Second hand system advice

[admin_exported]

Hi guys,

Im looking to buy my first system and think I will do down the second hand route as I hope this would be better value.

Source will be a rega rp1 plus itunes + spotify though a laptop and airport express. (Have those already) In the future I would add a dac.

From trawling the forums a lot the Pioneer a400 seems very well regarded as do the Mission 752/753 and this is often a recommened combination.

I could probably pick up these two for about £300. In this pricerange which alternatives would you recommend? I could go up to about £5-600 in the second hand route. If you think new is way better please let me know.

I listen to rock / blues / singer-songwriter / 60s-70s soul...

Many thanks!

Daniel

 

[plastic penguin]

Buying s/hand can be a really good way of optimising your budget. However, auction sites tend to be hit 'n' miss.

This may do the trick: http://www.richersounds.com/package/system-savers/hifi-separate-systems/pah01316

 

[nlanks]

I'm a big advocate of second hand but it can be a bit hit and miss, but if you do your homework you can mitigate this and get a superb system for peanuts.

Best to email the seller with a few questions first, from their responses you can likely gauge how well cared for an item may have been etc, and whether they have owned from new. If you can buy from a seller from who you can pick up that is always great too, as you can inspect and listen to the item before parting with your cash. If there is obviously anything wrong with it you can cancel the deal legitimately before parting with the cash.

With regards Amps I would chuck the Audiolab 8000A into the mix too. I own one of the older grey ones (pre '91), and whilst still going great, the RCA sockets on the back are prone to breaking (mines off to have these replaced soon and serviced at the same time). A post 91 model (with black fascia, and extra CD input) is a better bet as they have gold RCA connectors. 8000A has a superb phono stage in too for the RP1.

I have heard the A400 too as my Dad has owned one from new, and it is good. Would take my Audioab over it though given the choice.

Your 752/753 speaker choice is a good one, heard the 753s - cracking tight bass from the array of smaller drivers. With speakers I would definitely advocate picking them up and listening first before buying. Check or damaged tweeters and drivers etc, and ny distortion when listening.

End of the day, as long as you don't pay over the odds you can always sell on, recoup all your money and try something else.

 

[Anonymous]

I like the older Audiolab 8000a too. Also the pre and power combo will be a good choice. Make sure they had have their service when you buy them 2hand!

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the advice so far, will keep it in mind while buying.

The audiolab amp looks really interesting. Which speakers would you match it with? Is the Missions still a good choice?

I've seen Epos ES11 mentioned to be a good choice. If going say Mission 752 would you pick the freedom version or not?

Many thanks!

 

[nlanks]

From what I know:

The Audiolab 8000a is quite a neutral amp, with a very clean sound. It's pretty capable of driving large speakers, even with lowish sensitivitys, but I noticed a massive difference in capability in driving my MA GR20s when I added a 8000P.

From what I've read and above:

The 753's may be a bit harder to drive than the 752's.

The Freedom model seems to employ a better and less harsh tweeter, which given the Audiolabs clean tendencies, would probably be a better match to save it all sounding a bit bright.

The 752's used custom drivers, and seem to be better thought of as all rounders than the 753's.

So from what I've read etc I would be looking for 752 freedoms to partner

The Epos ES11 were seemingly often sold as good partners to the 8000A. As stand mounters they aren't going to go as low as either of the missions probably, but that may not be a bad thing depending on the size of your room. Never heard them though so can't comment further on them.

Buying s/h is always going to involve a bit of tral and error, and as long as you don't pay over the odds, you shouldn't lose money if you decide to pass them on again.

 

[toyota man]

Hi Daniel 81 I ran a pair of mission 752s which I still have with an Audiolab 8000a and 8000px for 15 years a good cobination an 8000a will run the 752s without any problems good luck with your search

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Daniel,

Consider the Audiolab 8000S, Pioneer A300R Precison or Cyrus 6vs2/7 (the Cyrus and Audiolab both have good upgrade paths). As for Speakers, the Mission 753's are impressive - A friend of mine recently bought a pair for under £200 and I'd buy a pair if I had the room! You could any of those combinations for around £400-500 which is a bargain.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi and thanks everyone for the advice.

Toyota man: Great to hear you had this combination, how would you characterize the sound? Some people say the audiolab is quite clean and bright which wouldn't be my preference.

I think I settled for getting the Mission 752's (freedoms hopefully), just the amp part is still undecided... cujo101 - looking into your suggestions!

 

[omnibeard]

From what I remember (but it's a long time ago so I could be wrong) the Freedom models of all the 75-series Mission speakers (751, 752, 753) were considerably brighter than their original counterparts.

Pretty sure that those original counterparts are generally considered superior, but then I guess that might depend a lot on partnering/room etc.

 

[omnibeard]

A guy I bought some speakers off not so long ago had an Audiolab 8000A driving some Neat Motive 2s - which I suspect are not the easiest speakers to drive? - and he said he currently has, and has in the past had, much more expensive amps and that he would never sell it, and keeps going back to it.

I do like the Pioneer A400 and think it works very well with Mission 751s and 752s.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi,

I finally managed to get my hands on some 752 freedoms!

Still undecided on amp though, I won't be able to bring the speakers to any shops for listening so relying on your excellent opinions. The contenders are still Pioneer A400, Audiolab 8000a (maybe together with a 8000p?) and to throw you off perhaps Rega Brio-r?

What are your opinions? Obviously the Rega is more expensive but if I would go for the 8000a+8000p combination it be pretty much even, which would you prefer in that case? Any other suggestions?

Thanks a lot!

 

[toyota man]

Hi,

I finally managed to get my hands on some 752 freedoms!

Still undecided on amp though, I won't be able to bring the speakers to any shops for listening so relying on your excellent opinions. The contenders are still Pioneer A400, Audiolab 8000a (maybe together with a 8000p?) and to throw you off perhaps Rega Brio-r?

What are your opinions? Obviously the Rega is more expensive but if I would go for the 8000a+8000p combination it be pretty much even, which would you prefer in that case? Any other suggestions?

Thanks a lot!

Hi I am sorry I missed your last post I loved my 752s I have just given them to my son they sounded very open with a good bass and an excelent sound stage which had a wide sweet spot ie you didn't need to sit bang in the middle of the speakers to hear the sound stage they sounded good with my Audiolabs and even better with my m6i . havent heard Rega Brio-r with the 752s it will probably sound great good luck

 

[the record spot]

See if you can find a Sansui AU-217 amp. I used one with a pair of the original 752s and a Marantz SA70010-KI and the combination was sublime. You should be able to get a 217 for under £75. Mine was serviced and delivered for £33 all in.

 

[Anonymous]

Reading up on the Sansui amp (or amps) now - thanks for the tip! Do you prefer it to the other alternatives even if they are a bit more?

 

[hoopsontoast]

The Sony ES amps are well worth a look, like the 670ES, 770ES can both be had for £150/£300 respectivley. Both have loads of inputs, decent MM/MC and sound smooth with power, the 770ES will drive just about anything you thow at it!

A Brio3 can be had for around £150 now as well, if you dont need the extra little power that the Brio-R has.

I think you may even find a Denon PMA-1500AE for around £350-£400, like the sony's plenty of inputs and power.

For around that price (£300ish) you can get a pretty decent used valve amp like the Icon Audio Stereo 20, even seen a Consonance Cyber 100 go for £400 which is pretty good!

 

[Anonymous]

Keeping my eye for the Sony's and the other models you mentioned - thanks a lot!

Any other ideads or opinions on the optioins mentoined?

 

[SteveR750]

NAD make a good solid used buy, but not the cheapest as they are in high demand. There's a very nice looking C352 on ebay as we speak. WHF product of the year in 05 ish..?

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the suggestion Steve! Would be a great alternative but looking for an amp with a great phono stage and I dont think the nad has one?

 

[Anonymous]

Recap: Have now got the Mission 752 Freedoms and keeping a look out for an amp to partner them. Source will be a Rega Rp1 Turntable and spotify through airport express. (Maybe adding a dac later)

The main contenders are :

Pioneer A-400

Audiolab 8000a

Sansui AU-217 / AU 717

Thanks a lot for the suggestions so far, I'm reading up on all of them. Any more ideas or comments on the contenders?

Besides fleabay and gumtree is there any other places I should look? What would be a guide price for the amps mentioned?

Thanks!

 

[the record spot]

Hi Daniel.

The Pioneer 400 varies - Gumtree will get you the better price, Ebay tends to be in the £100-£150 bracket. The Audiolab, again, around the same. The Sansui amps expect to pay around £50 for the 217 and for a mint 717, I guess these days you'd be nearer the £250-300 mark. Allow a further £50-100 for a service for the 717.

Check out some independent hifi dealers - I've picked up a few items at good prices and well below the Ebay auction or BIN sale price. It's down to luck, timing and knowing what you're looking for. Might as well throw in some patience as well!

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks Record spot. Keeping my eyes open and being patient...for now!

How would you characherise the difference in sound between the pioneer, audiolab and sansui?

 

[drummerman]

Hi guys,

Im looking to buy my first system and think I will do down the second hand route as I hope this would be better value.

Source will be a rega rp1 plus itunes + spotify though a laptop and airport express. (Have those already) In the future I would add a dac.

From trawling the forums a lot the Pioneer a400 seems very well regarded as do the Mission 752/753 and this is often a recommened combination.

I could probably pick up these two for about £300. In this pricerange which alternatives would you recommend? I could go up to about £5-600 in the second hand route. If you think new is way better please let me know.

I listen to rock / blues / singer-songwriter / 60s-70s soul...

Many thanks!

Daniel

Honestly, if I'd start out now I would just get one of those all-in-one systems like the Denon CEOL or Marantz ones.

Saves you from a life long obsession with upgrading etc plus it probably sounds as good as your suggestions plus its new, has a warranty, streams etc.

regards

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Drummerman and thanks for the suggestions.

I did have a look at the marantz 603 before and it does look pretty good and its an interesting thought. They dont have phono stages through which I am looking for. Would be interested to hear what other members think of Denon/Marantz vs older gear?

 

[the record spot]

Thanks Record spot. Keeping my eyes open and being patient...for now!

How would you characherise the difference in sound between the pioneer, audiolab and sansui?

Never heard the three of them together or in the same system. That generation of Sansui amps were very well built and fitted very easily into the systems they were in. Caveats with those amps though as they usually need a service, they're packed inside, and the Sansui has a glue residue that can sometimes corrode.

The other two I don't know from personal experience am afraid. Sorry.