I've not seen this mentioned anywhere so thought I would check if I'm the only person who notices it. I've always been sensitve to any flickering or shimmering on tv screens. (when we had CRT monitors at work I could always tell at a glance if someone had their screen refreshing at 60Hz instead of 85 or higher for instance) Anyway I've just been comparing the Panny x80 and z85 models and I could see a slight shimmer on both of them. A bit like looking at an old 50hz CRT tv, only more subtle. This surprised me, as although I've seen it on the PX80 before, I had presumed (and hoped) that the 100hz on the PZ85 would remove it. (as my faithful panny 32" 100Hz quintrix tv does, with its rock solid picture). I had a look at the pioneer 4280, and although it was much more subtle, I could still see a slight shimmer on that too. In the words of Mr Wogan. Is it me? Or does anyone else notice this effect on Plasma screens too? If its a standard 'feature' of the plasma screen technology I'm going to have to go back and create a shortlist of LCDs to view instead, as I couldn't detect any shimmering when I scrutinised various LCD models. Incidentally I was just viewing in Currys (yes, I know) so the screens were probably all on more or less factory settings
slight shimmering effect on plasma screens
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Well you see one of the forum members works for currys [ see O"h Sugar thread todays Entries ] and uses Mr Sheen to clean the Inside and Outside of the TV"s so that must explain the shimmering you saw. Happy Days.[quote user="rdsoftware"]I've not seen this mentioned anywhere so thought I would check if I'm the only person who notices it.
I've always been sensitve to any flickering or shimmering on tv screens. (when we had CRT monitors at work I could always tell at a glance if someone had their screen refreshing at 60Hz instead of 85 or higher for instance)
Anyway I've just been comparing the Panny x80 and z85 models and I could see a slight shimmer on both of them. A bit like looking at an old 50hz CRT tv, only more subtle. This surprised me, as although I've seen it on the PX80 before, I had presumed (and hoped) that the 100hz on the PZ85 would remove it. (as my faithful panny 32" 100Hz quintrix tv does, with its rock solid picture).
I had a look at the pioneer 4280, and although it was much more subtle, I could still see a slight shimmer on that too.
In the words of Mr Wogan. Is it me? Or does anyone else notice this effect on Plasma screens too? If its a standard 'feature' of the plasma screen technology I'm going to have to go back and create a shortlist of LCDs to view instead, as I couldn't detect any shimmering when I scrutinised various LCD models.
Incidentally I was just viewing in Currys (yes, I know) so the screens were probably all on more or less factory settings
[/quote]
I've always been sensitve to any flickering or shimmering on tv screens. (when we had CRT monitors at work I could always tell at a glance if someone had their screen refreshing at 60Hz instead of 85 or higher for instance)
Anyway I've just been comparing the Panny x80 and z85 models and I could see a slight shimmer on both of them. A bit like looking at an old 50hz CRT tv, only more subtle. This surprised me, as although I've seen it on the PX80 before, I had presumed (and hoped) that the 100hz on the PZ85 would remove it. (as my faithful panny 32" 100Hz quintrix tv does, with its rock solid picture).
I had a look at the pioneer 4280, and although it was much more subtle, I could still see a slight shimmer on that too.
In the words of Mr Wogan. Is it me? Or does anyone else notice this effect on Plasma screens too? If its a standard 'feature' of the plasma screen technology I'm going to have to go back and create a shortlist of LCDs to view instead, as I couldn't detect any shimmering when I scrutinised various LCD models.
Incidentally I was just viewing in Currys (yes, I know) so the screens were probably all on more or less factory settings
[/quote]
some people are suscepitble to plasma shimmering, phosphor trails and green flashes others will never see it -- if you can it depends on whether you can live with it
just the same with LCD's some people just won't notice the motion blur while others do - got a friend who said he's been getting headaches/bit sea sick since gets his new TV, nailed it down to the motion blur and noise on his LCD -- he's really suscepitble to it and is now looking to change to plasma.
just the same with LCD's some people just won't notice the motion blur while others do - got a friend who said he's been getting headaches/bit sea sick since gets his new TV, nailed it down to the motion blur and noise on his LCD -- he's really suscepitble to it and is now looking to change to plasma.
[quote user="rdsoftware"]
Anyway I've just been comparing the Panny x80 and z85 models and I could see a slight shimmer on both of them. A bit like looking at an old 50hz CRT tv, only more subtle. This surprised me, as although I've seen it on the PX80 before, I had presumed (and hoped) that the 100hz on the PZ85 would remove it. (as my faithful panny 32" 100Hz quintrix tv does, with its rock solid picture).
[/quote]
The PX80 is 100hz as well. All Panasonic plasmas are, at least as far as I know.
Anyway I've just been comparing the Panny x80 and z85 models and I could see a slight shimmer on both of them. A bit like looking at an old 50hz CRT tv, only more subtle. This surprised me, as although I've seen it on the PX80 before, I had presumed (and hoped) that the 100hz on the PZ85 would remove it. (as my faithful panny 32" 100Hz quintrix tv does, with its rock solid picture).
[/quote]
The PX80 is 100hz as well. All Panasonic plasmas are, at least as far as I know.
[quote user="slippy67"]
The PX80 is 100hz as well. All Panasonic plasmas are, at least as far as I know.
[/quote]
You're quite right, just verified that the PX80 is 100Hz on the panasonic website.
Oh well, guess it has to be LCD for me then. Thats quite annoying, lets hope I can stand (or not notice) the motion blur or I'll have to stick with my crt for a while longer!
The PX80 is 100hz as well. All Panasonic plasmas are, at least as far as I know.
[/quote]
You're quite right, just verified that the PX80 is 100Hz on the panasonic website.
Oh well, guess it has to be LCD for me then. Thats quite annoying, lets hope I can stand (or not notice) the motion blur or I'll have to stick with my crt for a while longer!
[quote user="rdsoftware"][quote user="slippy67"]
The PX80 is 100hz as well. All Panasonic plasmas are, at least as far as I know.
[/quote]
You're quite right, just verified that the PX80 is 100Hz on the panasonic website.
Oh well, guess it has to be LCD for me then. Thats quite annoying, lets hope I can stand (or not notice) the motion blur or I'll have to stick with my crt for a while longer![/quote]
I have the 42PZ85 and am sensitive to the shimmering/flickering that you mention. As soon as I powered on the set and it displayed the initial set up screen, I could detect flickering and was surprised as it was 100Hz refresh.
Like you, I cannot tolerate low refresh crt computer monitors and it can actually trigger migraines for me. The plasma was therefore a little worrying. However, apart from for example the black writing on a white background of the FACT warning at the start of some DVDs, it has become less noticeable for me.
Movement on a plasma gives different problems to the smear or drag seen on good 100Hz LCDs. The pasma has a much faster response time so you may notice movement almost as a collection of separate pictures rather than a smeared one (all reasonably slight). For some reason plasma can look more out of focus on panned shots than LCD.
With freeview I also detect some green edges to objects/people as motion starts and occasional green flashes.
I am on my second set in as many weeks as the first one had more serious flashes and phosphor trails with altogether unacceptable artifacts , but proved to be faulty.
I have always thought the picture on my 32LXD700 LCD to be very good. However, since having the plasma the LCD picture looks more vibrant but more artificial. I now much prefer the plasma picture to the LCD. I sit approx. 7ft away or closer from each and this assessment is despite the fact that th 42 is 10" bigger and therefore 'maginfies' issues that bit more!
Let's face it, no one system is perfect. Each have their pros and cons be it CRT, LCD PLASMA, RPTV or projector. The source material is far from perfect even blu ray!
I was taken in by the hype surrounding plasma's alleged superiority and bitterly disappointed when I got my first PZ85 last week. However this was faulty and the replacement has excellent PQ (though not build quality) and I am possibly a convert to plasma!
I would suggest that perhaps you give plasma another go by comparing side by side with a top LCD set. You may find that the shimmering does actually become less noticeable and some of LCDs traits become more apparent.
As you say, you can always stick with your known product, the CRT. I feel you are missing out on some of the HD benefits though.
Good luck with your investigation.
The PX80 is 100hz as well. All Panasonic plasmas are, at least as far as I know.
[/quote]
You're quite right, just verified that the PX80 is 100Hz on the panasonic website.
Oh well, guess it has to be LCD for me then. Thats quite annoying, lets hope I can stand (or not notice) the motion blur or I'll have to stick with my crt for a while longer![/quote]
I have the 42PZ85 and am sensitive to the shimmering/flickering that you mention. As soon as I powered on the set and it displayed the initial set up screen, I could detect flickering and was surprised as it was 100Hz refresh.
Like you, I cannot tolerate low refresh crt computer monitors and it can actually trigger migraines for me. The plasma was therefore a little worrying. However, apart from for example the black writing on a white background of the FACT warning at the start of some DVDs, it has become less noticeable for me.
Movement on a plasma gives different problems to the smear or drag seen on good 100Hz LCDs. The pasma has a much faster response time so you may notice movement almost as a collection of separate pictures rather than a smeared one (all reasonably slight). For some reason plasma can look more out of focus on panned shots than LCD.
With freeview I also detect some green edges to objects/people as motion starts and occasional green flashes.
I am on my second set in as many weeks as the first one had more serious flashes and phosphor trails with altogether unacceptable artifacts , but proved to be faulty.
I have always thought the picture on my 32LXD700 LCD to be very good. However, since having the plasma the LCD picture looks more vibrant but more artificial. I now much prefer the plasma picture to the LCD. I sit approx. 7ft away or closer from each and this assessment is despite the fact that th 42 is 10" bigger and therefore 'maginfies' issues that bit more!
Let's face it, no one system is perfect. Each have their pros and cons be it CRT, LCD PLASMA, RPTV or projector. The source material is far from perfect even blu ray!
I was taken in by the hype surrounding plasma's alleged superiority and bitterly disappointed when I got my first PZ85 last week. However this was faulty and the replacement has excellent PQ (though not build quality) and I am possibly a convert to plasma!
I would suggest that perhaps you give plasma another go by comparing side by side with a top LCD set. You may find that the shimmering does actually become less noticeable and some of LCDs traits become more apparent.
As you say, you can always stick with your known product, the CRT. I feel you are missing out on some of the HD benefits though.
Good luck with your investigation.
That's not a bad idea actually Clare, although I suppose I'd still need a normal tv for those non-cinematic moments. The thought of watching Corrie on a 6 foot screen is quite scary... 
I see a projector demo in my future!
I see a projector demo in my future!
Thanks for your comprehensive reply Cooney, its nice to hear the view of someone who also notices the shimmering
[quote user="rdsoftware"]That's not a bad idea actually Clare, although I suppose I'd still need a normal tv for those non-cinematic moments. The thought of watching Corrie on a 6 foot screen is quite scary...
I see a projector demo in my future![/quote]
It's amazing how soon you get used to watching everything on a big screen!
If I really can't stand the thought of powering up the projector and immersing myself in something, I watch it via my laptop (15in screen). And that's it - my flat is currently a TV-set-free zone.... (Makes up for the millions of the blighters that reside in our test rooms at any one time!)
I see a projector demo in my future![/quote]
It's amazing how soon you get used to watching everything on a big screen!
If I really can't stand the thought of powering up the projector and immersing myself in something, I watch it via my laptop (15in screen). And that's it - my flat is currently a TV-set-free zone.... (Makes up for the millions of the blighters that reside in our test rooms at any one time!)
Well I havn't noticed any flickering or anything else on my 42" 85. If you can notice this then obviously a demo of a comparible lcd would be the best idea.
I've always loved the idea of getting a projector, but I think you would need a decent sized room and wallet to go this route. I remember a cinema magazine thingy that came with one of the WHFSV magazines from a while back. One of the owners setups had a plasma for normal tv watching, and then a projector screen that would drop down in front of the plasma for movies. Another owner had his "brick shed" converted to a cinema. With sound proofed room and air con, and you guessed it the mother of all systems. Wouldn't you just love to win the lotto
I've always loved the idea of getting a projector, but I think you would need a decent sized room and wallet to go this route. I remember a cinema magazine thingy that came with one of the WHFSV magazines from a while back. One of the owners setups had a plasma for normal tv watching, and then a projector screen that would drop down in front of the plasma for movies. Another owner had his "brick shed" converted to a cinema. With sound proofed room and air con, and you guessed it the mother of all systems. Wouldn't you just love to win the lotto
It's increasingly becoming a myth you need either a large room or wallet to go the projector route.
You can get a decent HD projector for around £1000. Add a pull-up/down screen (that can be hidden away when not in use) for a few hundred more, plus budget £100 (max) to have black-out linings fitted to your curtains.
Sorted - all for less money than many of the larger flatscreens being discussed on these Forums.
And as for room size: well I live in a small flat, and have no problem using a projector and 80in screen. Again, both screen and projector technology have progressed (while prices have fallen) to accommodate everyday projector use, not just specialist home cinema applications.
Still, I agree that a dedicated cinema room would be high up on the list of lottery-win purchases!
You can get a decent HD projector for around £1000. Add a pull-up/down screen (that can be hidden away when not in use) for a few hundred more, plus budget £100 (max) to have black-out linings fitted to your curtains.
Sorted - all for less money than many of the larger flatscreens being discussed on these Forums.
And as for room size: well I live in a small flat, and have no problem using a projector and 80in screen. Again, both screen and projector technology have progressed (while prices have fallen) to accommodate everyday projector use, not just specialist home cinema applications.
Still, I agree that a dedicated cinema room would be high up on the list of lottery-win purchases!
I am abit out of touch with todays projectors. Last time I was looking a half decent projector was around £2.5k. It's amazing how much performance and quality you can buy for your money these days.
Who wouldn't love a dedicated cinema room ? Come on you allegadly lucky dips
Like I say it was a few years back when I saw that magazine. I think it was a collection of different systems at different price points, including the seperate cinema rooms/sheds. I remember one system had a complete room built from scratch. I think they had those Triad in wall speakers all round. Recessed into the walls. Proper big comfy recliner's,pop corn machine etc. Lovely
Who wouldn't love a dedicated cinema room ? Come on you allegadly lucky dips
Like I say it was a few years back when I saw that magazine. I think it was a collection of different systems at different price points, including the seperate cinema rooms/sheds. I remember one system had a complete room built from scratch. I think they had those Triad in wall speakers all round. Recessed into the walls. Proper big comfy recliner's,pop corn machine etc. Lovely
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