Disappointed - Help & Advise Please!

[admin_exported]

Hello,

over the past couple of months l've added an Alpha 9 power amp, to join an Alpha 8 integrated, with a modded Alpha 5 Trichord clock, non oversampling CD as the source; these then feed a pair of Monitor Audio RS1 'speakers.

lnitially, l had the amps in a pre/power set up, as l only had single run QED Silver Anniversary cable. This produced a powerful & wide sound stage, though a little uncontrolled & brash; l put this down to the QED cable & the bright nature of the MA's.

Over the weekend, l hooked up the system in biamp form, with the 9 running the mid/bass & the 8 the upper, using DNM Solid core biwire cable. (interconnects by the way are Gotham GAC-1)

The outcome has been disappointing. Though the sound is much more detailed & controlled, particularly in the mid range, there is a little loss to the bass. The upper end however, though the detail is there too, it's bright to the point of well......tinny!

l thought going from a silver plated cable to pure copper would tone down the MA's. Do people feel it's the 'speakers that are at fault, with the metal drivers? Has going to a biamped system accentuated this? Or is another component at fault?

lf people think it's the MA's, recommendations for a pair of standmounts, new or second hand, would be appreciated.

 

[JoelSim]

I think it's the MAs to be honest. They do seem to be a bit metallic sounding. Try something like AVI Neutrons or ProAc Tablettes. Small but with a great treble.

 

[drummerman]

Could be any number of reasons and I think you've identified the likely culprits. Arcams are not brash and tinny and although I am not familiar with your moded player I used to have a Trichord Genesis and that was certainly on the refined side.

I am not going to enter the cable debate but QED cables are not dull and the Monitor Audios ... well ... .

In addition I also believe that bi-amping, as popular as it is in this particular forum, is far from guaranteed to always improve matters. Many times have I heard systems sounding better non-bi-amped, more coherent, less dissected, less hifi. Other times I've found it made no discernable difference, certainly not compared to the cost involved but thats another issue and I'm to tired to enter into that one tonight.

So, if it was me I'd ditch the speakers to something from Epos or Rega with perhaps a more sympathetic cable from Chord but you'd have to try that when listening to alternative transducers.

 

[Anonymous]

It's the speakers.

 

[Anonymous]

OK, thank you all for your responses to my post.

l have changed interconnects & 'speaker cable (including Chord) to try & accomodate the MA's & as l say, they are still too bright; even for my liking.

l take the point relating to the debate around biamping, though l will reserve judgment in this case 'till there are alternative 'speakers in situ.

As regards alternatives, if l want to remain "biamped" as it were, the AVI Neutrons do not lend themselves to this. l've had a pair of Epos M5's & perhaps didn't give them time to settle & work up to their potential.

As l'm after a small standmounter thats airy & detailed, l'm leaning toward ProAc. lt's a long time since l listened to Tablettes, though l have recently listened to some Reference 8's; which l was impressed with. Any one with any experience of them?

 

[John Duncan]

The reference 8 signature is a thing of wonder. Joel, pipe up any time you like on the merits of the ProAc with Arcams.........

 

[Anonymous]

So John/Joel,

you recon' a pair of ProAc Reference Signature 8's, would go well with a bi amped Arcam sytem?

 

[Anonymous]

The MA RS1s kick out a lot of bass for their size, in fact, they boom from their ports a bit. From my experience of biamping with Arcams (two 8s) some years ago I thought the bass was tighter, better controlled and went deeper. Can that be interpreted as less bass? I think so if the speakers are prone to boom. Give it a month or so of listening and see whether you aclimatise to the sound and then pull off the other amp. I think you'll miss it. Less punch, focus & detail.

Whether Arcam is your type of sound is a different question.

The Proacs ought to be a lot better, they cost nearly three times as much. A good match for Arcam indeed! If it's bass you're after then I'd look at some floorstanders instead, or add a sub.

 

[Thaiman]

Hello,

Your Arcams worth around £350 and your RS1 could fetch about £150 so you have a total of £500 to rescue the system which is do-able (is there such a word in English?)

The Marantz PM-7001 = £280 (hiway hifi)

Q ACOUSTICS 1050 = £200 (Superfi)

I reckon this system wouldn't be harsh up top in fact together they should sound very smooth and details with great dynamics range.

 

[Anonymous]

The issue isn't really the perceived slight lack of bass it may, as you say, simply be different being biamped.

l don't particularly want to go down the route of selling & starting from scratch.

The position is that since going biamp, the bright nature of the RS1's seems to be worse.

Consequently, taking the point that ProAc Sinature 8's are more expensive, will they, with the Arcam's in biamp form, produce something resonable?

 

[John Duncan]

I would expect so, but am still waiting for JoelSim to pipe up - he has a biamped Arcam/ProAc setup so could help you best.

 

[d_a_n1979]

I fully agree that it's the speakers

Having had the same amp set-up and obviously no onto the Alpha 9 series there is definitly no lack of bass with them

I've only heard the RS1's with my mates NAD C352 and even though the soundstage was good, they lacked bass and thats hwy he has them as his rear speakers within his AV system and having the RS8's as the fronts.

 

[Anonymous]

Anyone else with an opinion on this?

JoelSim, you have an Arcam/ProAc Sig' 8 combo, any response?

 

[drummerman]

[quote user="chesterfieldhouse"]

Anyone else with an opinion on this?

JoelSim, you have an Arcam/ProAc Sig' 8 combo, any response?

[/quote]

Sorry to jump in here but yes, ProAcs (especially Studios) match ok with certain Arcam components although at a price. Still stand by my original suggestion of Epos/Rega, both of which add some life and drive to your existing set up without compromising refinement. Let us know how you get on mate.

 

[Anonymous]

Drummerman,

thanks for your opinion & contribution, again.

l hear what your saying, as l stated in an earlier post, l used to own a pair of Epos M5's, set up with other electronics & perhaps didn't give them time. As for Rega, l really at this time need to go for a standmounter.

Still very tempted by the signature 8's, very natural, airy, with great seperation.

 

[Anonymous]

lf it was down to purely the sound, the ProAc 8's would be a strong candidate however, they are not magnetically sheilded. As many of you may experience, how can l put this.....there are other considerations that may influence decisions on placement, size & aeathetic appearance of equipment. The outcome of is that whatever 'speakers l go with must be sheilded & small ish (standmountable) The Epos M5 l have experience with (which are sheilded) looking at the M5i, apart from the external appearance is there any difference to the performance? The spec' looks the same.

What about Sonus Faber Concertino? Anyone with any experience?

 

[Anonymous]

Well l was in Birmingham for work yesterday & took a walk down to Audio Affair. They have a good range of 'speakers & l was interested in the Epos M5i's & Usher S520's.

Unfortunately, couldn't do a straight A-B listening test as they didn't have a pair of the new M5i's in stock, though they did have a pair of ex dem M5 originals.

As l need a pair of small standmounters that are biwire/amp able & magnetically shielded, these two fitted the bill.

Not much between the two, both very good, but l ended up with the Ushers. Had to pay an extra £40 for the shielded model, total £360, but still a lot of 'speaker for the money.

l had heard that they didn't add or take anything away from the electronics, with some (including WHF) describing them as flat tonally.

ln the demo' l found that they where very neutral, revealing, with perhaps a poor mans ProAc signature 8 type performance.

Anyway they didn't have the finish l wanted, so they arrive next week, hope I've made the right decision!

 

[drummerman]

Very decent speakers. I'm sure you'll enjoy them.