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Line output into amplifier

cisamcgu

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Feb 10, 2014
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I'm just pondering options really - and I presume a newer, better amplifier would sound nicer than the old Denon.
 

davedotco

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Apr 24, 2013
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Power amplifiers often make little difference to sound quality but in this case there might be some benifit. The Denon is what it is and the amplifier section will not be all that powerful by real world standards.

A better integrated connected in the way you describe will probably give you more options as to the speakers you can use, will play louder and sound better.

Given the likely limitations of the Denon as a source, this may or may not be worthwhile. Take it into a dealer and try it.
 

cisamcgu

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Feb 10, 2014
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Dave,

Indeed, I do plan to take it to a dealer, in fact I did that a few days ago, and tested it with the Marantz 6005 amplifier - however, that amp has an optical input so I was wondering if connecting the LINE OUT would amount to the same thing. Basically I wondered if doing that would be functionally equivalent to the optical connection.

Andrew
 

iMark

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May 16, 2008
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I had a look at the pictures and your Denon has several connection options, Line Out, Pre Out and Optical out.

For playing CDs I would use the optical out and use the DAC in the Marantz 6005. I'm pretty sure the DAC in the Marantz is better so you could just use the Denon as a CD transport.

You could also use the tuner as a source but that will be analogue out only. I would use the Pre Out for connecting the Denon to the Marantz if you want to use the tuner.
 

cisamcgu

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Feb 10, 2014
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Thanks, and yes, I understand about the Marantz and the opical input - my question was really aimed at the solution I would need if I didn't have an amp with an optical input - a NAD or ROTEL for example.

Cheers

Andrew
 

The_Lhc

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Oct 16, 2008
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iMark said:
You could also use the tuner as a source but that will be analogue out only. I would use the Pre Out for connecting the Denon to the Marantz if you want to use the tuner.
Might be better off using the Line-Out with an integrated amp, from the description on the linked website the Pre-out is inline of the volume control, so you'd have two volume controls in the link if using an integrated amp. Of course if you're using a power amp then the pre-out is the one you want.
 

davedotco

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Apr 24, 2013
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cisamcgu said:
Thanks, and yes, I understand about the Marantz and the opical input - my question was really aimed at the solution I would need if I didn't have an amp with an optical input - a NAD or ROTEL for example.

Cheers

Andrew
OK, I understand.

You have three choices, the 'line outs', 'pre-amp' outs and 'digital'.

If you want to use both the CD and the tuner you would have to check that the tuner signal is present at the digital output, to be honest this is unlikely but worth checking.

The 'line outs' are fixed level and suitable for any amplifier. The Denon volume is out of circuit so the volume will be controlled by the second amplifier. Functionally it will be the same as the setup you heard. You will be able to listen to both the CD and tuner as you wish, selected on the Denon in the usual way. If you have anything plugged into the other inputs on the Denon then you can listen to them too.

Either method will work fine though I suspect, as I said, that the digital out will be CD only. In theory the dac in the Marantz should be better, but the difference may be quite small. Connect both the digital and line outs to your second amp (if it has a dac of course) and try it, see if there is a worthwhile difference.

Avoid the pre-amp out in this instance, both the volune controls on the Denon and the second amp are in circuit and could cause confusion and possibly damage.

To be honest it depends where you are going with this, using the Denon as a source will work fine with a second amplifier as you heard but it is not a big step up, you need better sources to get the best from the Marantz and as you also heard, better speakers too.
 

Crocodile

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Jan 15, 2009
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I would think you'd almost certainly be better off selling the Denon & putting the money towards a standalone CDP or maybe the Marantz MCR-610. Although the Denon is a pretty good little unit for what it is (I have one).
 

iMark

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May 16, 2008
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I don't see why a more expensive CDP would be any better than using the Denon as a CD transport and decent amp with a DAC like the Marantz.
 

Crocodile

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iMark said:
I don't see why a more expensive CDP would be any better than using the Denon as a CD transport and decent amp with a DAC like the Marantz.
That wasn't the question though, he was asking about line level.
 

jjbomber

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Dec 22, 2006
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Crocodile said:
iMark said:
I don't see why a more expensive CDP would be any better than using the Denon as a CD transport and decent amp with a DAC like the Marantz.
That wasn't the question though, he was asking about line level.
But the question went on to ask about using the Denon as a CD transport only, which means a digital output to a third party DAC. The question contradicts itself.
 

cisamcgu

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Feb 10, 2014
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I am sorry if I have been contradicting myself - I am only just beginning to feel my way around - apologies.

This is where I am currently :

I have tested the Denon connected via an optical (Toslink?) cable to a Marantz amplifier in my local dealer - and to my ears it sounded just as good as the Maranatz CDplayer connected to the Marantz amplifier. However, I was wondering if a similar thing would be possible with an amplifier that DID NOT have an optical connection (and therefore I assume no DAC either), e.g a NAD or ROTEL amplifier - i.e. could I make a connection from the Denon M30 to a NAD amplifier somehow which would bypass the Denon amplifier/volume control and let me use the NAD controls.

This is my way of taking a step by step approach - trying to understand how things fit together without buying the wrong thing.

I apologise again if I am less than clear.:oops:

Andrew
 

matt49

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Apr 7, 2013
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cisamcgu said:
This is my way of taking a step by step approach - trying to understand how things fit together without buying the wrong thing.

I apologise again if I am less than clear.:oops:

Andrew
No, you're doing the right thing by asking for advice, and there's no need to apologise.

Could you connect the Denon to the amp + DAC with both the digital out and the line out, and then select the inputs on the amp depending which source you're using (digital for CD or line out for tuner)?

Matt
 

cisamcgu

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Feb 10, 2014
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I am really thinking about using the Denon as a CD player only. I rarely use the tuner facility. Can I plug the Denon into an amplifier that has no optical input, bypassing the Denon volume controls ?
 

The_Lhc

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Oct 16, 2008
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cisamcgu said:
I am really thinking about using the Denon as a CD player only. I rarely use the tuner facility. Can I plug the Denon into an amplifier that has no optical input, bypassing the Denon volume controls ?
Yes you can, we covered that already, use one of the line-outs.
 

Crocodile

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Jan 15, 2009
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cisamcgu said:
I am really thinking about using the Denon as a CD player only. I rarely use the tuner facility. Can I plug the Denon into an amplifier that has no optical input, bypassing the Denon volume controls ?
No need to apologise as there are no contradictions. Your original question was perfectly clear & has been answered.
 

davedotco

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Apr 24, 2013
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To see exactly what is going on, do the same dem (if you can) but connect both the digital out to the Marantz as before and also one of the line outs (not the pre-outs) to a line in on the Marantz.

It is then simple to switch between them and see which is best. Try and listen at the same subjective volume, ignore the position of the volume control as best you can.
 

jjbomber

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Dec 22, 2006
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cisamcgu said:
I have tested the Denon connected via an optical (Toslink?) cable to a Marantz amplifier in my local dealer - and to my ears it sounded just as good as the Maranatz CDplayer connected to the Marantz amplifier.

Andrew
That's your nirvana right there. You just need to find what is right for you; it does not matter about the technical detail. If that is the sound you loved, then go for it.
 

cisamcgu

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Feb 10, 2014
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Thank you to everyone - you have been a tremendous help.

I have the chance to demo and buy an "as new" ex-display NAD C316BEE amp for £100, and I am very tempted .. :? I know it is probably not as good as the Marantz PM6006 and doesn't have an optical input or phone stage, but I already have a REGA mini A2D phone stage and it looks like I can connect the Denon to the NAD via the LINE out/CD in .. so .. for £100 v. £300 .. I may well become a NAD owner - would the same speakers that work with a Marantz work with the NAD ? I assuming so ...

I'll keep you informed

Andrew
 

cisamcgu

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Feb 10, 2014
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Well,

I'm now the proud owner of a perfect, ex-demo, NAD C316BEE .. it sounded, superb, to my ears, better than the Marantz PM6005 (and only 1/3 of the price :p ). Sadly I cannot afford the speakers I audtioned with, the MA Bronze, but hopefully in a month or two, I will take the amp into a hifi shop, and audition my way to a lovely pair of speakers. MA, Dali, Wharfedale ... any options anyone thinks ?

Thanks for all your help and advice, from one happy chap :)

Andrew
 

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