My test. CD versus lossless thru squeezebox

[method man]

Hi all. I finally got around to checking if there was a difference between

1) Cd played through Sony 360 DVD player to optical in of AVI 9.1

2) Cd played throughArcam Alpha 7se cd player to optical in of AVI 9.1

3) Lossless rip of CD played through Squeezebox to optical in of AVI 9.1

(Avi have an inbuilt Dac).

First I set up the two spinners with Burning Spear big band reggae Nyah Keet ( alive in 97).

The speakers have a remote that can switch from input 1 to input 2 . so i set both to play with the arcam 1 sec in advance. so could toggle an not rely on memory.

I did the same with christy moores 'smoke and strong whisky'.

To me they sounded exactly the same.

Ok now I plugged in the squeezebox to the optical in. and left the DVD connected.

I played them again with the 1ish sec delay. this time the DVD sounded much better

the squeezebox was quiet and dull sounded. ( that was a worry). Luckily it also then stopped playing and made some jittering. I thought back to my earlier squeezecentre ( desktop) rescan of my newly ripped flac into the system and that I had half noted that the signal strength to the squeezebox was only 40 or so percent. It does vary from time to time but never generally so low.

anyway I removed the cordless phone from ontop of the router (cheers love) and the signal reached 70 odd percent.

started the test again. This time I could discern no difference from CD or DVD player and wireless squeezbox.

I often just play 320 mp3s and never really have to worry about signal strength. FLAC passes a lot more info and needs a better signal.

So my conclusion is that for me at least. those two spinners sound the same as FLAC as long as the signal strength to the squeezebox is decent.

I should add, that i have the same tracks ripped in 128 and 320. and whilst i cannot toggle as quickly to play them each, im sure I can tell the difference between 320 and FLAC.

 

[idc]

So, to clarify; changing the transport between DVD and CDP made no difference. Once you had sorted out an interference problem with the Squeezbox, there was no difference between all three. And, you are sure that if there was a difference between all three, you would have heard it, because you can hear a difference between 320kbps and lossless FLAC.

 

[method man]

thats pretty much it idc. to me, and on my system, i couldnt tell the difference between sources. but i can, I think, tell a lack of depth of mp3 versus flac but its not night and day.

and I would urge anyone doing wireless keep an eye on your signal strength because interference from the cordless phone did make a huge difference.

 

[chebby]

An interesting contrast to Joel's CD vs Lossless findings so far.

 

[idc]

And Joel, I am sure has a cordless phone ontop of a speaker right next to his system. I wonder if there is an interference issue there as well?

 

[method man]

He also probably doesn't have to deal with this sort of caper.

Joe Strummer deserves better!

 

[Andrew Everard]

Nice subwoofer, but won't it look a bit silly in July?

 

[method man]

LOL very good Andrew.

see the product placement?

 

[Anonymous]

My experience is that the lossless file, taken from the Squeezebox, and connected via optical cable to the ADM9.1's sounds superb using the AVI DAC. Certainly better than CD.

I also had issues regarding signal strength in the house. We have three floors and the signal would fluctuate from 40% to 65%, the router being on the top floor and the Squeezebox downstairs on the ground floor. To get round this, I bought a pair of Solway 85mbs Powerplugs. These allow you to create an Ethernet connection between two points. You just take an Ethernet cable, attach one end to your wireless router and then the other to a Powerplug, which is plugged in to the nearest available mains socket. At the Squeezebox end run an Ethernet cable from your SB to a Powerplug, also plugged in to its nearest available mains power socket. Bingo! An Ethernet wired connection! Doing this has solved all connection issues associated with low strength wi-fi signals.

I think I got mine on the net on special offer, there are plenty of suppliers about.

 

[Andrew Everard]

method man:see the product placement?

Ignored it as it was last month's

 

[Gerrardasnails]

chebby:
An interesting contrast to Joel's CD vs Lossless findings so far.

I have to say that I'm very surprised that they all sounded the same. I would have had my money on the FLAC all day long. I've used my bluray player as transport to my DacMagic and lossless files beat it comfortably.

 

[method man]

i would have thought into the same dac, using the same cables it should all be the same.

 

[Anonymous]

FLAC is definitely better than MP3 IMHO, all things being equal. But a poor FLAC recording vs a good recording on MP3 can sound close.

I now stream plenty of radio. MP3 radio sounds pretty good.

 

[method man]

Gerrard

I wonder , if its my rather challenged 'listening room'. see pic. i usually have grills off

speakers out of the bay and the curtain closed behind them. perhaps not a great way to test as is. LOL

shes even put candles on the speakers. those atabites were worth it then dear.

 

[Gerrardasnails]

method man:
Gerrard

I wonder , if its my rather challenged 'listening room'. see pic. i usually have grills off

speakers out of the bay and the curtain closed behind them. perhaps not a great way to test as is. LOL

It could be but it's the same for each one. It could be me hearing things that don't exist! The reason I think that lossless works better is fairly simple. A cd has all the information on it. The cd player (or dvd/bd player) has to scan all that information and then pass it on to the digital cable to send it to the DAC. With the lossless files, that bit has already been done. I've also listened recently to my Dad's system that I set up for him. He has a fairly budget system of 10 year old Denon amp, Beresford DAC and Kef IQ1s. He has a Sony dvd recorder (very good one) and we tested the cd played via the dvd player to the DAC and compared it to his main set up which is a Western Digial Media Player that connects to an external hard drive. He's ripped his cds to 320kbps mp3s and they sounded night and day better than the cd! It was kind of a blind test as my Dad and Brother-in-law had no idea what I was doing and both immediately went for the mp3s.

 

[method man]

i see your point. i guess waht im saying is that its not really setup for critical listening of any source. so harder to pinpoint changes.

 

[Anonymous]

Method Man I have just bought the Avi's and mine are also on the partington super drednaught stands, I am usind a Cyrus discmaster as transport cannaeted via Toslink and my ipod connected via Russ Andrews GQ-24 cable connected to a Project headbox to the Avi's via Phono cables. So far I have found my ipod does not sound as loud without touching the volume control. The sound is brilliant via all sources.Itunes downloads are very good in general, lossless of cd's is better and Cd's are about the same. I want to listen more before I post a review but so far we are very impressed with the sound and the quality.

 

[idc]

method man:

I wonder , if its my rather challenged 'listening room'. see pic......

Your speaker placement is one of the standards for a living room and way better than some of the compromises I have had to put up with. I assume that speaker manufacturers do test their kit in normal home environments. I take it your listening chair is where the photo was taken from.

 

[Gerrardasnails]

Nick21:Method Man I have just bought the Avi's and mine are also on the partington super drednaught stands, I am usind a Cyrus discmaster as transport cannaeted via Toslink and my ipod connected via Russ Andrews GQ-24 cable connected to a Project headbox to the Avi's via Phono cables. So far I have found my ipod does not sound as loud without touching the volume control. The sound is brilliant via all sources.Itunes downloads are very good in general, lossless of cd's is better and Cd's are about the same. I want to listen more before I post a review but so far we are very impressed with the sound and the quality.

Surely your iPod connected with the RA cable would bypass the DAC in the AVIs? If so, and you find it the same as cd's connected to the AVIs using toslink, and therefore utilising the DAC in the AVIs, I'm puzzled. The DAC in the AVIs is supposed to be excellent.

 

[Anonymous]

Gerrardasnails that may be true.As you say using the RA cable still uses the dac in the ipod,the most obvious difference is only the volume is less than if iI play a Cd through the transport(unless my ears are shot). I would like to try an Onkyo Nd dock? as it bypasses the dac,to see if I can hear the difference if so I will upgrade>