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Cryogenic treated, silver, braided interconnects

insider9

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Sep 20, 2016
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A mate of mine bought a pair of interconnects. They're directional cryo treated silver and braided to minimise RFI. I've had a quick listen and must say they sounded excellent.

Question is which of the technologies used is mostly responsible for that? Does cryo treatment contribute to sound quality? Is it the use of silver and not copper? Is it the litzendraht braiding?

Let's leave bias aside as I'm usually biased that there won't be a big/no improvement. Also let's assume they cost as much as anything else. Is there any basis that any of it makes an audible difference?

That's the second time he came up with something I would dismiss and I think got it right. Last time it was USB Regen by Uptone.
 

andyjm

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Jul 20, 2012
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insider9 said:
A mate of mine bought a pair of interconnects. They're directional cryo treated silver and braided to minimise RFI. I've had a quick listen and must say they sounded excellent.

Question is which of the technologies used is mostly responsible for that? Does cryo treatment contribute to sound quality? Is it the use of silver and not copper? Is it the litzendraht braiding?

Let's leave bias aside as I'm usually biased that there won't be a big/no improvement. Also let's assume they cost as much as anything else. Is there any basis that any of it makes an audible difference?

That's the second time he came up with something I would dismiss and I think got it right. Last time it was USB Regen by Uptone.
Litz wire has no appreciable effect at audio baseband frequencies. Cryo treating is nonsense, directional cryo treating is directional nonsense. Sliver is a better conductor than copper by volume, aluminium is a better conductor than copper by weight - unless you are constrained by volume or weight, just use lightly more copper for exactly the same effect.

Nothing you have listed should make the slightest difference, assuming the original conductors were of decent quality.
 

insider9

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He explained to me the directional thing... it's apparently to do with RFI and any other interference not being passed on to the amp.

It was a couple of quick ABs but I felt there was a difference. I approached this with my usual... here we go again. But this time I though I could hear it. Will need to get this for proper testing measurements included.
 
Q

QuestForThe13thNote

Guest
Hi insider, what actual cables are they. I wouldn’t give up my chord signature tuned array Xlr interconnects or chord epic reference speaker wire I don’t think.
 

Vladimir

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Years ago i did a brochure for a US manufacturer of cryo treated cables and other accessories. From memory i know they claimed something about metal crystals being better aligned and they measured marginally better in the resistance.
 

insider9

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Vladimir said:
Years ago i did a brochure for a US manufacturer of cryo treated cables and other accessories. From memory i know they claimed something about metal crystals being better aligned and they measured marginally better in the resistance.
Yes, this is what I read. I though they sounded great, both quick AB in his system and then in mince.
 

insider9

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QuestForThe13thNote said:
Hi insider, what actual cables are they. I wouldn’t give up my chord signature tuned array Xlr interconnects or chord epic reference speaker wire I don’t think. 
I'd rather not influence this by talking about brands and cost.
 

Gray

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How long before we get superconducting speaker cables (within hoses of liquid Nitrogen) There would be customers whatever the cost.

Just imagine, conductors with no resistance (that still need to be on oak cable lifters for optimum performance)
 

andyjm

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Jul 20, 2012
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Vladimir said:
Years ago i did a brochure for a US manufacturer of cryo treated cables and other accessories. From memory i know they claimed something about metal crystals being better aligned and they measured marginally better in the resistance.
There are a number of claims made for the cryo treatment of materials - often as part of a tempering / cryo process. This can effect the properties of the materials, and there are certainly studies that suggest copper spot welding electrodes perform better if treated in this way.

But why bother? If you want a lower resistance cable, just make it thicker. This is why I have an issue with this nonsense. Double the cross sectional area of the conductor (which will cost pennies for a normal length interconnect) and halve the resistance if it really matters to you - for audio cables all this cryo hoopla is just marketing.
 

nopiano

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Feb 15, 2009
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This is always interesting to me.

However, over the years I’ve realised that I cannot listen to cables like I listen to music. When I jump up and down every two minutes, or after one track, things never sound the same. When I relax and listen at length, that’s how to listen properly!
 

ellisdj

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Gray said:
How long before we get superconducting speaker cables (within hoses of liquid Nitrogen) There would be customers whatever the cost.

Just imagine, conductors with no resistance (that still need to be on oak cable lifters for optimum performance)
There are companies using Graphene which is a superonductor - get with the time .... ;)
 

Gaz37

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Would chucking your interconnects in the freezer overnight make them cryogenically treated?

Just wondering?
 

insider9

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No Gaz, it's a far more complex process that requires temperatures you're unable to achieve using your freezer.

There is evidence that cryo treatment changes properties of materials. None that I can find that connects these with sound quality.
 

Gaz37

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Sep 23, 2014
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insider9 said:
Gaz37 said:
With CDs lol

Anybody old enough to remember that one?
You kept CD is a freezer? *lol*
Many moons age, not long after CDs became popular, there was a theory that freezing the disc improved sound quality, another one was colouring the edge of the disc with a marker pen (green or black iirc) assisted laser tracking & again improved sound. Loads of people believed it, you could even buy "special" marker pens for it.
Hoaxes are far more elaborate now, audiophile fuses for example lol
 

nopiano

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insider9 said:
Think I might have heard the freezing but marker pen? Hahaha, incredible!
Yes, it was green on the edge of the disc, and was meant to help the laser tracking or something. Less light scatter in the player too. I remember it well. ( I probably still have the pen I bought,nthough never could bring myself to use! )
 

nopiano

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insider9 said:
No Gaz, it's a far more complex process that requires temperatures you're unable to achieve using your freezer.

There is evidence that cryo treatment changes properties of materials. None that I can find that connects these with sound quality.
It seems to be taken as a given in this article. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryogenic_treatment
 

andyjm

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Jul 20, 2012
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insider9 said:
They quote: "better electrical properties including less electrical resistance"
A remarkable advance.

So as I posted earlier, instead of using thicker copper cable, at virtually no cost, the answer is to cryogenically treat the cable and charge a huge markup. Engineering or marketing?

The only study I could find on cryo treatment of copper (which was a combination of tempering at a high temp then a cry soak) was for the electrodes on spot welders. The contact points of the electrodes have to be a limited size to allow for sufficient resistance heating of the metal being welded and therefore increasing the size of electrode was not an option. Even a marginal improvement in current flow was worth having in this case.

When I last checked, there was room down the back of my amp for the interconnects to use 0.2mm copper instead of 0.1mm copper.
 

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