KEF REF 1: Which Amp will give the sweetest sound?

[nemo78]

Hi!

I've now had the Cayin amp in my system for a few days and been listening extensively almost every day.

To recap, my existing main system, before I bought the Cayin amp, was the Krell Vanguard and the KEF Reference 1s.

So I brought the Cayin amp home and promptly set aside the Krell and connected the Cayin to REF 1s.

Listened for a day or two. While it was certainly warmer and pleasant, I didnt quite manage to get the incredible sound I had experienced at the dealers.

Got the idea to switch speakers. I have a KEF R500 in my HT and a pair of Dali Ikon 6 MK2s in another system.

First tried the Dalis. INCREDIBLE. In terms of warmth and an exciting listen, they were the best I had ever had at home.

Listened for a few days. Then tried the KEF R500s.

The Dalis were more exciting, but the R500 has more control. The bass was a bit loose with the Dalis.

Now I am really happy and content with this setup, will continue with this and add a Cayin CDP when I can.

(Just to be sure, I again connected the REF1s to the Cayin. In case the amp had not quite been broken in when I first tested. Still its not that good a listen, I definitely enjoy the floorstanders better).

 

[ellisdj]

What ports do you have in the ref 1? Long or short

 

[nemo78]

What ports do you have in the ref 1? Long or short

Tried both in fact. Not very good.

I just can't figure out why the REF1s dont sound that good with the Cayin. Not enough power?

 

[ellisdj]

If your preferring the floodstanders you will want the short ports. Doesnt matter if you tried them both

 

[nemo78]

If your preferring the floodstanders you will want the short ports. Doesnt matter if you tried them both

I dont always prefer floorstanders over stand mounts. For instance, with the Krell, I prefer the REF1s over the Dali/R500s.

 

[CnoEvil]

Hi Nemo.

- In order to try and replicate the sound you heard at the dealer, you need to (as much as possible), keep everything the same - Source, Cables...even speakers.

- I have always had a concern that a Valve amp might not fully handle the speakers, which is why I was suggesting Monoblocks and that you would be spending around 5k.

- The reason I suggested a Hybrid (Pathos), is that you get a lot of the Euphony of Valves with the control of Solid State.

- Do you have access to Audio Note, whose speakers work great with Valve Amps and are designed to work against walls and in corners.

- Often, getting a cheaper, less revealing, easier to drive speaker, actually gives a more pleasant sound.

- Getting a Valve CD may improve things, but if the problem (with the Refs) is one of control and power, it may make things a little worse.

I think you want to keep the organic quality of the sound, without losing the exciting punch and drive. If this is the case, you will either need to get:

- Very powerful and expensive Valve Monoblocks, if keeping the Refs

- Keep the Valves and get valve friendly speakers (like Audio Note)

- Get something like the Pathos Logos, which would drive the Refs better and still sound smooth and exciting.

 

[nemo78]

Hi Nemo.

- In order to try and replicate the sound you heard at the dealer, you need to (as much as possible), keep everything the same - Source, Cables...even speakers.

- I have always had a concern that a Valve amp might not fully handle the speakers, which is why I was suggesting Monoblocks and that you would be spending around 5k.

- The reason I suggested a Hybrid (Pathos), is that you get a lot of the Euphony of Valves with the control of Solid State.

- Do you have access to Audio Note, whose speakers work great with Valve Amps and are designed to work against walls and in corners.

- Often, getting a cheaper, less revealing, easier to drive speaker, actually gives a more pleasant sound.

- Getting a Valve CD may improve things, but if the problem (with the Refs) is one of control and power, it may make things a little worse.

I think you want to keep the organic quality of the sound, without losing the exciting punch and drive. If this is the case, you will either need to get:

- Very powerful and expensive Valve Monoblocks, if keeping the Refs

- Keep the Valves and get valve friendly speakers (like Audio Note)

- Get something like the Pathos Logos, which would drive the Refs better and still sound smooth and exciting.

Hi CnoE,

Thanks for the ideas.

Currently I am very happy with the sound from the Cayin and the R500, so I will keep it as the main system (living room), and maybeadd a Cayin CDP later.

I am now experimenting with the REF1s in my other systems. As I write I am listening to the REF1s in my office, powered by my Naim XS 1. (Small room, only I work in my office usually so I can listen at any (reasonable) volume, but because the speakers are so close by me, it is generally at low volume). If I find them not optimal, I'll just sell the REF1s.

 

[CnoEvil]

Hi CnoE,

Thanks for the ideas.

Currently I am very happy with the sound from the Cayin and the R500, so I will keep it as the main system (living room), and maybeadd a Cayin CDP later.

I am now experimenting with the REF1s in my other systems. As I write I am listening to the REF1s in my office, powered by my Naim XS 1. (Small room, only I work in my office usually so I can listen at any (reasonable) volume, but because the speakers are so close by me, it is generally at low volume). If I find them not optimal, I'll just sell the REF1s.

I really like the R700s, which give a flavour of the Reference sound, without being so ruthlessly revealing and hard to drive....they are, pricewise, more suitable for the amp.

I think you should realize the value of the Refs by selling them, as they are wasted on the end of the Naim....something like the LS50s would imo be better (and sound well with Naim).

I am glad you are finally getting the sound you are after....it all just takes time and experimentation....and as you have seen, getting the system synergy right for the room, is a bit of an art. It's not how much money you spend; but how you spend your money.

Do stay in touch with any further thoughts and developments.

 

[chrissasfre]

I have a perreaux 150i connected to the kef ref 3 and to my ears it is a fantastic match, high volume to low volume it sounds surperb.surperb bass layers and highs and beautifull mids in a room 8m x5m

 

[CnoEvil]

I have a perreaux 150i connected to the kef ref 3 and to my ears it is a fantastic match, high volume to low volume it sounds surperb.surperb bass layers and highs and beautifull mids in a room 8m x5m

The problem Nemo has, is a room that effs up the sound of a system, that works great in other more normal rooms, which are less reflective.

(Nice system btw)