To soundbar or not to soundbar

[hybridauth_Google_115978370387078222860]

Hi all,

First post so take it easy!

I've got a front room in my recently purchased house which I need to sort out of the AV setup for. It's wider than it is deep, and my sofa is about 12' from the wall / TV.

I have a wall mounted 49" LG 4K which is positioned over the top of a mantle with a radiator underneath (hence the wall mounting).

This runs through a Sony AV amp feeding a set of B&W DM303's from a few years back and a Tannoy sub. All lower end kit at the times I bought them (which in itself was a while back).

At the moment I suffer as anything which tries to send 5.1 over the TV/AV amp (netflix for example) ends up needing to be manually switched to 2.1 as there is no centre and the speach is often missing.

Due to the physical position of the TV and the radiator, a centre is tricky to locate, but a soundbar may be feasible. So, here's my question.

In order to get a 5.1 setup, should I:

a) Get a soundbar to put on the mantle do replicate the front two speakers and the centre and move the DM303's to the back corners? (Is that even possible?)

b) Get a dedicated centre and accept that i) the centre won't be central and will need to be toe'd in (is this a problem?) and sort out the rears by either moving the 303's there and getting some floorstanders, or getting some other bookshelves to do that job.

c) Something else I've not thought of!

Any thoughts, or ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Doug

 

[Green Bow]

I think the Q Acoustics BT3 is what you might want to look at. The What Hi-Fi review of it suggests it knocks similarly priced soundbars into a cocked hat.

Be aware that if you buy it, running-in time is required. What Hi-Fi mentioned this in their review, and said they left it on over the weekend and reviewed it Monday.

There are some bargains to be had with the BT3 at the moment. Peter Tyson is selling them for about £220. When reviewed by What Hi-Fi it was priced £350.

 

[hybridauth_Google_115978370387078222860]

I can definitely see how a set of wireless speakers could solve the rear issue (or possible all 4 corners) but I presume I'd still need to sort out a centre or equivilent to resolve my speach issues on 5.1 broadcasts?

EDIT: I fully read the review and see I should be able to run these as a replacement for a soundbar and plug my sub in too. Would I be able to run the DM303's as well, or would you see these as a direct replacement for those?

EDIT - EDIT: In terms of connectivity, how would you see the devices being linked here? Would I go from TV to AV amp and have that drive the speakers through the normal speaker outs? (If so I guess I would get the same problem as I have at the moment re: only using 2 out of 5 speakers).

If I was to go straight from the tv to the speakers, I guess I'd be bypassing the AV Amp? Which is a bit of a pain as all my HDMI input devices run through that, PS4, BluRay etc I'm not sure how they would interact?

 

[Leeps]

Hi Doug

First of all, in any surround set-up, it's really not a good idea to mix and match different kinds of speakers. For the surround sound field to work, there needs to be cohesion between each speaker and you'll only achieve that if the drivers in each speaker are the same or at the very least match tonally. I've experienced surround set-ups that match the drivers identically, and other set-ups that are only marginally different, and the identical ones are much much more convincing.

Imagine for example a scene in a movie where someone rides a motorbike left to right across the screen. If you have your current speakers for stereo and have a weedy centre channel speaker, it'll sound like the rider starts on a Harley, but then rides a Vespa in the middle of the screen, only to return to the Harley by the time he reaches your right speaker.

However, not having a centre speaker should be possible providing you get the set-up right. On my AVR, I can select each speaker and choose to have it switched on or off. If I switch the centre speaker off, then the centre channel information is simply passed to the left and right speakers. No it's not as good as a discrete centre channel, but not too bad.

Is your AVR a 5.1 or 7.1 amp? If it's a 7.1, an option open to you might be to put your current stereo speakers on the AVR's zone 2 output for music-only duties, and purchase a separate subwoofer/satellite 5.1 speaker package for surround duties that's sufficiently small for you to be able to place the centre speaker below the TV. Just be aware that many AVR's aren't able to output signals from HDMI inputs to the Zone 2, but other inputs; analogue, coax & optical would be fine.

Check out the Monitor Audio Radius range, it's superb and plenty are regularly available used if your budget's tight.

As for soundbars, I think they're awful things, so they wouldn't be my choice. If you already have an AV receiver, you'd lose money selling it, and I think you'd be disappointed with a soundbar in comparison.

 

[hybridauth_Google_115978370387078222860]

Hi Leeps,

Thanks for the feedback, I see what you mean re: matched speaker sets and the misses keeps telling me the 303's are to '80s' and I need to get something more contempary! With that in main the radius kit looks very interesting.

My AV amp does handle 7.1 but it's fairly basic, so there's no Zone 2 or ability to turn off the centre (which I can find)

I suppose I should add that I'm not neccassarily after a 5.1 setup, a working 2.1 setup would be fine so I appreciate you suggesting the ability the turn off the centre speaker.

Do you this a toed in centre would be acceptable if I were to buy a set which included one? I think the only thing I could fit centrally under the TV at the moment would be something like the Sonos playbar. My other option would be to remove the radiator under the TV (which I may do eventually) and position a centre properly and turn it 30-45 degrees in the interim.

Any info greatly appreciated

 

[Leeps]

I would think if you can fit a Sonos Playbar under your TV, you could fit a Monitor Audio Radius 225 (for example) as a decent centre speaker in the same place. You'd then be able to add the other speakers in the range to match.

The current Radius 225 is very slim, but depending on budget, its predecessor the Radius R225HD or the R250HD can also be wall mounted, although they are a little deeper front to back, they're no higher. They can be had at very reasonable prices on the 'Bay.

I used to own the Radius R270HD / R250HD / R90HD / R370HD package. It was stunning for multi-channel playback (in this respect I thought it was better than the Monitor Audio Gold GX50 / GXC150's that I bought afterwards to "upgrade") and pretty respectable for stereo too. The Radius range could take a seriously high-end AV receiver before being outclassed.

 

[hybridauth_Google_115978370387078222860]

Thanks Leeps, I think I saw the centre as much deeper on that set for some reason! 65mm would definitely be mountable under the TV.

I like the concept of being able to add the speakers as I go but expect that I'd need to upgrade my AV to get the most out of them....I needed and excuse to do that anyway!

Thanks for the info, I'll see what I count find from the radius range I think, looks excellent.

 

[hybridauth_Google_115978370387078222860]

So I deciced to fork out a few £ and go for the radius set. Got a decent deal after speaking to a few providers so happy with the choice, thanks for the help

My primary concern is now connecting the speakers up, cable wise I was thinking of the 'QED XT Silver Anniversary' would you think this a sensible match?

Finally, I've noticed that the cable itself seems about £6-7 per metre, but the terminated versions sold by many shops seem a LOT more expensive.
My question is now, a) should I be using terminated banana plugs for the speakers (the brochure / promo picks seem to suggest yes) and if so, is there any trick to buying and fitting this terminators myself? it doesn't look like rocket science!

 

[CinemaBuilderupnorth]

So I deciced to fork out a few £ and go for the radius set. Got a decent deal after speaking to a few providers so happy with the choice, thanks for the help

My primary concern is now connecting the speakers up, cable wise I was thinking of the 'QED XT Silver Anniversary' would you think this a sensible match?

Finally, I've noticed that the cable itself seems about £6-7 per metre, but the terminated versions sold by many shops seem a LOT more expensive. My question is now, a) should I be using terminated banana plugs for the speakers (the brochure / promo picks seem to suggest yes) and if so, is there any trick to buying and fitting this terminators myself? it doesn't look like rocket science!

hope you don't mind my interruption but please do share where you got a great deal from? Any hints?

cheers

 

[CinemaBuilderupnorth]

Hi Doug

Cheers for pointer... I checked the policy here;

http://www.whathifi.com/house-rules

and from what I can see it's ok to tell the name... (Unless I'm reading it wrong?!)*smile*

 

[hybridauth_Google_115978370387078222860]

I'm not sure on the rules for advertising / plugs so will remove names, but I just googled the UK suppliers I could find who sold the speaker sets (of which there weren't many) and asked each of them if they could provide the set with a different centre speaker.

Two companies didn't reply, 3 did and the quotes had a variance of £200.

 

[hybridauth_Google_115978370387078222860]

Hi Doug Cheers for pointer... I checked the policy here; http://www.whathifi.com/house-rules and from what I can see it's ok to tell the name... (Unless I'm reading it wrong?!)*smile*

Ok, I'll name names! (And explain the process I went through, albeit a bit lengthy!). So, I was after a set similar to the Radius R90HT1 but I wanted to 225 centre speaker as it was shallower and I wanted to wall mount it below a low profile TV, that way my main driver behind buying this set, so was a deal breaker for me. Totting up the 5.1 set with that speaker indivually comes to approx £1400 so that's my baseline for a price. The main three I contacted were Peter Tyson, Vickers HiFi and Install Audio / Ceiling speaker store. Firstly, it's worth mentioning that all three were swift in their replies and were all willing to provide a custom package with pretty much any speakers from the range. Some were more detailed in their replies and asked further questions about usages and environment etc. The range of offers initially I got back was £1099-£1199 and in general the companies were willing to reduce the price by a further £50 if I wanted to the R45 rears in place of the R90's (seeing at the R90's are almost £150 more purchased individually it didn't seem sensible to take that reduction). Vickers was the quickest getting back to me (within an hour) @ £1195, but that was still £200 less than individually. They did offer to go as low as £1049 if I was able to wait until after the Christmas break which is a great offer, but unfortunately I wanted the package as a present. I wasn't able to ask them up front to quote to the R45's because their website form cuts of enquiries unusually short. Ceiling store came back to me second (within a couple of hours) and was the cheapest @ £1099 and also threw in a few banana plugs, whilst being a little more verbose in their replies, describing the products and quoting for the package with the R45's at £1049 too. Additionally they also sold the radius wall mounts which I needed. Peter Tyson took a long time (relatively 2 days) to come back @ £1175 so I didn't follow up. I'm aware that the savings weren't huge vs the existing package, but compared to buying seperately, the price I paid was £300 less than individual prices so I was happy with that as a saving.

 

[CinemaBuilderupnorth]

Blimey. That ceilingspeakerstore.com wasn't the easiest to find but I got there in the end! Cheers. But I can't see the Monitor Audio radius HT90 kit of their website... Maybe you got the last one?! I will email em. Think I got my eye on a late Christmas present! Merry xmas and thanks for the help!!

 

[hybridauth_Google_115978370387078222860]

Interesting, a quick browser about confirms what you've said! I'd definitely email them as the guy I spoke to (Daniel) was quick to put together a custom package if that helped.

Second choice would be the guys at Vickers who are able to beat the price post Christmas I believe.