New Denon CEOL (N8) and Marantz MCR 603 - what are the significant differences?

[admin_exported]

Hi,

Just moved to a new home and it's time to get a new stereo system. I want to move away from separates, and I've narrowed the selection down to the new Denon Ceol (N 8) and the classic Marantz MCR 603. I searched the net and this forum, but I wasn't able to find any review or info on the new Denon. By looking at the specs, seems like the Denon can play 192/24 FLAC files, but couldn't find any other significant difference. I am not interested in Airplay and I have a wired network connection, so wifi is not that important. Typical usage would be internet radio and streaming from the NAS/PC.

They are both at approximately the same price (unit only, I will be pairing them with Dali Zensor 5). So any input on how to tilt the balance would be appreciated. Is 192/24 capability important? Does anyone have the new Ceol - how does it sound?

Thank you

 

[Anonymous]

Before anyone asks: Yes, I considered the new Onkyo 755. Looks very nice, but it has just a bit too little power (Zensors are 6 ohm, so it will be lower than 2x20w).

 

[DocG]

Is 192/24 capability important?

Just read this thread (428 posts, and counting...). :O

 

[Anonymous]

Well, they both do have 24bit capability up to 24/96. I was wondering if the lack of 192/24 capability makes the Marantz handicapped in any way (in all honesty I haven't seen a single file encoded at 192/24 so far).

Aside from this, are there any other significant differences?

 

[Pistol Pete1]

Was in my local hifi shop yesterday chatting to a salesman I deal with, and there was some background music being played.

As I was leaving I stopped to see which separates were being used as it sounded very good indeed, albeit at low levels.

I then realised it was coming from this New Denon CEOL systems attached to some Dali Zentor 1's......it really did sound very good indeed.

After having a chat about it, the salesman said it was selling very well, and all of a sudden the Marantz sales were not so good. Why....the Denon sound is very Marantz (same company!), it has all the features but is much cheaper than the Marantz (RRP £500+).

Both systems look great, but I do see that the Marantz can be had for the same price as the Denon now if you look around enough.

Best go find a shop and have a listen......

 

[Anonymous]

Well, being cheaper, even if made by the same company, raises a flag for me. And it's difficult to find a shop here to listen to them side by side, that's why I'm asking for opinions on this topic..

 

[Sizzers]

The previous CEOL – the N7 – was in many ways pretty much regarded as being the same as the 603; it lacked DAB but gained wi-fi and an integrated ipod dock being the only main differences as I recall.

I used to have the 603 and although I never heard the N7, opinion on the web generally seemed to favour the Marantz for SQ. As you are discovering there isn’t one available opinion out there on the N8 so it really is a shot in the dark. Are you really a million miles from a Richer Sounds/Superfi/Sevenoaks where I’m sure you could audition both together?

 

[Anonymous]

As a matter of fact, I am approximately 5,000 miles away from the US, in Europe

So yes, it is kinda difficult to find a store that has both of them on display. And I would like to make myself a nice present for the holidays, if possible.

But if there really isn't any piece of info on the new Ceol, I guess I'll just wait a bit longer ..

 

[chebby]

I can't remember if the M-CR603's D&M stablemate, the Denon CEOL, was even available when I bought my Marantz version.

I had researched offerings from Yahama, Denon, TEAC (and others) for ages beforehand. Mostly for reasons of connectivity and on board functions. I needed at least one optical digital input (I have my TV/Blu-ray/PVR feeding sounds through that) and either a rear panel mounted USB (to a computer) or, far preferably, AirPlay (to computers and iPhones/iPads etc.) to eradicate the need for yet another cable and enable me use an iPhone without a dock or cable.

I also needed decent quality CD replay (my wife still uses CD regularly) and I wanted both FM & DAB. I like to have every possible option for radio, ranging from Freeview radio (for recording onto the Humax), to internet radio from either the Marantz itself or iPhone. I even like the fact that it has two seperate DAB & FM co-axial aerial sockets. (For people who use seperate DAB and FM optimised roof aerials.

Aesthetically, I also liked the very well fitted metal suit (with radiused corners), the smart gloss black top and the overhang (on sides and top) at the rear of the unit that help obscure cables when looking at it from a standing position.

So, in March 2011, the M-CR603 was the only option that (just) satisifed every pernickety little requirement, looked good and was the right sort of price.(It was £479 + £40 for AirPlay back then.)

Of course I hadn't heard it yet.

I thought (a) It had recently got 5 stars in WHF? (b) Marantz stuff is usually, at least, quite good and well finished (c) I hate dealer demo sessions with a passion (d) My local Audio-T had sold out and had more on order including some that were already paid for. (A good sign.)

So I concluded that I might as well buy it without hearing it first and ordered one.

I also had a very fortuitously timely opportunity to buy a mint, boxed, used pair of Rega R3s in real Maple veneer from a fellow WHF? forumite living nearby. (Rega R3s are old favourites of ours.)

Not regretted either decision ever since.

It's limitations (no wi-fi, no rear-mounted USB for computer) only made me use ethernet instead (a good thing) and pushed me towards AirPlay and using my iPhone as a primary source (a very good thing as it turned out).

Good luck with selecting the one that's just right for you.

 

[Twill]

Hi mgi, I'm also weighing up between these two stablemates. I'm leaning towards the Ceol because it has native ALAC network streaming capability and I don't think the Marantz does. Plus which the marantz has been around longer and could be upgraded at any time I feel. I'm prone to that buyers angst where you worry that the exact thing you want is just around the corner. CES2013 is just around the corner for example. The Marantz has a legendary capability to drive speakers way above its price point though, and I don't know if the Denon can boast the same. Let me know how you get on, and I'll do the same.

 

[audioaddict]

just thought id add to this thread by saying i went from a 125 pc mono bloc system to a marantz cr603 and have to say that i do not miss whatthe majority of people on here would consider the superior system. i got mine for 389 pounds and for the money, the sound quality is superb . youd have to spend a fair bit more in my opinion to better it

 

[Anonymous]

Well, the thing is that I was almost on my way to pick up the Marantz. And then I read about the new Ceol being launched.

Knowing that the old Ceol was more or less the same thing as the MCR603, I am now wondering what does the new Ceol bring up to the table and if I need it or not..

 

[chebby]

Well, the thing is that I was almost on my way to pick up the Marantz. And then I read about the new Ceol being launched.

Knowing that the old Ceol was more or less the same thing as the MCR603, I am now wondering what does the new Ceol bring up to the table and if I need it or not..

I'm not sure you are ever going to be completely settled in your decision (whichever way it goes) for fear that you are missing out on something. (If not from the CEOL then from some - as yet unannounced - unknown replacement to the M-CR603 that may - or may not - get launched sometime next year and may - or may not - actually be worse than the model it replaces!*)

EDIT. Sorry. The bit about speculation on a future M-CR603 replacement should have been addressed to 'Twill'.

My strong suspicion (as i've not compared them) is that you won't be able to get a cigarette paper between the Denon and the Marantz in terms of performance. So it really comes down to facilities/functions/connectivity options/compatibility/looks and your needs.

*As so often happens when a company tries to 'improve' on a classic.

 

[Anonymous]

No, I won't be holding off forever while expecting the next best thing. But these two are available now, and I'm trying to understand what the differences are, and which of the two is the best pick. That's all there is to it

LE: and main reason for trying to understand the differences is this: I can get the new Ceol (N8), with speakers, for $35 more than the Marantz unit (no speakers). And the Ceol has wifi as well. So, given the fact that they are made by the same company (more or less), what does the Ceol *not* have for that price?

 

[Twill]

Yes I agree Chebby, it's a definite short fall of mine. I just see a product and think well, that does almost everything I want, maybe the next release will have it all. Or I see one and think that is exactly what I want, but that's not my favourite manufacturer, maybe such and such a brand will release a similar thing if I wait. Odd from a person who generally no longer believes in the concept of progress, and as you say, flawed in the extreme. mgi, I'm guessing one reason for the price difference could be that the Ceol is plastic and the 603, as Chebby will confirm, has a more solid construction. Although in many dealers I'm looking at, they're both about the same price speakerless now.

 

[Anonymous]

I recently became the proud owner of a 603 and I am absolutely delighted with it (and with the Monitor Audio BX2s that came as part of the package). I'm sure that you would not be disappointed. But then I haven't heard the CEOL N8.

 

[Anonymous]

I managed to find a store that has them both. I didn't get to listen to them (was in a hurry), but I will get back . Unfortunately they didn't have Dali's to test them with, but they had MA's Silver and some Cantons. They said the MAs would have the same kind of sound as the Dali's.

And the salesmad said the Denon would have a warmer sound, in his opinion. Anyway, as I said, will get back and listen to them both.

First impression, just by looking at the two, is that the Denon is a cheaper build. The case was entirely plastic, the buttons didn't feel the same to touch or when pressed. Not sure how it compared to the old Ceol, if it's the same or worse in that respect.

 

[Anonymous]

I am now the happy owner of a Marantz

I went to the store to listen to them both. The Marantz sound was better - more defined and yet not cold. The bass response seemed better in the Denon. I heard them both on a pair of Boston Acoustics A series floorstanders - not sure of the exact model. The overall sound quality was very good in both, in the end I think it was a matter of taste.

There is one thing that the Denon is clearly superior at - the menu, folder navigation (I used an USB drive) and display readability. But I thought it's a small sacrifice for the better sound Besides, I'm hoping that there may be a firmware update to fix that.

Oh, and the Denon was cheaper by approx. $100.

LE: there was one thing I didn't pay attention to, but I realized it in the store: they don't read FLAC's off CDs. Just thought I'd mention that in case someone needs that feature.

LLE: The Marantz can't skip/cue through a track played from USB or network, not even with the latest firmware. The Denon can skip through USB tracks, didn't get to test that with network ones.

 

[paddyb]

I am now the happy owner of a Marantz

I went to the store to listen to them both. The Marantz sound was better - more defined and yet not cold. The bass response seemed better in the Denon. I heard them both on a pair of Boston Acoustics A series floorstanders - not sure of the exact model. The overall sound quality was very good in both, in the end I think it was a matter of taste.

There is one thing that the Denon is clearly superior at - the menu, folder navigation (I used an USB drive) and display readability. But I thought it's a small sacrifice for the better sound Besides, I'm hoping that there may be a firmware update to fix that.

Oh, and the Denon was cheaper by approx. $100.

LE: there was one thing I didn't pay attention to, but I realized it in the store: they don't read FLAC's off CDs. Just thought I'd mention that in case someone needs that feature.

LLE: The Marantz can't skip/cue through a track played from USB or network, not even with the latest firmware. The Denon can skip through USB tracks, didn't get to test that with network ones.

Has anything changed with firmware updates for the Marantz in regard to folder navigation when browsing a USB drive and skipping through tracks? And will it play them gapless off a USB?

I have a thread about this, but no conclusive answers yet:

http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/gapless-playback-on-denon-ceol-rcd-n8-marantz-m-cr603-and-onkyo-cr-n755