Hi Everyone. I know this has probably been discussed a lot in the past but I wanted to hear your experiences on the benefits or any disadvantages of 180g vinyl and standard pressings…Although I am relatively new to building up my collection. I have found that predominantly all the pressings of my favourite music seem to be re-released in 180g. Any original releases I have are physically much thinner and seem to have a lot more energy and ‘punch’I’m led to believe that a thicker slab gives a deeper richer bass, but is this always an advantage?Do any of you make a point of looking for or avoiding 180g if you can? Does anyone own the same record in both 180g and standardDoes 180g cause more correction to have to be made within the phono stage? Also, does a bigger piece of vinyl cause more problems with un wanted vibration within the mechanics of the deck?I have to say that the more vinyl I get hold of the more I’m enjoying the whole ‘ownership’ of it. The art work and lyric sheets etc are usually very special and make you feel that you’ve purchased more than just the music. Dave @ Fanthorpes.
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Do you stream hi-res music or download hi-res tracks? We want your opinions!
180g vs Standard Pressings.
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Frank Harvey
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- Jun 27, 2008
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Covenanter? 🙂
It's fairly rare to find anything that isn't 180gram nowadays, particularly new releases, and 200gram seems to be creeping in for some box sets and special releases.
I can't say I've compared any directly, although a few customers have commented that the heavier ones seem to sound better. Obviously there's a few technical reasons why they are better, and I'm sure these benefits will make themselves known even on decent quality budget decks.
The thinner vinyl probably sound punchier because it has less bass. Bass performance is the first thing to suffer with vinyl, and the heavier vinyl improves that, so I'd probably take thicker vinyl every time!
I would expect a thicker piece of vinyl to be less prone to vibration. A record clamp should sort things out though - on that note, Michell have just released a record clamp designed for Rega decks - a couple of our regulars are sending back good reports...
I've mentioned in other posts that with records, it feels like you physically own something compared to a download. Which of course, you do 🙂
It's fairly rare to find anything that isn't 180gram nowadays, particularly new releases, and 200gram seems to be creeping in for some box sets and special releases.
I can't say I've compared any directly, although a few customers have commented that the heavier ones seem to sound better. Obviously there's a few technical reasons why they are better, and I'm sure these benefits will make themselves known even on decent quality budget decks.
The thinner vinyl probably sound punchier because it has less bass. Bass performance is the first thing to suffer with vinyl, and the heavier vinyl improves that, so I'd probably take thicker vinyl every time!
I would expect a thicker piece of vinyl to be less prone to vibration. A record clamp should sort things out though - on that note, Michell have just released a record clamp designed for Rega decks - a couple of our regulars are sending back good reports...
I've mentioned in other posts that with records, it feels like you physically own something compared to a download. Which of course, you do 🙂
Hi Dave@Fanthorpes
Can you please update your signature in your profile settings to make it clear you're a member of the trade. If you do that then it will automatically pull through every time you post and save you having to add it manually.
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Can you please update your signature in your profile settings to make it clear you're a member of the trade. If you do that then it will automatically pull through every time you post and save you having to add it manually.
Thanks
nopiano
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- Feb 15, 2009
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I cannot say I've ever compared them except a couple of MoFi special releases I bought back in the pre-CD era. But I suspect they weren't identical masters; either second gen or tweaked to sound 'cleaner'.
Haven't indulged in new LPs (by which I mean post 2000) when the source is digital, as I tend to prefer CD or download with new material, and analoge LPs (AAA you might say) for pre-CD. It is interesting how some LPs seem to fit perfectly on the TT, whereas others have a slight warp, ripple or eccentricity, which was often made them frustrating. Clamps can definitely help, but probably remove some of the colouration which some feel is inherent in the medium.
Haven't indulged in new LPs (by which I mean post 2000) when the source is digital, as I tend to prefer CD or download with new material, and analoge LPs (AAA you might say) for pre-CD. It is interesting how some LPs seem to fit perfectly on the TT, whereas others have a slight warp, ripple or eccentricity, which was often made them frustrating. Clamps can definitely help, but probably remove some of the colouration which some feel is inherent in the medium.
Perhaps there is definitely something to be said for a well built solid deck using a clamp to help control the vinyl whilst it’s being played. Avid turn tables which I’ve had some experience with use a design which is centred around a clamp, which fixes the vinyl to a central spindle. The theory here is to dissipate any unwanted vibrations through the main bearing. All their decks have a distinct character which is one of a very organised and clearly set out soundstage. The quality of the pressing is obviously vital. I have found one or two copies to be a little too ‘warm’ or ‘bassy’ being used to listening to the same albums on CD for so many years I guess some of it is due to the difference between 180g vinyl and CD being a big one any way you look at it.
the change in sound is as much down to mastering as it is to vinyl weight, I have a number of 70's original albums, that I have duplicated with modern remastered versions. While not in all cases, but in the majority, I prefer the original wafer thin vinyl edition. It could be because I am used to the sound, but I think that a number of the remasters may have a ''cleaner'' sound, but have lost some the rythme and energy of the originals.,
Frank Harvey
Well-known member
- Jun 27, 2008
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Frank Harvey
Well-known member
- Jun 27, 2008
- 567
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- 18,890
Everyone is entitled to an opinion as always, but are you saying that it makes no difference at all? Maybe all DACs do sound the same. Maybe all amplifiers do sound the same. Maybe cables make no difference at all. What's left to discuss on forums?
The_Lhc said:
Usualy? . . . full range drive units are very efficient. Commonly used by audiophiles that favour valve amps, valve amps often dont give the 'power' of SS amps. My own amplifier for instance delivers 20w in my prefered triod mode.
I'm thinking, some of the less powerful SS amps would have an easier time instead of being driven to with in an inch of their life and into clipping?
CJSF
David@FrankHarvey said:
Well now . . . I have recently put a thread up; 'something realy different' . . . and not new at all, but in the context of medern hifi it dont get much of an airing. 'Full rang drivers/speakers', eliminates 'all' the electronics in the speaker cabinet, nothing between amp and driver, (other than cable) no fussing about the amount of power required from you amp to drive the speaker . . . The one issue, they aint cheap, but then, neither are quality speakers with crossovers.
Think about it . . . 'nothing in the way to colour your sound'?
CJSF
The_Lhc said:
90db to say 96db is quite normal, I believe Lowther full range units can be 100db? . . . the one I'm looking at hapens to be the coockoo in the nest at 86db . . . but then, I never do things the easy way, my curent PMC speakers are 87db and my amp copes ok, so i'm not to bothered. There is more to the cabinet design that will help out here?
Sorry, off topic, see my thread.
The_Lhc said:
That is it The_Lhc, you have got it, spot on, folded horns in a box . . . the amplifier does not have to break its neck, its does its relaxed job efficiently, nothing in the way and let the speaker do the 'passive' job it is designed to do . . . ?
CJSF
I think I tend to agree with Waxy. The biggest improvement with new pressings over old ones is the fact that they're not mass-produced in long production runs and that 'virgin' vinyl is used.
I have inherited hundreds of classical records from the 1960's through to the 1980's and most of them still sound excellent, due to the fact that classical records were never pressed in extremely long production runs. To a point 180g and 200g records are a gimmick. I'm pretty sure the same records would sound wonderful as 100g or 120g vinyls.
What I find particularly annoying is the fact that when you buy a new 180g record, it doesn't even come in an anti-static sleeve. How stupid is that?
The only real comparision between an original pressing from the 1980's and a brand new remastered one I have been able to make is Paul Simon's Graceland. The new pressing does sound wonderful, probably due to the very good vinyl used in the pressing. On our equipment it sounds much better than the remastered CD, which suffers from Dynamic Range Compression.
I have inherited hundreds of classical records from the 1960's through to the 1980's and most of them still sound excellent, due to the fact that classical records were never pressed in extremely long production runs. To a point 180g and 200g records are a gimmick. I'm pretty sure the same records would sound wonderful as 100g or 120g vinyls.
What I find particularly annoying is the fact that when you buy a new 180g record, it doesn't even come in an anti-static sleeve. How stupid is that?
The only real comparision between an original pressing from the 1980's and a brand new remastered one I have been able to make is Paul Simon's Graceland. The new pressing does sound wonderful, probably due to the very good vinyl used in the pressing. On our equipment it sounds much better than the remastered CD, which suffers from Dynamic Range Compression.
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