Has anyone seen an LED LCD TV?

[MRB]

Hi.

Just wondered if anyone has seen an LCD television with LED backlighting?

Are they any better than conventional LCD TV's?

 

[Anonymous]

AFAIK, the only LED backlit TV out at the moment is the 70" whopper from Sony for around £25k which isn't stocked anywhere I visit. The new X series are supposed to be LED backlit and out this October according to the rumours, I'm guessing there will be 40", 46" and 52" versions available. I have seen the 11" Sony OLED TV in action, I was in San Francisco last Feb/March time and they had one in the Sony Centre. I got the sales guy to show me it running TV rather than the CG movie that was being used and it was very impressive. It was using a wire aeriel, indoors and the picture (HD) was pefect. On such a small screen it's hard to spot faults so I'm reserving judgement until its bigger brothers come out but on first impressions it did look very crisp and detailed with excellent colours. Still, at $2.5k I would hope so.

 

[Anonymous]

Livers:AFAIK, the only LED backlit TV out at the moment is the 70" whopper from Sony for around £25k

Correction, Samsung's LE52F96BD is LED backlit for around £2K.ÿThe Samsung can achieve better black level than any KURO, but there are drawbacks...

"...because there are over 2 million pixels on the panel of Samsung LE52F96BD and only 96 dimming zones, black level fluctuation inevitably occurs: how low the blacks go will depend on the coverage and intensity of the brighter contents on screen. In addition to this, the brighter elements overlaying a black background would suffer from circumferential flaring (lighter halos around objects bleeding into the black background; worse on off-axis viewing), effectively reducing ANSI contrast. Even then, at its worst (e.g. 99% of the screen is white with 1% being black) the lowest measured black level would still equal that of a Samsung M86/ 87, which is of course by its own right excellent."ÿ

 

[Clare Newsome]

It so can NOT get a black level better than a Pioneer Kuro - we should know, as we tested them side-by-side!

Review of the Samsung LE52P96BD here...

To be fair, though, it does better than many LCDs. Sony's recent W4000 range do extremely well (by LCD standards) for black-reproduction, too.

 

[D.J.KRIME]

Oh that is sooo funny!!! A LCD with far better Black levels than a KURO Plasma!

Next thing You will be telling us all that Gordon Brown actually knows what He is doing!

 

[Anonymous]

Clare Newsome:
It so can NOT get a black level better than a Pioneer Kuro - we should know, as we tested them side-by-side!

Review of the Samsung LE52P96BD here...

To be fair, though, it does better than many LCDs. Sony's recent W4000 range do extremely well (by LCD standards) for black-reproduction, too.
ÿ

It so can!ÿReview of the Samsung LE52P96BD <a href="http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/Samsung-LE52F96BD/Calibration.php">here</a>...http://whathifi.com/Review/Samsung-LE52F96BD/

What calibration gear do WHF use when doing tests? It's no good merely doing an objective side-by-side test and being reliant upon your eyes. It's very true that when the Samsung is displaying a completely BLACK screen it is BLACKER than a KURO. There's no illumination for goodness sake, the LED illuminaion is all off, Plasma's don't do this. The Samsung is the ONLY TV that can achieve true black 0cd/m2.

So there!

ÿ

 

[John Duncan]

D.J.KRIME:
Oh that is sooo funny!!! A LCD with far better Black levels than a KURO Plasma!

Next thing You will be telling us all that Gordon Brown actually knows what He is doing!

Well he is at least practising what he preaches on food wastage, since he clearly ate all the pies.

 

[professorhat]

GearHunter:It so can!ÿReview of the Samsung LE52P96BD <a href="http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/Samsung-LE52F96BD/Calibration.php">here</a>...http://whathifi.com/Review/Samsung-LE52F96BD/
Out of interest, have you actually seen them both to state that fact so blankly, or just read a review on a website?

 

[Clare Newsome]

We use Spyder and THX Calibration, and the experience of a fully trained ISF technician.

And i've said it before and will say it a million times - tech specs one thing; real-life performance something TOTALLY different: even that review admits that using the LED system causes black-level fluctuation and the introduction of artefacts, however 'impressive' its measurement.

Plus, if you're not comparatively testing, how can you possibly judge how good a set is by the standards of the market?

 

[Anonymous]

Clare Newsome:
We use Spyder and THX Calibration, and the experience of a fully trained ISF technician.

And i've said it before and will say it a million times - tech specs one thing; real-life performance something TOTALLY different: even that review admits that using the LED system causes black-level fluctuation and the introduction of artefacts, however 'impressive' its measurement.

Plus, if you're not comparatively testing, how can you possibly judge how good a set is by the standards of the market?ÿ

I never doubted WHF used proper techniques but there's never any postings of such and as you say, there's no substitute for real-life viewing.ÿ

The comment I made still sands though. When displaying black, the Samsung is blacker than any KURO, yes? The snippet I pasted from that site mentions, circumferential flaring which is why I included that passage as it clearly illustrates the failings of the Samsung display. I expect the only way to deal with this issue would be to have 1:1 LED backlighting, i.e. each pixel has its own illumination, that might see off Plasmas (alhough, that's probably not far off anyway, Pioneer are soon to join the LCD crowd) until OLED technology becomes cheap enough for mere mortals to purchase.ÿ

 

[Clare Newsome]

As you've admitted (in a post I had to delete) that you haven't seen the sets side by side. fully calibrated, and that neither has the reviewer on the site, both of you are guilty of giving bare tech specs more weight than real-life implementation.

 

[Anonymous]

Clare Newsome:
As you've admitted (in a post I had to delete) that you haven't seen the sets side by side. fully calibrated, and that neither has the reviewer on the site, both of you are guilty of giving bare tech specs more weight than real-life implementation.

Edited: please do not discuss moderation - AE

 

[Clare Newsome]

If Andrew had seen it first he'd have banned you - as he may well do for breaking house rules for the third time in one thread.

However, here, at your request, are the acceptable comments:

GearHunter:

Incidentally, no I haven't seen it with my own eyes and to be honest I wouldn't be interested in doing so. As with all things in this arena, the best critic in the world is yourself, nobody can tell you what to buy, if it' not for you, it ain't for you - one man's lager is another man's poison - or something?

ÿ

I've got my mind set on purchasing a Pioneer Plasma panel... ...eventually.ÿ

ÿ

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks, and sorry.

 

[Andrew Everard]

Clare Newsome:
If Andrew had seen it first he'd have banned you - as he may well do for breaking house rules for the third time in one thread.

Not yet, but consider yourself yellow-carded, GH.

(I've never thought of myself as Jet Li to Clare's Bob Hoskins before...

)

 

[Anonymous]

Andrew Everard:
Not yet, but consider yourself yellow-carded, GH.ÿ

Just familiarised myself with the House Rules. Rule 11 seems particularly relevant to my good self. Received and understood. Now, I must get back to the tweakers forum to see if they can sort out these lovely buttons that I can't get to work in Safari...

ÿ

 

[MRB]

Guess I'll have to wait until more LED LCD TV's appear on the market.

Can't wait to see the Samsung 7 series:

http://whathifi.com/News/Samsung-to-expand-Crystal-Design-TV-range-at-IFA-with-home-networking-models/