How to audition new equipment?

[admin_exported]

Hi,

I'm off to audition some Naim equipment in a couple of weeks.

I'll be listening to CDPs - CD5i, CD5XS and CDX2 and amps - Nait5i, Nait XS, SuperNait & NAC200+NAP200 Combo.

The idea being that I will establish my reference for auditioning other systems as well as helping me to set my budget. I'm starting with Naim because I am so blown away by the sound of my Uniti.

I'm now doing my homework before I go. A couple of questions:

1. How should I establish a reference speaker for trying these different systems, do I just pick one that I am familiar with (Neat Motive 3's for example) and then stick to the same speakers whilst I try the out the different electronics. The advantage being that I am comparing the difference that the electronics make. Or should I try price appropriate speakers for each system? Assuming that some of the more expensive gear will only really show the benefit with more capable speakers.

2. To those of you who have tried Naim before - how big a difference between the systems will I notice, will it be subtle or obvious? How much music should I take to try them out and how long does one normally listen before making a call? (I've not bought new HiFi, except the Uniti that didn't really have anything to compare, for about 15 years)

3. I then have to go to other dealers to listen to some of the suggestions that you guys have given me for comparisons. There is likely to be a gap of a couple of weeks before I go to the next place - any hints on how to make this comparison when the systems are not side by side?

I know these questions sound a bit naive, but buying a complete new system, rather than upgrading one bit at a time, seems to me to be very complicated, and I don't want to make a mistake. This system will be the base which I'll live with for the next 15 years at least.

Thanks for your help!

David

 

[jaxwired]

Just a quick response. If at all possible, when you are comparing all those Naim amps, try and have the dealer swap them into the exact same system. CDP or source, speakers, and cables should not change, only the amp should change. Otherwise, you've really got no hope of determining real differences.

Second, make a compilation CD (using full res files) of music that is:

1. Very well produced. Meaning clean and clear sounding.

2. Varied in content. Meaning, some acoustic, some vocal, some complex rock, some deep bass, etc...

3. Music you are very familiar with. Meaning you will immediately notice that it sounds markedly different from what you are use to.

And finally, try and get the dealer to loan you the winner for an extended home demo...

 

[chebby]

jaxwired:Second, make a compilation CD (using full res files) of music that is:

1. Very well produced. Meaning clean and clear sounding.

I would argue with the point about only using well produced music to demo a system. If there is music in your collection that you enjoy - but is a less than perfect recording - take that along too.

Equally, if you enjoy internet radio (you have a naimuniti so maybe you do) or other compressed content, then ensure you get to hear that too through the demo system.

 

[Anonymous]

The music I was intending to use:

OK Computer - Radiohead

Dynasty - Stan Getz (great Hammond organ - if the HiFi can sound like a 30" speaker from a mono analogue electric organ then it's doing well - as well as very quiet and loud passages, and one of the best jazz guitarists ever, all in the opening track)

Blackeyedpeas - Monkey Business (to see if it can get funky)

Purcel: Dido & Aeneas (harpsichord and female vocals, difficult combination to sound comfortable)

Buena Vista Social Club

I'm very familiar with all these recordings, and they represent most of the types of music I mainly listen to. It's starting to sound like a full day's audition!

 

[John Duncan]

chebby:I would argue with the point about only using well produced music to demo a system. If there is music in your collection that you enjoy - but is a less than perfect recording - take that along too.

Indeed. Before a demo once a dealer told me to bring along something that I could barely listen to on my current system (from a production point of view) - Elbow does the job for me.

 

[Anonymous]

JohnDuncan:chebby:I would argue with the point about only using well produced music to demo a system. If there is music in your collection that you enjoy - but is a less than perfect recording - take that along too.Indeed. Before a demo once a dealer told me to bring along something that I could barely listen to on my current system (from a production point of view) - Elbow does the job for me.

Know what you mean about Elbow. Trouble is, if I can barely listen to it then I have probably put it away somewhere where I can't find it. With all the work going on at my house at the moment, I have 90% of my collection in boxes in the garage. Everything is on my iPod, but most of it was recorded before I knew that you could (or should) do lossless.

I didn't really notice the difference before, but now with the Uniti, I have pretty much stopped using the iPod except in the car, and only listen to CDs. Re-ripping about 750 CDs takes a lot of time.

D

 

[jaxwired]

chebby:jaxwired:Second, make a compilation CD (using full res files) of music that is:

1. Very well produced. Meaning clean and clear sounding.

I would argue with the point about only using well produced music to demo a system. If there is music in your collection that you enjoy - but is a less than perfect recording - take that along too.

Equally, if you enjoy internet radio (you have a naimuniti so maybe you do) or other compressed content, then ensure you get to hear that too through the demo system.

Hmmm....well I can see your point. Good to know if a rubbish CD is made palatable by a system. But if a CD is rubbish, a good system should reveal that as rubbish. I would think in general that a well produced CD that is clean and clear would be the best way to assess the quality of electronics. If a CD contains distortion, compression, and poor production, then it seems like it would be difficult to utilize it to hear the subtle differences in amplifer performance. No?

 

[Anonymous]

chebby:

Equally, if you enjoy internet radio (you have a naimuniti so maybe you do) or other compressed content, then ensure you get to hear that too through the demo system.

I am loving the internet radio from my Uniti, although it's as much about find all the wierd and wonderful stations out there as it is listening to the music at the moment.

Cebby, I'd be interested to know if you think that playing the Uniti through a dedicated amp is going to improve the sound, or whether the argument about shorter signal paths (and not having to think about interconnects - we don't want to go there!) will win in the end.

I do so much like the Uniti that I'm seriously thinking about getting another one for my dedicated listening room and forgetting all the hassle of trying other systems (or maybe a UnitiQute as an alternative source)

D

 

[Anonymous]

cooor.....a clean sheet of paper so to speak...I sort of envy you but don't.

All the advice you have been given is good but there is no sibstitute for a home dem of ideally the whole system ...which often is nigh on impossible.

Comparing one system to another in diffent dealers is nearly a waste of time as there are so many variables and you cannot compare.

My advice....get the dealer to set up the whole system in the shop to your satisfaction and when you are happy get them to do a home dem of the same system. if you are really happy with the sound at the end of the day then the chances are you will continue to be.

If that is impossible then I've heard it said start with the speakers you really like and work backwards. Speakers are about the hardest thing to accommodate in any room re size, finish and sound or whatever and often amplification and source will be determined by what is required i.e pick a very inefficient pair of speakers and there is little point in going the tube route.

If you have an other half this is certainly the route I would choose.....Speakers are a thing you not only will want to listen to for a long period of time but also something you will have to look at and live with.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Maxheadroom,

Yeah I thought it woud be great to start from scratch, now I get into it I'm not so sure.

The dealer I'm talking to about the Naim gear (Tomtom Audio) is pretty cool about home demos, unfortunately, my home isn't finished yet, and I am tempted to try and get my order in before the Naim prices go up at end of March (assuming that's what I end up going for).

I think I agree with you about the speakers, since they are the interface with the room. (See my other thread about the room I'm building). Fortunately I don't have to worry about the woman, since this is my room and she doesn't get to have an opinion about it, but all the same I still want them to look good as well as sound brilliant.

D

 

[Anonymous]

Just one question.

Why don't you just do what you did when you purchased you Uniti? I'm assuming you auditioned the Uniti before you bought it? Surely replicating what you did then would be the best way to see if the new system will be worthwhile?

P.s. You'll be in safe hands with TomTom. I know James won't try and sell you anything you dont want or need.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Rich O,

Thing is with the Uniti, there isn't anything that competes with it. So once I had decided that I wanted the functionality all in one box, then it was just a matter of listening to it to make sure I liked it. I didn't compare it with anything else, because there's nothing to compare it with. Admittedly, a bit of a punt, but with the Naim name (forgive the pun) and the reviews, I thought it was a small risk.

D

 

[Minigill]

I recently went down the Naim route, starting with the 5i and CD to match, then XS, then 152/155, and a cap.

I didn't want to listen to anything above this ! The biggest step was 5i to XS, tried the XS with the 5i CD player, then the CD5XS, massive step. The XS amp on its on was a big step. The steps above this were not quite so obvious, but different.

Do check what cables they are using so you know up front. I was told there were powerlines and hi-line, but price not mentioned, so having gone through all the various set ups to be told at the end of the demo, oh buy the way, your were listening through £1.5K of extras. So I had to start again, with and without the extras.

I did like the hi-line however ! But decided to put the money in the source and add that later.

 

[chebby]

jaxwired:Hmmm....well I can see your point. Good to know if a rubbish CD is made palatable by a system. But if a CD is rubbish, a good system should reveal that as rubbish. I would think in general that a well produced CD that is clean and clear would be the best way to assess the quality of electronics. If a CD contains distortion, compression, and poor production, then it seems like it would be difficult to utilize it to hear the subtle differences in amplifer performance. No?

I am not a snob about recordings or genres. I only have two 'audiophile' CDs in my entire collection.

Some of my most enjoyed music is on cheap compilation discs. It is the music I am bothered about and not the 'hifi effect'. I also play a lot of downloaded tracks from iTunes at 256k and enjoy internet radio which is often 128k (or less) depending on the 'station'. I also love FM radio and playing stuff I have missed via BBC iPlayer (or BBC R7 from Freeview via the DAC).

Of course I can hear there is a 'quality' difference between something like my MFSL 'Gold' CD remaster of Roy Orbison and some cheesey old compilation of 1970s pop, but I can play music according to my mood and not because of it's 'hifi credentials' without my system throwing the poorer recordings in my face and making me suffer for daring to 'insult' the system with tat!

It does not smooth over the results with lots of cloying 'warmth'. Instead it seems to home in on the musical elements that have survived the recording process and make the most of them without either 'airbrushing' them to death or making me react like someone has scraped their nails down a blackboard!

Some old 1960s/1970s Reggae and Ska material is pretty 'rough' (being charitable) but I don't want a system that is going to stop me enjoying it anyway.

 

[Anonymous]

my advice is take music that you know really well and stuff that you have listenened to over and over again .... if any of those are 'audiophile quality' that is a bonus

it will be very difficult to compare systems if you don't know the music that you are testing with

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Dim_span

My thoughts exactly. I don't even know if the CDs I'm planning to take count as high quality or not. They are just some of my favourites, that I play regularly and know how they sound on different systems - on my Uniti, on my Audiolab kit, on my iPod and grado phones, in the car etc.

 

[Anonymous]

madridpunch:

Hi Dim_span

My thoughts exactly. I don't even know if the CDs I'm planning to take count as high quality or not. They are just some of my favourites, that I play regularly and know how they sound on different systems - on my Uniti, on my Audiolab kit, on my iPod and grado phones, in the car etc.

that's what counts at the end of the day .... take your favourite music with you ... the music you really enjoy .... if it sounds good on the system that you are auditioning, that's the system for you .... dont take cd's that you are not familiar with... take your time and if you are not sure 1st time round, book another audition

 

[amarocknrollstar]

Neil Young 'Harvest' does it for me - great album but terrible production. If you can catch 'Man Needs a Maid' in good quality then you've won a watch!

 

[Anonymous]

amarocknrollstar:Neil Young 'Harvest' does it for me - great album but terrible production. If you can catch 'Man Needs a Maid' in good quality then you've won a watch!

I'm always 'skint', so just buy 'blind' off ebay and 'hope for the best' ... then faff around with cables and interconnects

..

 

[amarocknrollstar]

Lol - that's another great way to do it!
Much more fun! 🙂