[CJSF]

. . . The only way to get appreciable improvements in sound from a turntable is to upgrade the cartridge.

Not true, I spent 3 years tweaking and upgrading my P5, making it a TT that I am proud of, handling cartriges one would never dream of installing on the original, which then moves the system on to the next level, and so on.

I also use a Michell 'clamp', it stops the record traveling backwards . . . think about it, stylus in record groove like the Grand Cannyon, loads of sharp edges to get caught on, stylus hits a dynamic, factionaly creating stall on an unclamped record, nothing to do with warps in my humble opinion? Tried the 'heavy' stabalizer types, they tend to blur the presentation?

However, properly applied mass to the platter help to keep things turning smoothly, lots of other tweaks are relevent to TT besides a cartridge change, although a shrood cartridge change can be a big bang for your buck, which then leads on to more subtle changes that 'ad up as whole'.

CJSF

 

[Al ears]

. . . The only way to get appreciable improvements in sound from a turntable is to upgrade the cartridge.

Not true, I spent 3 years tweaking and upgrading my P5, making it a TT that I am proud of, handling cartriges one would never dream of installing on the original, which then moves the system on to the next level, and so on.

I also use a Michell 'clamp', it stops the record traveling backwards . . . think about it, stylus in record groove like the Grand Cannyon, loads of sharp edges to get caught on, stylus hits a dynamic, factionaly creating stall on an unclamped record, nothing to do with warps in my humble opinion? Tried the 'heavy' stabalizer types, they tend to blur the presentation?

However, properly applied mass to the platter help to keep things turning smoothly, lots of other tweaks are relevent to TT besides a cartridge change, although a shrood cartridge change can be a big bang for your buck, which then leads on to more subtle changes that 'ad up as whole'.

CJSF

I know you have spent a lot of time and effort on your P5 and good for you. I applaud your efforts. Not many people have that time or patients and certainly would not contemplate 3 years to get where you now are. Many people, by then, would have forgotten what the thing sounded like in it's original configuration. Most people might have just changed their turntables. Instant improvements are what the OP and others would want.

I don't think records are going to start travelling backwards by the way, the weight of the record and friction will be more than sufficient to deal with this, but if you find it makes a difference then that's great.

I stick by my acertation that the only way to get appreciable improvement is to upgrade the cartridge, or indeed, possibly the tonearm, although rarely doing either can sometimes have a detrimental effect.

 

[CJSF]

. . . The only way to get appreciable improvements in sound from a turntable is to upgrade the cartridge.

Not true, I spent 3 years tweaking and upgrading my P5, making it a TT that I am proud of, handling cartriges one would never dream of installing on the original, which then moves the system on to the next level, and so on.

I also use a Michell 'clamp', it stops the record traveling backwards . . . think about it, stylus in record groove like the Grand Cannyon, loads of sharp edges to get caught on, stylus hits a dynamic, factionaly creating stall on an unclamped record, nothing to do with warps in my humble opinion? Tried the 'heavy' stabalizer types, they tend to blur the presentation?

However, properly applied mass to the platter help to keep things turning smoothly, lots of other tweaks are relevent to TT besides a cartridge change, although a shrood cartridge change can be a big bang for your buck, which then leads on to more subtle changes that 'ad up as whole'.

CJSF

I know you have spent a lot of time and effort on your P5 and good for you. I applaud your efforts. Not many people have that time or patients and certainly would not contemplate 3 years to get where you now are. Many people, by then, would have forgotten what the thing sounded like in it's original configuration. Most people might have just changed their turntables. Instant improvements are what the OP and others would want.

I don't think records are going to start travelling backwards by the way, the weight of the record and friction will be more than sufficient to deal with this, but if you find it makes a difference then that's great.

I stick by my acertation that the only way to get appreciable improvement is to upgrade the cartridge, or indeed, possibly the tonearm, although rarely doing either can sometimes have a detrimental effect.

You are not wrong Alears, however in the years that I have spent upgrading and tweaking, I have come to apreciate the tiny changes one can make or perceve, the changes most would put down to it being a 'bad day', as I have said befor these tiny changes come together to make up 'the whole', developing as the character of the sytem, thats where the 3 years comes in, I understand what makes 'the sound I enjoy'.

The big changes I can appreciate, new cartridge, new arm, in the case of Rega a new sub-platter, its the wider, subtle picture beyound these that excite me, giving much pleasur and value for money, I get my biggest bang from my collective buck.

A year or so now past that 'what if' period, one simply enjoys music, Spotify, CD and vinyle, its all good and very satisfying, some a bit more than others. My first batch of 20 LP's are away for cleaning, the anticipation of getting them back at the weekend is wonderfull . . . especialy as I did make a tweak to the TT yesterday, I had one of those 'what if' moments, the sound lifted to an etherial level, not a big change but enough to want my test records back to check it out.

The problem, there is a barrier that has to be crossed, the big changes over to the small improvements that many systems find it hard to resolve, just how far can they get into the fine detail and keep it balanced, that is the finner points of hifi, that is where patience comes in, we move from 'what if' to 'did I hear that'? That then moves on to, do I realy want to go down that 'long and winding road'?*scratch_one-s_head*

. . . each to his own, CJSF

 

[Al ears]

. . . The only way to get appreciable improvements in sound from a turntable is to upgrade the cartridge.

Not true, I spent 3 years tweaking and upgrading my P5, making it a TT that I am proud of, handling cartriges one would never dream of installing on the original, which then moves the system on to the next level, and so on.

I also use a Michell 'clamp', it stops the record traveling backwards . . . think about it, stylus in record groove like the Grand Cannyon, loads of sharp edges to get caught on, stylus hits a dynamic, factionaly creating stall on an unclamped record, nothing to do with warps in my humble opinion? Tried the 'heavy' stabalizer types, they tend to blur the presentation?

However, properly applied mass to the platter help to keep things turning smoothly, lots of other tweaks are relevent to TT besides a cartridge change, although a shrood cartridge change can be a big bang for your buck, which then leads on to more subtle changes that 'ad up as whole'.

CJSF

I know you have spent a lot of time and effort on your P5 and good for you. I applaud your efforts. Not many people have that time or patients and certainly would not contemplate 3 years to get where you now are. Many people, by then, would have forgotten what the thing sounded like in it's original configuration. Most people might have just changed their turntables. Instant improvements are what the OP and others would want.

I don't think records are going to start travelling backwards by the way, the weight of the record and friction will be more than sufficient to deal with this, but if you find it makes a difference then that's great.

I stick by my acertation that the only way to get appreciable improvement is to upgrade the cartridge, or indeed, possibly the tonearm, although rarely doing either can sometimes have a detrimental effect.

You are not wrong Alears, however in the years that I have spent upgrading and tweaking, I have come to apreciate the tiny changes one can make or perceve, the changes most would put down to it being a 'bad day', as I have said befor these tiny changes come together to make up 'the whole', developing as the character of the sytem, thats where the 3 years comes in, I understand what makes 'the sound I enjoy'.

The big changes I can appreciate, new cartridge, new arm, in the case of Rega a new sub-platter, its the wider, subtle picture beyound these that excite me, giving much pleasur and value for money, I get my biggest bang from my collective buck.

A year or so now past that 'what if' period, one simply enjoys music, Spotify, CD and vinyle, its all good and very satisfying, some a bit more than others. My first batch of 20 LP's are away for cleaning, the anticipation of getting them back at the weekend is wonderfull . . . especialy as I did make a tweak to the TT yesterday, I had one of those 'what if' moments, the sound lifted to an etherial level, not a big change but enough to want my test records back to check it out.

The problem, there is a barrier that has to be crossed, the big changes over to the small improvements that many systems find it hard to resolve, just how far can they get into the fine detail and keep it balanced, that is the finner points of hifi, that is where patience comes in, we move from 'what if' to 'did I hear that'? That then moves on to, do I realy want to go down that 'long and winding road'?*scratch_one-s_head*

. . . each to his own, CJSF

Do I really want to go down that long and winding road? Is my point exactly. People don't have the patience these days. They want instant gratification.

 

[CJSF]

It has to be said the 3 year period I spent working on the TT was a very laid back afair, with lots of gaps, music listening and thinking time plus as with most people, one has a life outside hifi. However I do agree Alears, instant gratification seems the way of things in general these days, in hifi terms, 'they dont know what they are missing'?

CJSF

 

[stevebrock]

Think the Orbe Clamp on my Gyrodec has made a difference - that entire record surfce in full contact with the delrin platter adds sonic benefits, the tighter the clamp the more forward the presentation