Where next from AR935E?

[markcurling]

Hi everyone,

I’m new here. I know very little about Hi-Fi equipment, but I’m in the market for buying some soon, and I’m hoping you guys might be able to narrow my search before I begin to boil the ocean trying to understand everything!

When I was young, my dad handed me down his system, which is a pair of AR935E speakers and a NAD 3020 amp. I'll attach pictures, but excuse the quality (they are currently stored away during building work so I'm just digging out what I can find). When I received them, the seals around the bass drivers were rotten, so I did what every cash-strapped teenager would do, and replaced them with the cheapest subwoofers from the local car shop (don’t hate me!). However, they miraculously survived that ordeal, and I have been using them with no issues for the last 20 years. We are currently refurbing our house, and ‘vintage’ equipment has been relegated from the design spec, so I’m going to need to replace them with something more in keeping (perhaps two sets for different rooms).

I have enjoyed the sound from these more than virtually all the other systems I have heard on a day-to-day basis over the last 20 years. Obviously, I’m keen to understand why, so I don’t start researching the wrong types of products for my next purchase.

I’m no audiophile, so will struggle to use the right words, but I’ll try. The stand-out difference for me with these is that the bass has always been extremely deep and crisp. I listen to a wide variety of music styles, 80% of the time fairly quietly, but even at low volumes these speakers deliver an attack on the sub-base that you can feel in the room. I want to feel the music even when it’s turned down quietly for dinner. I don’t necessarily want an overly bass-heavy sound - I hate it when higher-pitch bass notes sound noisy/boomy. I also don’t think depth of frequency response alone is the answer, because I have heard many systems with giant separate subs that give very deep/loud/airy bass, but without any punch.

The rest of the sounds seems well balanced – the mids are where I’d want them to be, and the treble is high and clear. I probably prefer a more V-shaped sound than totally flat – I value soundstage and enjoyment over critical listening.

I also want a system that is very capable when we do turn the sound up for a party. These speakers perform very well up to the volume I would describe as “party-level in a 35sqm room”. They deteriorate above this volume, but that’s fine and beyond requirements.

My gut feeling says I’m not going to find the equipment I like by simply spending more (I realise the sky is the limit with Hi-Fi equipment) – it’s probably more a question of identifying driver configurations/enclosure types that suit my tastes. So… what type of 21st century systems should I be looking at, or what questions can I answer to help get closer to this answer?!

Thanks

 

[nopiano]

Not easily answered because your “home made” AR won’t sound like anything we might have heard. However, I’ll venture a few thoughts:-
1. AR pioneered the acoustic suspension loudspeaker design. It’s often called ‘sealed box’ or ‘infinite baffle’ these days. The majority of today’s speakers have ports - holes in the baffle, or round the back, sometimes underneath. These don’t have the same character of bass.
2. Your amp was a great buy forty years ago. It could be fine today, but may need more work than it’s worth spending. So it’s an unknown quantity, except that it was on the smooth side, tonally.
3. You really need to spend some hours and leg work traipsing around a few dealers to hear today’s typical sounds. Or get to a show - there are a couple in the next few weeks here in the UK. I’m assuming you’re in Blighty, I realise. That way you’ll get a feel for what you like.
4. I have a hunch you’ll like a more sensitive speaker, as they’re often believed to be clearer when just ticking over. I don’t 100% agree, but it’s worth bearing in mind.
5. I’m a fan of sealed box speakers. I began my Hifi journey with AR 4 xa speakers in 1973, and today I have British made sealed box ATCs. Go figure!

Do try to get a listen, or tell us where you live and you might even get an invitation. Welcome to the WHF forum!

 

[Gray]

...and I'd keep young mechanics away from the new stuff

 

[markcurling]

Thanks for your input - really helpful. It sounds like I'm better off starting again and going out to search for a sound that I like rather than trying to form a comparison. One of my bigger concerns is that when I google 'floorstanding speakers', they all look much smaller than the ARs - slimmer cabinets and 15cm drivers instead of the 10" I'm used to. I've generally found that "no replacement for displacement" applies well to speakers, but 40 years of technological advancement probably counts for a lot so I expect I'll be impressed. I'll get to some shows/shops to start getting my bearings - I'm in London/Essex, let me know if you have any recommendations. The amp still sounds good but most of the pots are worn out, probably heading towards retirement rather than salvaging.

 

[Florestander]

It seems you may be seeking a more 'natural' reproduction with a punchy bass - particularly for parties - and a more relaxed environment when listening generally. I have been auditioning speakers recently and based on your requirements, it may be worth listening to to ATC as suggested above by nopiano, maybe the SCM40's (or the active equivalent if you want to dispense with the power amp and your budget stretches), or try some PMC's as transmission line speakers may provide the more 'tuned' quality of bass response that you seek. I have also tried some Focal Kanta N2's recently and these proved rather good too.

 

[Al ears]

Try a pair of Cerwin Vega speakers?

 

[rainsoothe]

Thanks for your input - really helpful. It sounds like I'm better off starting again and going out to search for a sound that I like rather than trying to form a comparison. One of my bigger concerns is that when I google 'floorstanding speakers', they all look much smaller than the ARs - slimmer cabinets and 15cm drivers instead of the 10" I'm used to. I've generally found that "no replacement for displacement" applies well to speakers, but 40 years of technological advancement probably counts for a lot so I expect I'll be impressed. I'll get to some shows/shops to start getting my bearings - I'm in London/Essex, let me know if you have any recommendations. The amp still sounds good but most of the pots are worn out, probably heading towards retirement rather than salvaging.

Hi. What kind of budget do you have in mind? And what's your source? Are you interested in streaming and/or need FM or just CD/vinyl?

 

[markcurling]

SCM40s look beautiful, I've come across The Audio Barn which isn't too far from me, probably worth a visit. The Cerwin Vega SL-12s look reminiscent of the old ARs, but there don't seem to be many purchase options in the UK. There's a big price difference between the two - I need to do some listening to understand what price band my ears are operating in! I'll be streaming music. I haven't really set a budget yet. I guess I'm not looking to spend more than £5,000 at this stage. However, I'm open to the fact I might be satisfied by something <£1000. I'll have to listen to a range of different systems and figure out the price-point where my perception of quality gives diminishing returns!

 

[rainsoothe]

SCM40s look beautiful, I've come across The Audio Barn which isn't too far from me, probably worth a visit. The Cerwin Vega SL-12s look reminiscent of the old ARs, but there don't seem to be many purchase options in the UK. There's a big price difference between the two - I need to do some listening to understand what price band my ears are operating in! I'll be streaming music. I haven't really set a budget yet. I guess I'm not looking to spend more than £5,000 at this stage. However, I'm open to the fact I might be satisfied by something <£1000. I'll have to listen to a range of different systems and figure out the price-point where my perception of quality gives diminishing returns!

Great approach, and good luck. For what it's worth, I think the ATC SCM 40 fall into your budget, but they require beastly amplification (something like Supernait 3 or Leema Tucana 2 Anniversary) which will make your budget skyrocket (at least if buying new). You could also look into ATC SCM 19A (which is an amplified and floorstanding version of their SCM 19 standmounts) and use a temporary preamp until you can afford something better. You could also look at KLH Model 5 speakers + Naim XS3 or Musical Fidelity or Exposure stuff, or a Uniti Atom, or a Linn Majik DSM if you want an all-in-one so you can upgrade your source as well.

 

[Al ears]

That's the issue, the old speakers the OP refers to were very efficient, there really isn't a modern equivalent.

 

[rainsoothe]

That's the issue, the old speakers the OP refers to were very efficient, there really isn't a modern equivalent.

DeVore are pretty efficient afaik? Or were op's speakers even more so?

 

[Al ears]

DeVore are pretty efficient afaik? Or were op's speakers even more so?

No, I was referring to those of a reasonable budget but if he has the money then AudioNote are another manufacturer to consider

 

[Al ears]

DeVore are very efficient, however their latest offering is the more normal thin upright tower, and they are not particularly cheap , unless he can find a second-hand pair, which is doubtful, they will be outside his budget and as far as I know there is only one UK dealer.
The WLM La Scala floorstanders are good and efficient with an 8 inch woofer.....I would have bought these if I had not found my Adagios

 

[rainsoothe]

DeVore are very efficient, however their latest offering is the more normal thin upright tower, and they are not particularly cheap , unless he can find a second-hand pair, which is doubtful, they will be outside his budget and as far as I know there is only one UK dealer.
The WLM La Scala floorstanders are good and efficient with an 8 inch woofer.....I would have bought these if I had not found my Adagios

Ah, I forgot their pricing, only read about this brand, never heard the pleasure of hearing them.

@OP: Kudos C20 are also worth investigating, and so are Russell K Red 120. Martin Logan Motion 40i and Revel Performa F208 or F206 too. I think Kudos have just the presentation you're looking for.