Alec
Well-known member
Didnt mean any offence to anyone and didnt mean you specifically - ive not really been paying attention to who posted what. but i thought it could confuse so something needed to be said
Alec
Well-known member
oh, and i assumed the 3.5 thing was pretty commonplace, but thats just because it all came pretty easily for me, as i had one. apologies if im wrong.
professorhat
Well-known member
No offence at all - you're absolutely right, it's important it's clear.
So, basically there are a few options to get home cinema sound and music from the multimedia PC. For home cinema purposes, the best thing to do is to get a soundcard in the PC which has HDMI out. This should allow you to then output the HD audio formats digitally to an AV receiver where they can be decoded (assuming the software will do this, but that's another story!).
For music, you have a few options. Depending on which AV receiver you have will depend on the quality of the DAC built into it. If it's a decent one, you can stick with the HDMI connection and feed your music digitally through to the AV receiver, which will then perform the digital to analogue conversion and then send the music to the speakers. However, you may also have a decent DAC built into the soundcard so you could instead run another cable from the soundcard from one of the analogue outputs (such as the 3.5mm output or the RCA phono output if it has one) into the AV receiver. In this case, the digital to analogue conversion is being done within the soundcard. In this instance, you would therefore need to change a setting within the software to tell it, when you're watching movies, send sound out the HDMI and when you're listening to music, send sound out the 3.5mm output etc.
You could also try an external DAC instead (these range in price from hundreds to tens of thousands of pounds). Here, you would output the signal digitally (usually via digital optical or coaxial, but also perhaps from USB) into the external DAC. This will then perform the digital to analogue conversion and is then connected into the AV receiver via an analogue connection (usually standard phono connections). Again, a change in setting between movie watching and music listening would be required.
However, as discussed, AV receivers aren't renowned for their musical ability. The more you pay, generally, the better the musicality of the amp, but this will depend on a lot of factors. As a general rule, an AV receiver is considered to be roughly the equivalent of a stereo amp a third of the price in terms of musicality. So, instead of an AV receiver, you could opt to connect the PC to a stereo amp (though obviously you won't get the ability to play 5.1 for movie soundtracks, only stereo). Since most stereo amps don't have a built in DAC, we will assume this here. In this case therefore, you can either hook the PC directly to the stereo amp using an analogue connection (which will thus use the DAC built into the soundcard) or you could connect into an external DAC via one of the digital connections in an attempt to improve the sound.
Finally, there is another option which links the two, whereby you have both an AV receiver which includes front pre-outs, and a stereo amp and this should give you the best of both worlds i.e. the benefit of using a stereo amp for music, whilst also getting 5.1 sound through the AV receiver for movies. To be honest, I'm going to leave it here as I don't want this post to get too complicated, but if you're interested, let us know and we can go through this as well.
Hopefully this has cleared up any misunderstandings - basically, there's no right or wrong in any of the above setups as all the components being used determine how it will sound and therefore which is the right way to hook it up. It's only when you know what those components are that you can start looking at it and saying whether one thing will obviously improve the setup, or whether some testing / auditioning is required to see which connection is preferred.
So, basically there are a few options to get home cinema sound and music from the multimedia PC. For home cinema purposes, the best thing to do is to get a soundcard in the PC which has HDMI out. This should allow you to then output the HD audio formats digitally to an AV receiver where they can be decoded (assuming the software will do this, but that's another story!).
For music, you have a few options. Depending on which AV receiver you have will depend on the quality of the DAC built into it. If it's a decent one, you can stick with the HDMI connection and feed your music digitally through to the AV receiver, which will then perform the digital to analogue conversion and then send the music to the speakers. However, you may also have a decent DAC built into the soundcard so you could instead run another cable from the soundcard from one of the analogue outputs (such as the 3.5mm output or the RCA phono output if it has one) into the AV receiver. In this case, the digital to analogue conversion is being done within the soundcard. In this instance, you would therefore need to change a setting within the software to tell it, when you're watching movies, send sound out the HDMI and when you're listening to music, send sound out the 3.5mm output etc.
You could also try an external DAC instead (these range in price from hundreds to tens of thousands of pounds). Here, you would output the signal digitally (usually via digital optical or coaxial, but also perhaps from USB) into the external DAC. This will then perform the digital to analogue conversion and is then connected into the AV receiver via an analogue connection (usually standard phono connections). Again, a change in setting between movie watching and music listening would be required.
However, as discussed, AV receivers aren't renowned for their musical ability. The more you pay, generally, the better the musicality of the amp, but this will depend on a lot of factors. As a general rule, an AV receiver is considered to be roughly the equivalent of a stereo amp a third of the price in terms of musicality. So, instead of an AV receiver, you could opt to connect the PC to a stereo amp (though obviously you won't get the ability to play 5.1 for movie soundtracks, only stereo). Since most stereo amps don't have a built in DAC, we will assume this here. In this case therefore, you can either hook the PC directly to the stereo amp using an analogue connection (which will thus use the DAC built into the soundcard) or you could connect into an external DAC via one of the digital connections in an attempt to improve the sound.
Finally, there is another option which links the two, whereby you have both an AV receiver which includes front pre-outs, and a stereo amp and this should give you the best of both worlds i.e. the benefit of using a stereo amp for music, whilst also getting 5.1 sound through the AV receiver for movies. To be honest, I'm going to leave it here as I don't want this post to get too complicated, but if you're interested, let us know and we can go through this as well.
Hopefully this has cleared up any misunderstandings - basically, there's no right or wrong in any of the above setups as all the components being used determine how it will sound and therefore which is the right way to hook it up. It's only when you know what those components are that you can start looking at it and saying whether one thing will obviously improve the setup, or whether some testing / auditioning is required to see which connection is preferred.
professorhat:
Some DACs also have a USB input so you can go straight from the PC via USB which bypasses the soundcard. Not 100% on what the benefits are there - in theory I can see why this might be better than optical (since there is no requirement for conversion to light for the optical route). Maybe someone else can provide a bit more detail on that.
I can't provide any in depth technical detail but do have a few thoughts on the subject.
The transfer from digital to optical is pretty common place, particularly in IT, so wouldn't have expected the conversion to cause any problems. I think it's fair to say that optical is less suseptable to interferance and has a greater bandwidth. So, certainly for longer runs, I would have thought that optical had definate benefits over electrical digital.
Some DACs also have a USB input so you can go straight from the PC via USB which bypasses the soundcard. Not 100% on what the benefits are there - in theory I can see why this might be better than optical (since there is no requirement for conversion to light for the optical route). Maybe someone else can provide a bit more detail on that.
I can't provide any in depth technical detail but do have a few thoughts on the subject.
The transfer from digital to optical is pretty common place, particularly in IT, so wouldn't have expected the conversion to cause any problems. I think it's fair to say that optical is less suseptable to interferance and has a greater bandwidth. So, certainly for longer runs, I would have thought that optical had definate benefits over electrical digital.
Excellent post professorhat
It's not so complex really when it boils down to it. Maybe for the time being I'll just go for the AV amp and then I'll buy a DAC and stereo amp if I think I need it. Although, now that I think about it, if I had a stereo amp and an AV amp then wouldn't I have to change the speaker cables each time I wanted to switch from music to movies and vice versa?
professorhat
Well-known member
Nope - that's the bit I left out for fear of over information syndrome
The key thing if you want to add a stereo amp to an AV receiver at a later date to improve music performance is the AV receiver must have front pre-outs. These days, it tends to be only budget receivers which don't have them, but it's worth checking before you buy.
What happens is, the front speakers are attached to the stereo amp and any music sources are also connected into the stereo amp. If you're listening to a music source, you therefore only switch on the stereo amp and that's all you need. In the meantime, the centre, sub and rear speakers are all connected to the AV receiver, as are any movie sources. The stereo amp is connected to the AV receiver into the front pre-out sockets - this is usually done either by a specific input on the amp (if it has one), or through one of the tape loops (standard RCA phono leads connect them up).
Without going into too much detail, when you play a movie source, both the AV receiver and the stereo amp are switched on, and the AV receiver sends the correct signals for the front speakers via the stereo amp, plus the other signals through the standard connections to the other speakers, so you still get the 5.1 sound, but without having to rewire everything.
There's various things you have to do to set it all up, like setting up the speaker levels on the AV receiver with the stereo amp set at a memorable volume (most people use the 12 o' clock position on the stereo amp volume) so that when you switch from playing music to playing movies, you can easily set the stereo amp volume to this level and get the correct volume levels for the fronts for movies. Some stereo amps have a mode which means it will ignore the volume level on the stereo amp and just accept the signal from the AV receiver - again it all depends on what components you have.
The key thing if you want to add a stereo amp to an AV receiver at a later date to improve music performance is the AV receiver must have front pre-outs. These days, it tends to be only budget receivers which don't have them, but it's worth checking before you buy.
What happens is, the front speakers are attached to the stereo amp and any music sources are also connected into the stereo amp. If you're listening to a music source, you therefore only switch on the stereo amp and that's all you need. In the meantime, the centre, sub and rear speakers are all connected to the AV receiver, as are any movie sources. The stereo amp is connected to the AV receiver into the front pre-out sockets - this is usually done either by a specific input on the amp (if it has one), or through one of the tape loops (standard RCA phono leads connect them up).
Without going into too much detail, when you play a movie source, both the AV receiver and the stereo amp are switched on, and the AV receiver sends the correct signals for the front speakers via the stereo amp, plus the other signals through the standard connections to the other speakers, so you still get the 5.1 sound, but without having to rewire everything.
There's various things you have to do to set it all up, like setting up the speaker levels on the AV receiver with the stereo amp set at a memorable volume (most people use the 12 o' clock position on the stereo amp volume) so that when you switch from playing music to playing movies, you can easily set the stereo amp volume to this level and get the correct volume levels for the fronts for movies. Some stereo amps have a mode which means it will ignore the volume level on the stereo amp and just accept the signal from the AV receiver - again it all depends on what components you have.
Get an AV amp with pre-outs. The stereo amp then drives the left and right speakers, the AV amp the centre and surrounds.
EDIT: Sorry, I see the Prof has sorted you already!
EDIT: Sorry, I see the Prof has sorted you already!
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