Streamer prices going downstream?

tino

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I've noticed some dramatic price drops in streamer / network prices recently ... for example the Yamaha NPS2000 MRP used to be £1450 and could be had until recently for about £600. And now I have seen the Cyrus Streamline for £999 and that used to be £1600 a short while back.

These are quite new in the market and fairly high quality items .. so what's driving the change ... are mid-range steamers finding it difficult in the market place against more mass market opposition and PC/DAC combos? Were they overpriced originally for what they offer and do they represent good value in terms of quality / £ at these reduced prices?
 

richardw42

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All overcharging IMO. Existing tech just packaged nicely.

When you've got quality cheap solutions such as Squeezebox, Sonos, Apple TV etc, it's hard to quantify some of the prices that were ( and still are) being charged.

Some products do feature extra bells and whistles and nicer cases.
 

Frank Harvey

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Something like the StreamLine is a little different to a ZP90 or a Squeezebox - its an all in one solution, a stand alone system that can be used as a main system or a secondary system. It's also based on Cyrus amplification (cheapest available about £600), so naturally it's going to cost more than budget streamers that need to plug into a system.

Its not that its tough for higher end streamers, its just tough full stop at the moment.
 

MajorFubar

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tino said:
are mid-range streamers finding it difficult in the market place against more mass market opposition and PC/DAC combos?
That's got to be a factor. Mate a decent DAC to a £300 laptop and it makes one heck of a source, with a big screen to boot. I can see the appeal of such as the Streamline, but most prospective punters are probably already going to have amplification, so that's partly-wasted outlay.
 

Ajani

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MajorFubar said:
tino said:
are mid-range streamers finding it difficult in the market place against more mass market opposition and PC/DAC combos?
That's got to be a factor. Mate a decent DAC to a £300 laptop and it makes one heck of a source, with a big screen to boot. I can see the appeal of such as the Streamline, but most prospective punters are probably already going to have amplification, so that's partly-wasted outlay.

I agree. I've had a Squeezebox Classic and Benchmark DAC1 combo for around 4 years. To be seduced into getting a mid-range streamer would require that it 1) sound better than my DAC1 combo or at least 2) have much greater functionality. I'm not convinced that mid range streamers offer me either. Besides if I really want functionality then I'll get a macbook pro or mac mini to replace the Squeezebox.
 

MajorFubar

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Yeah exactly.

Besides, there's new streaming services coming online constanty, and a real computer allows you to take advantage of them all, including the comparatively-new experience of streaming movies.
 

richardw42

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Incorporate a small PC or Mac into a hifi and you'll have the best streaming you can get.

I was initially interested in a Naim Uniti but put off by the outrageous price and wimpy amp. Even the Uniti 2 is only getting 70wpc.

Also, I think people who have an interest in streaming don't really want to pay a big premium for a unit with a CDP built in.
 

John Duncan

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richardw42 said:
Incorporate a small PC or Mac into a hifi and you'll have the best streaming you can get.

I was initially interested in a Naim Uniti but put off by the outrageous price and wimpy amp. Even the Uniti 2 is only getting 70wpc.

Also, I think people who have an interest in streaming don't really want to pay a big premium for a unit with a CDP built in.

Oh I dunno, I found it really rather good...

EDIT - and Mrs JD wanted the CD player
 

richardw42

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I'm not dissing its performance as I've never heard it, and I'm pretty sure if it was no good it wouldn't have sold.

See the Uniti more as a lifestyle product. Halve the price & leave out the amp and it might have been a decent proposition for me.
 

Haggy792

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I agree with the comment regarding a CD player on the Uniti, I initially planned to buy one but on reflection I realised that once I had put all my music onto a hard drive I wouldn't (and don't) need a CDP.
 

chebby

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Haggy792 said:
I agree with the comment regarding a CD player on the Uniti, I initially planned to buy one but on reflection I realised that once I had put all my music onto a hard drive I wouldn't (and don't) need a CDP.
But what about (as John mentioned) when your wife still prefers to use CDs?

My wife didn't get on with the CD drawer on my old Naim stuff but she loves the ease of the one in our Marantz and will often spin some Bowie, Hot Chocolate, Queen or some of our 1970s compilations.

I showed her how to bring up itunes on the iMac and click on the AirPlay symbol and how the Apple remote would control it.

I even offered to get us (her) an iPod touch to make it even better (everything she likes synced to it and no need to use the iMac at all) but she thought that would be a waste of money when she can just pop in a CD and play.

She is probably right and - although i dont use it much - the CD player part of the Marantz does sound excellent, so it would be a bit of a waste if no-one used it :)
 

ESP2009

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chebby said:
Haggy792 said:
I agree with the comment regarding a CD player on the Uniti, I initially planned to buy one but on reflection I realised that once I had put all my music onto a hard drive I wouldn't (and don't) need a CDP.
But what about (as John mentioned) when your wife still prefers to use CDs?

My wife didn't get on with the CD drawer on my old Naim stuff but she loves the ease of the one in our Marantz and will often spin some Bowie, Hot Chocolate, Queen or some of our 1970s compilations.

I showed her how to bring up itunes on the iMac and click on the AirPlay symbol and how the Apple remote would control it.

I even offered to get us (her) an iPod touch to make it even better (everything she likes synced to it and no need to use the iMac at all) but she thought that would be a waste of money when she can just pop in a CD and play.

She is probably right and - although i dont use it much - the CD player part of the Marantz does sound excellent, so it would be a bit of a waste if no-one used it :)

Sounds somewhat familiar.
 

Ajani

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Haggy792 said:
I agree with the comment regarding a CD player on the Uniti, I initially planned to buy one but on reflection I realised that once I had put all my music onto a hard drive I wouldn't (and don't) need a CDP.

Yep. That is a major turnoff for the Uniti and Uniti2. I would have no use for the CDP and would not be willing to pay the additional for its inclusion.

I understand that JD and Chebbys wives may prefer to use the CDP, but I wonder if the CDP is a selling point or an annoyance to most potential buyers. The fact that Naim drops the CDP for both the UnitiQute and SuperUniti makes me doubt that the CDP is really a strong selling point.
 

Ajani

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richardw42 said:
I'm not dissing its performance as I've never heard it, and I'm pretty sure if it was no good it wouldn't have sold.

See the Uniti more as a lifestyle product. Halve the price & leave out the amp and it might have been a decent proposition for me.

Essentially you wanted a ND5-i. It will be interesting to see if Naim ever makes one. It would make sense for an entry level streamer for persons to pair with their existing Nait 5i. Since the only other options for 5i owners is to sell the 5i and get a either a Qute or Uniti 2 OR spend more than double the price of the 5i to get the ND5 XS.
 
tino said:
I've noticed some dramatic price drops in streamer / network prices recently ... for example the Yamaha NPS2000 MRP used to be £1450 and could be had until recently for about £600. And now I have seen the Cyrus Streamline for £999 and that used to be £1600 a short while back.

These are quite new in the market and fairly high quality items .. so what's driving the change ... are mid-range steamers finding it difficult in the market place against more mass market opposition and PC/DAC combos? Were they overpriced originally for what they offer and do they represent good value in terms of quality / £ at these reduced prices?

Most of these price slashes are mainly from the big chains. Looking at this from a pure business situation, it's about supply and demand. If these chains - stock a huge variety of products - find that a certain format or brand isn't moving as quickly as hoped, they will sacrifice some of their profit margins to increase turnover. If you ain't got a turnover, you won't make any money.

A similar situation happened back in 2007 when I purchased my first pair of RS6s: SS&V had a 25% discount off all brand new speakers. Around the same time, if memory serves me well, Audio-T had a similar promotion with Arcam and B&W and other selected items.
 

ESP2009

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Just wait for me to take the plunge and buy one: give it a week or two and everyone will be having sales and slashing the prices. :cry:
 

chebby

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Ajani said:
The fact that Naim drops the CDP for both the UnitiQute and SuperUniti makes me doubt that the CDP is really a strong selling point.

You'd think it a mistake that Naim has just continued the Uniti in Mk2 form then? (Retaining the CD player section.)
 

Ajani

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chebby said:
Ajani said:
The fact that Naim drops the CDP for both the UnitiQute and SuperUniti makes me doubt that the CDP is really a strong selling point.

You'd think it a mistake that Naim has just continued the Uniti in Mk2 form then? (Retaining the CD player section.)

Nope. I'd guess it's just conservatism - The Uniti had a CDP, so they kept it on the Uniti2. Also, who knows what other products they have in the pipeline? Maybe the UnitiQute2 will also have more power, so they need to have a feature to differentiate it from the Uniti2.
 
plastic penguin said:
tino said:
I've noticed some dramatic price drops in streamer / network prices recently ... for example the Yamaha NPS2000 MRP used to be £1450 and could be had until recently for about £600. And now I have seen the Cyrus Streamline for £999 and that used to be £1600 a short while back.

These are quite new in the market and fairly high quality items .. so what's driving the change ... are mid-range steamers finding it difficult in the market place against more mass market opposition and PC/DAC combos? Were they overpriced originally for what they offer and do they represent good value in terms of quality / £ at these reduced prices?

Most of these price slashes are mainly from the big chains. Looking at this from a pure business situation, it's about supply and demand. If these chains - stock a huge variety of products - find that a certain format or brand isn't moving as quickly as hoped, they will sacrifice some of their profit margins to increase turnover. If you ain't got a turnover, you won't make any money.

A similar situation happened back in 2007 when I purchased my first pair of RS6s: SS&V had a 25% discount off all brand new speakers. Around the same time, if memory serves me well, Audio-T had a similar promotion with Arcam and B&W and other selected items.

Oh well, silence speaks volumes. I'm trying to bring some sanity to more recent fractious threads... yet again my posts get ignored. If I'm that boring I'll just ****** off.
 

ESP2009

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plastic penguin said:
Oh well, silence speaks volumes. I'm trying to bring some sanity to more recent fractious threads... yet again my posts get ignored. If I'm that boring I'll just ****** off.

C'mon PP, give folk a chance to get home from work. :) I often find that I think my posts are being ignored until someone reads them during the evening...and then ignores them. ;)
 
A

Anonymous

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Maybe it's just natural progression? Streaming is gaining in popularity so more manufacturers, more competition , lower prices?

A few years ago you needed to be a bit techy with streaming. I for instance have used an upgraded duet with a seperate dac and a dedicated laptop, and at times, it has been a bit of a faff - occasional resets, changing paths for playlists etc , I don't mind, but the good lady wife wouldn't entertain such faffery and would sooner play vinyl or a CD.

As with most pc/digital related products, ( as against 'traditional' hifi kit ), the larger market will force prices downwards, and fast changing technologies encourage discounts on older products.
 
A

Anonymous

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But the true discerning audiophile is more into audio reproduction quality than fast changing technology.
 

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