Denon CEOL RCD N8 Issues and problems

[Cafnod]

Hi everyone, I am new to the forum so please excuse any faux pas that I may commit.

I am starting off asking for some help.

Until recently we used our ageing Pioneer Refernce seperates, CD player, Dragonslayer cassette deck and ancient Wharfdale Kingsdale III's plus a Roberts streaming digital radio to listen to music from the internet and from music files on a laptop.

Toward the end of January we bought the above network receiver amp from our local BADA dealer together with a pair of Monitor Audio BX speakers, with plans to add a MA subwoofer later on together with a NAS drive for streaming. The main reasons for the above change was because of house downsiziing and as we travel lots having ripped many of our CD's we now take an IPOD classic 160gb with us which we use in our boat and camper.

However we have had nothing but problems with the Denon. We contacted our dealer on several occassions and they advised resets, which I carried out and then kindly sent someone out saying they believed it to be a network issue. The chap put a fixed IP address on the Denon and it worked fine for a few days, then its problems started again, these are;

1. Stops playing IPOD, either in dock or via USB, I have bought new (genuine Apple) cable, IPOD plays for a day or so then displays (halfway through an album: List empty, then displays No connection. This happens whether or not the Network control is set to on or off. If network control is on sometimes I get the message: Loading, it never loads and I have to switch the network control to off and restart the Denon for it to see the IPOD.

2 If using Apple airplay from a laptop sometimes the Airplay icon is not in ITUNES and sometimes it is, a combination of restarting ITUNES and switching the Denon off and on again may find it. Sometimes Airplay just stops part way through an album, ITUNES displays: CEOL not found. However the CEOL will play all other sources without a problem. I cannot get Airplay icon at all when network control is set to on.

To anticipate a few questions the Denon is connected to the router by cable. The router is a new Orange Bright Box. The laptop is connecting to the router wirelessly. All the laptops have been given a fixed IP address. The Roberts is having none of the problems the CEOL has. I have been to my local IT specialist who I have used for @14 years and he says he doubts it is a network issue.

Please excuse the fact that although I use computers a lot I am not very IT literate. I must also apologise for the length of this post and would like to thank anyone who is still reading for taking the time and trouble to do so, all help gratefully received.

 

[SomersetGuy]

Welcome to the forum. Sorry to hear about your problems. When I bought my Denon dnp720-ae network streamer a couple of years back, I had a few teething problems, all of which I fed back to Denon's very helpful technical support, and some of which they addressed in future firmware updates(!). I had frequent and lengthy conversations with one of their support team, Johnny, and their number is 02890 279830 (based in Belfast). Give them a call and (if possible) ask to speak to Johnny — he's very personable and helpful.

The Denon dnp720-ae unit I have works very well and reliably, but it is still lacking gapless playback. I had hoped they (Denon) would have incorporated this in a future update, but no, they decided to concentrate on future hardware such as the Ceol and Piccolo — thanks, Denon, for rewarding my loyalty!

Anyway, my main point is: don't despair. If the aforementioned tech support can't rectify the problem, you are robustly protected by British consumer laws, viz. The Sale of Goods Act 1979, and you have every right to return the unit for a full refund/exchange. The Act states:

All goods must be:

as described

of satisfactory quality

and
fit for purpose.

If they're not, the retailer is in breach of contract, and you have a claim under the Sale of Goods Act.

I have bought several streamers over the years: Squeezebox Touch (great interface and sound, lousy reliability — sent back two units for a full refund; Denon dnp720-ae — reliable performance, lacks gapless playback, sound fast becoming outperformed by other makes and models, kept in the office; Cambridge Audio Stream Magic 6 — rich, detailed sound, app issues now appear to be rectified by recent update, expensive but satisfying performance, pride of place in lounge). Manufacturers need to sit up and take notice of the various issues that some of their customers have experienced, and it's particularly galling when a hardware unit such as this is let down by software and/or hardware glitches. It should not have to be down to the consumer to have to report bugs to the manufacturer(!).

Hope that helps.

All the best

Paul

 

[Cafnod]

Hi Paul

Thank you for the helpful reply.

I will phone Denon customer support tomorrow.

I have also had issues with the CEOL locking up my IPOD, something that never happens in my car which has a UDB ipod socket on it nor on my IPOD dock which has an internal D/A converter, just like the CEOL.

Tonight having switched it on it told me there was a firmware upgrade available. I clicked to accept it and it has been displaying:

[updating] 1/2

19 min 00%

System

For the last hour. Perhaps it has died completely. Thank goodness for the sale of goods act...............

Richard

 

[SomersetGuy]

Hi Richard

Yes, it sounds like something is definitely not right with the system and needs sorting out. At the very least, I would expect Denon / the retailer to send you a replacement.

Good luck with everything.

Paul

 

[Cafnod]

Hi all

Well it went back to the retailer today and was replaced.

As soon as it was switched on it downloaded and installed two updates to the firmware.

This seems to have down two things,

Firstly the internet radio source now gives scroll menus for listen again broadcasrs on BBC stations.

Secondly the whole control interface is less 'clunky' the long play gaps when using the play to CEOL from My Music or WMP have gone, the machine seems to react in a much faster and more stable way.

Airplay worked for one album and then the Airplay option icon in Itunes vanished. I am assuming that the network is unable to find an Airplay compatible device but why it cannot find that yet finds the CEOL as a music server I cannot understand.

I will see how the new unit performs over the next few days.

Richard

 

[Kratos]

I had the same issues too. My CEOLn8 linked to network wirelessly, streaming Internet radio no hassles but no airplay on iphone4, ipad3. Also the denon remote app would not recognize the Ceol on iOS and Android Galaxy S2. rang Denon who confirmed there was a problem with the Denon AirPlay working with Netgear N series and Thomson routers. Both Netgear and apple blame each other so as consumers we are left in the middle with no upgrade from either side pending as neither thinks it's their problem. One day my router failed so I powered off and restarted the router and voila! It all works now. So far it works finally as intended and very happy with purchase.

 

[Richardjps]

Have just read comments re airplay connection. Today exchanged my rcdn8 for a new one as old one kept losing both Internet radio signal and had only very intermittent air play connectivity. Customer help desk of supplier had indicated that this problem was a known fault. Set up new rcdn8 and have found exactly the same problems, even after downloading firmware updates. This machine will be returned as it is no better than the original one...sale of goods act 1979 states that goods have to be of satisfactory quality, I.e. do what the manufacturer says it will do. This Denon does not do that. Any suggestions for a replacement wwhich plays CDs, has Internet radio and has airplay connectivity for latest ipad?

 

[gtm]

Hi All,

Well experience exaclty the same issue with Airplay not apperaing anymore on my laptop neither phone while it was perfectly working for 3 to 4 weeks without any issue. Cannot get it back. All other network functions are working (music server, internet radio, firmware update checking).

Really disapointed by this Denon product as it seems really unstable over time. It is a pity as at first glance it is really great. By the way supplying an android app for tablets was such a great idea... but still the quality of it is really poor and make it unusable. Still if anyone knows if there is a way to make a full factory reset of the device and if it helps regarding Airplay issue. Thanks,

GTM

 

[gtm]

Hi again,

At least one solution for me, I am in France and using a Free router at home on WIFI. Well I had to reboot the main router and everything get back online. I guess after some times the broadcast of the router on WIFI is bugged. I do not know if it is working better when connected through a cable.

GTM

 

[Richardjps]

Denon have to get this non-working/erratic air play fixed! I have connected my Denon both wirelessly and wired and it makes no difference to the fault.

 

[luisnobregaster]

Hi All,

I am planning to buy a Denon CEOL RCD n8 but after seeing all these problems I am about to give up...

Yesterday I logged into Denon Suport site to check the lastest firmware to see if the airpair/connectivity problem has been resolved but they asked me for the serial number which obviously I dont have...

So I just wanted to ask you guys that have this eqiupment if the problem persists or if Denon has solved the airplay connectivity issue...

Thanks for your help,

Best Regards

Luis

 

[MarantzLover]

Sounds like your routers just purely don't support IP multicast. If this is not supported then the symptoms you are describing would be replicated.

If they did then y'all wouldn't having ANY airplay problems. Theres no problem using Netgear N routers - just free ones that have had the good firmware ripped out of them, and customised for internet service providers. My n600 netgear has run airplay now for nearly 3 years faultlessly, and I have 4 seperate airplay zones in my home here, B&W, Apple TV, denon and marantz.

BTW Apple TV operates IP unicast - NOT multicast, so if your Apple TV or Airport express operate sucessfully - this does NOT mean that the router should play well with aftermarket Apple Airplay licences Devices from other non-apple manufacturers.

i.e routers that WILL NOT work:

BT home hubs, (all series),

Orange Brightbox (all series),

Thomson Gateway TG585,TG787,

Huawei HG533, HG520s, HG523, HG523a, MT882 (provided by AOL or TALKTALK)

Virgin Superhub on certain firmwares,

Upgrade your routers guys - the router is the hub of everything - if you have a bike chain with and it snaps on a journey then you look for the weak link in the chain and replace it - same thing with networks - get a realistically specified n grade dual band router and you'll have no issues. A network built apon a sandy foundation will sink and fail

 

[MarantzLover]

Interestingly, there were NEVER any Airplay issues on this forum related to ANY manufacturer that could be attributed to anything less than an inadequately specified router.

 

[Kratos]

Thanks for the detailed information about the routers and AirPlay, MarantzUser.It would certainly explain my problem as my router did come as a 'freebie' from my ISP. I had no idea the ISP routers were different internally from retail versions.

 

[MarantzLover]

he he he...

No worries - having setup now another 5th Airplay zone in my home, there's very little that I don't at this point know or have not experienced with Airplay.It's all down to the router.

When at all possible, always use good quality cat5/5e/6/7 grade network cable to connect your playback devices to your router, particularly if you have more than one zone in your home. Try and avoid wireless bridges, or wireless if you can. Ethernet over mains is reasonable, and certainly better than wireless.

The media and most users don't know what to make of networking. If a product doesn't have wireless but has only cat 5 they slate it. If it has only wireless and no cat 5 - they slate it LOL.

Yep - no such thing as a free lunch. Free Router = free lunch - i.e. theres a reason why they are free.

 

[MarantzLover]

he he he...

No worries - having setup now another 5th Airplay zone in my home, there's very little that I don't at this point know or have not experienced with Airplay.It's all down to the router.

When at all possible, always use good quality cat5/5e/6/7 grade network cable to connect your playback devices to your router, particularly if you have more than one zone in your home. Try and avoid wireless bridges, or wireless if you can. Ethernet over mains is reasonable, and certainly better than wireless.

The media and most users don't know what to make of networking. If a product doesn't have wireless but has only cat 5 they slate it. If it has only wireless and no cat 5 - they slate it LOL.

Yep - no such thing as a free lunch. Free Router = free lunch - i.e. theres a reason why they are free.

 

[Kratos]

Further to my post regarding wireless connection from Denon CEOL and router, turns out it was not a problem with the router afterall. The CEOL was setup to only receive security signal at WEP strength otherwise it kept dropping out. The router was set at WPA2K+ . Since there was a firmware upgrade on the denon, it can now continuously stream without interruption yet the security level on the router is still set at wpa2k + . Hope this helps anyone with wireless issues with the CEOL.

 

[Croftsway]

I bought an N7 Ceol in November 2010. It failed three times (iPod dock not functioning, then, finally, it died completely, not switching on).

Denon replaced it with an N8 (with my retaining the original speakers) in late 2012. The iPod dock was faulty again within three weeks. The N8 has just perished also - won't switch on.

In fairness to Denon, they are repairing it without expense, even though it was purchased more than three years ago.

However, I have NO optimism that this repair will any longer-lasting than the first three.

I can't imagine what they're doing making such faulty equipment. I'm just so pleased I didn't buy any of their, "high-end", AV stuff.

 

[gentong]

Just updated online my Denon RCD-N8 with the latest firmware as of version 2.59, but now the treble become so bad.. the audio quality is also very poor.. i have no idea how to downgrade the firmware to previous one.. Guys, give me a solution please..

 

[nanadeloupa]

Bonjour, J'ai récupéré ma chaîne Hifi Denon ceol n8 la semaine dernière et j'avais signalé un problème notamment concernant la connexion via Wifi et Airplay. Vos techniciens m'ont dit qu'ils avaient changé la carte Wifi. Cependant le problème subsiste. J'ai réussi à faire fonctionner l'airplay quand je l'ai récupéré mais une fois éteinte et rallumée, voici que ça ne fonctionne plus. J'ai pour messages : Digital In "Signal Unlock" ou "No network connection" ou "(Empty)" ou "P.Accès non trouvé". (cf photos ci-jointes) Pourriez-vous m'expliquer d'où vient le problème s'il vous plait ? J'ai vraiment envie de pouvoir utiliser ma chaîne hifi sans soucis...

 

[JonPratt]

It really is all about the router/modem.

I had airplay disappearance and non recognition of Denon ios app using standard BT router/modem

Substituting a TP-Link N600 router modem solved all problems instantly and made a visible difference in internet and downloading speeds as well.

I wonder what the big ISPs are doing. Most would assume that the supplied modems/routers are state of the art but this may not be the case and the customisation of other manufacturers standard products are causing these sort of problems. Manufacturers like Denon then cop the blame!

Perhaps What Hifi should investigate this!