Connecting a laptop to amp advice?

[Sirguy969]

Morning All,

I have had to rearrange my AV gear following a house extension and this has lead me to pondering the possibilities of changing my old set up for i-pod music.

The set up previously was as follows: i-pod to Denon i-pod dock, i=pod dock to Denon AVR4308a, AVR to speakers.

The new location of my home "bar" means that the Denon i-pod dock will no-longer reach and tbh I was never really happy with the functionality of the dock. It was slow to respond to the remote control and very rarely displayed much on the TV screen and really was temperamental at best.

With the new bar I will be hanging a TV screen and I also have my old laptop (which also serves as my i-tunes homebase).

Is it possible to have the laptop linked to the TV screen and also connected to the AVR? I would like to be able to access my i-tunes from behind the bar whilst also displaying on the TV.

If this is possible would this just be a cabling solution? Laptop would be around 8m away from the AVR.

If I'm honest I don't really understand the whole DAC thing but have read enough to rightly or wrongly assume that a DAC greatly improves computer stored music??? Can this be factored in somehow? If so I was looking to upgrade my Blu ray to an OPPO 105, does this help?

Sorry, so many questions. Any help at all will be gratefully recieved.

Cheers Cam.

 

[Sirguy969]

Only just realised that there is a specific page for this sort of IT newbie question....doh! Please would a moderator move this? That way I may get some answers. Thank you.

[Topic Moved to Computer-based Media forum as requested]

 

[John Duncan]

Is your laptop Windows or a MacBook?

 

[Sirguy969]

Hi John, it is windows.

 

[John Duncan]

OK. If it had been a Mac, I would immediately have said an Apple TV, since you can mirror your Mac's screen to it and plug it into the TV. However, that might still work with software such as AirParrot (which is only $9.99), but you'd probably want to get some assurances about its efficacy.

Let me see if I can get some opinions...

 

[Sirguy969]

John, please be gentle with me, complete IT eeijut here! If I was to buy something like a LIV Zen 2Tb Vortexbox Music Server would I be able to transfer my existing i-tunes library to it? I do still like the idea of an actual CD I can feel and touch when I buy music, I just like the ease of use and the ability to create playlists with album art that i-tunes allows.

 

[professorhat]

Is your AVR connected to the TV at all? And could you let us know the Make / Model of the laptop?

 

[Sirguy969]

The AVR is connected to the TV in the lounge, not the bar.

I'm at work at the moment, but leaving for home shortly and I can post the laptop specs then. From memory it is an HP if that helps???

 

[professorhat]

The AVR is connected to the TV in the lounge, not the bar.

I'm at work at the moment, but leaving for home shortly and I can post the laptop specs then. From memory it is an HP if that helps???

Okay - just really looking at the most basic option of just cabling the laptop direct into the TV and AVR. If you can let us know make / model, should help in determining this. Of course, this would mean having to run cables from the laptop to both devices and have no idea how practical this is, but it probably will be the cheapest option. For this to work, you'd also need to still be able to access the laptop's keyboard and mouse to play something in iTunes (unless you have an iPad / iPhone / iPod Touch?).

In terms of DAC, your AVR will have a DAC built into it, and whether you can use this without any extra kit will depend on whether the PC has an optical output or not.

 

[Sirguy969]

Hi, sorry been so long, right it's a Hewlett Packard Intel Pentium dual core, windows vista. HP G7000.

Hope this helps. I think my amp can network, well it has a aerial that screws into the back. Denon 4308a?

Thanks

 

[professorhat]

Okay, from what I can tell from that model, you've got a VGA output and a standard analogue headphone output. To connect the laptop to the TV, it will depend what TV you have - if it has a VGA input, a simple VGA cable can be used to connect it. If it doesn't, you can get VGA to HDMI cables (link), though have to say I've never tried one of these to know what they're like so would suggest getting somewhere you can return if results aren't good.

For the audio, you have two easy options - one is to connect the laptop direct to the AVR via a 3.5mm mini-jack to RCA cable (you can easily get 8m versions of this for not too much money) i.e. from the headphone output to one of the standard red and white inputs on the AVR. This is cheapest and easiest, but, as you may have guessed, will result in probably quite poor sound quality.

The second option would be to buy a USB DAC - with this, you connect your laptop to this DAC with a USB cable, and this then connects to the AVR again via standard RCA cable. There are all sorts of options and prices for these (e.g. this and this). As you can tell, this is a bit more complex, costs a bit more, but should result in better sound quality.

Finally, you could look into JD's suggestion on whether the sound / picture can streamed via an alternative device.

 

[Sirguy969]

I must thank both of you for your detailed replies. After speaking with my son it would appear that perhaps I need to rethink what it is I am actually trying to achieve. So here goes!

Ideally I would like my i-tunes available to be accessed from behind the bar and connected to my AVR which is up to 8m away. I will have a 32inch Panny flat screen behind the bar, a wireless keyboard and mouse (I do have an i-pad also if that could be used to control the system that would be cool too).

To these ends would I not be better served to buy a PC with CD Drive specifically for i-tunes, locate behind the bar, connected to my TV purely to display i-tunes and somehow connected to my AVR for sound duties? I"m assuming that I could use the second monitor HDMI out on my AVR to connect the bar TV and if I buy a PC with HDMI out run a cable directly to one of the HDMI inputs on the AVR?

If the above is possible then my questions would be:

1/ Is this the best solution for sound quality?

2/ I am looking to buy a 3D bluray player anyway, would the DAC on the OPPO 105 and analogue connects serve someway for a better sound?

3/ Is it even possible to somehow use the OPPO for i-tunes duties?

4/ Can this be controlled via an app for my i-pad?

5/ Basically are there better ways to do this?

6/ Instead of running two long lengths of HDMI is there a way to put the PC next to the AVR (8m away) yet still control wirelessly? No direct line of sight.

7/ Do I have any idea whatsoever as to what I'm talking about?

Thanks again for your patience and assistance!

Cheers, Cam.

 

[Sirguy969]

Anyone?

 

[professorhat]

Hi Cam,

Okay, what you've proposed is certainly an option, but I'd like to check a few things first before responding:

1. Is there another reason for purchasing the extra PC other than just for running iTunes i.e. would the old laptop be fine other than the fact it doesn't have an HDMI output? Or were you thinking you want a new PC for other functions as well?

2. Are you thinking you want other sources currently plugged into the AV receiver (e.g. Blu-ray) to be able to display on the TV in the bar as well as the PC / laptop running iTunes?

Ta!

 

[Sirguy969]

Hi Cam,

Okay, what you've proposed is certainly an option, but I'd like to check a few things first before responding:

1. Is there another reason for purchasing the extra PC other than just for running iTunes i.e. would the old laptop be fine other than the fact it doesn't have an HDMI output? Or were you thinking you want a new PC for other functions as well?

2. Are you thinking you want other sources currently plugged into the AV receiver (e.g. Blu-ray) to be able to display on the TV in the bar as well as the PC / laptop running iTunes?

Ta!

Tbh, there is no other reason for the PC other than wanting i-tunes on the TV screen, the laptop is getting a tad old, it takes a while to rip cds, just thought it would be a more sensible solution to build ( someone else build!) a PC specifically for i-tunes, ripping cds and with bigger memory. If a NAS

.?? Would be better then that would be fine.

other sources on the bar tv is not necessary but I wouldn't be averse to it.

thanks Prof, I await your pearls of wisdom!

 

[professorhat]

Okay, here's how I see some of your options (hopefully this won't get too complicated and lengthy!).

Option 1

Use current spare laptop and place near the TV in the bar, using the wireless keyboard and mouse to connect to it.

Connect the laptop to the TV using VGA / VGA-HDMI cable as noted in my response above.

Purchase a USB DAC (as noted in response above) and connect the laptop into this via USB cable, then connect USB DAC to the AVR using standard RCA phono cable (will probably cost around £30 to £60 depending on what DAC and cables you go for).

Advantages - quite cheap solution; requires only one long cable to AVR.

Disadvantages - other AVR sources can't be displayed; relies on older laptop which is slow to rip CDs.

Notes - sound quality essentially depends on USB DAC.

Option 2

Same as option 1, but place laptop near AVR instead of TV. Same solution essentially, but requires longer VGA / VGA-HDMI cable rather than phono cable which might be more expensive. However, no idea how easy it will be to tuck the PC away at either location so worth mentioning!

Option 3

Same as option 1 / 2, but replace USB DAC with the Oppo BDP-105 Blu-ray player - connect the PC direct to this via USB. Advantage of this is, if you're going to buy that player anyway, you save money on the USB DAC.

Option 4

Purchase dedicated new PC for iTunes and place near bar. Ensure this new PC has both HDMI (or DVI) and optical outputs if a PC. You could even consider a Mac, but that's a whole new story!

Place new PC next to TV and connect to it via HDMI / DVI-HDMI cable. Connect to PC with wireless keyboard and mouse.

Connect optical cable to laptop and run direct into AV receiver (or Oppo 105 Blu-ray player if purchased).

Advantages - nice, shiny new PC which could be used for other purposes (e.g. on demand TV, YouTube, ripped DVDs etc.)

Disadvantages - more expensive solution; other AVR sources can't be displayed.

Option 5

As per Option 4, but place the new PC near the AVR and connect it via HDMI and then run a longer HDMI to the TV. If desired, you could still connect the PC to an Oppo 105 if you bought one to see if this improves the sound.

Advantages - as per option 4, but you also get to display other AVR sources on the bar TV.

Option 6

As per Option 5, but keep new PC near TV and connect new PC to AVR via long HDMI and then back from AVR to TV via long HDMI. I don't know why you'd do this instead of Option 5, but you could if you had a good reason!

Option 7

This is where we go a bit left field as per JD's suggestion.

Keep original laptop and place wherever you like.

Purchase an Apple TV 3 (£99) and place it near the AVR - connect it to the AVR using HDMI, then connect this to the TV via long HDMI.

Purchase the AirParrot software and use this to stream sound to AVR and display your laptop screen on the Apple TV.

Advantages - quite a funky solution; cheaper than options 4 to 6; Apple TV has a number of other functions you might like e.g. you can stream your iTunes library to it, mirror your iPad display to it, rent movies etc.; you also get to display other AVR sources on the bar TV.

Disadvantages - more expensive than options 1 - 3; AirParrot isn't something I've used so can't confirm how good it is.

I think that's enough to be getting on with for now.... any questions?!!

 

[Sirguy969]

If I was wearing one I would take my hat off to you, these are clear and concise options and have certainly given me some food for thought!

Well I'll take your last sentance as a challenge, so here are the questions.

In your opinion, which option would offer the best sound quality?

if I choose the new PC route, or mac, what specs would you suggest?

i do fancy the OPPO, need a 3D player anyway, is the DAC a good option?

Cheers Prof.

 

[professorhat]

In your opinion, which option would offer the best sound quality? ... i do fancy the OPPO, need a 3D player anyway, is the DAC a good option?

I'm personally of the opinion that it's the DAC which will affect the sound the most, so it doesn't really matter too much which option you go for initially as an external DAC can slot into any of them further down the line if you wanted to. Having said that, I also think your Denon AVR will be a limiting factor after a certain point, so you certainly shouldn't go mad on a really expensive DAC without considering this. Remember, your AVR does have a DAC built into it (you just need to connect via an optical connection) so you can use this, and if you do want to put an external DAC in, definitely go to a few dealers around and see if you can demo some.

If you're going to get the Oppo, it would seem this would probably be a very good solution from what I've read, but I'm afraid I don't have any personal experience. From searching the forum, there are a few posts about it (link). You could also seek out a stockist (link) to see if you can demo one.

if I choose the new PC route, or mac, what specs would you suggest?

Well, I'm a Mac man, but if this is just for iTunes, then it'll be hard to justify the cost! Really any modern laptop / PC will be able to cope with iTunes - clearly you ideally want a built in CD drive (which actually rules the Mac out!), plus you really want to have a digital optical and HDMI output as this makes things simple in terms of connectivity. Again though, if you're going with a DAC or the Oppo, you can connect via USB, so the optical port isn't a must have, just a nice to have.

With a Mac, you'd probably have to add in the cost of an external CD drive, plus the external connectors for Thunderbolt to HDMI. They're lovely machines, but if it's just for iTunes, it would be a bit crazy to recommend one!

 

[GSB]

I have the oppo105 and the dac is superb.I have spotify on my laptop and play the music thru the oppo by conecting it to the laptop via a usb cable(£10).

From what i understand the apple tv,or airport express is your best solution(and mine)for wireless streaming,this would allow you to control everything from your ipad

 

[professorhat]

This is a valid point - I've been so blinded into ensuring I get the laptop / PC connected to the TV, I've forgotten that you can get an Apple TV (or Airport Express) and then stream your iTunes music to the Apple TV using the iPad as a remote control.

If you just want to be able to control your music, this is a much simpler solution since it just needs an HDMI cable from the Apple TV to the AVR and that's it - everything else is wireless (assuming you have a wireless network already setup at home).

It would depend on you being happy to control everything from the iPad instead of having the TV on and controlling it there...

 

[John Duncan]

Just FYI, I'm not really funding any reviews of AirParrot for Windows, only really for Mac. Reviews of the latter describe it as 'must have' for those running pre Mountain Lion, but I wouldn't necessarily presume good reviews on Mac would autistic ally translate to similar for PC.

If I had an ATV to hand I'd just buy it, since for ten bucks it's a no brainer really.

 

[Sirguy969]

You know what fellas, i've read many threads on here, asked a few questions, read many, many replies....this has to be one of the more succinct and informative set of replies I think I have read for a long time. I thank you all.

i will ask my wife on her return to the UK to buy ATV3 and start there. I stillfeel deep down that I will end up with an AV/TV specific PC/Mac as here in KSA my son has started to download many Brit programmes that then require him to bring his NASA specPC from his bedroom and connect to the living room TV to watch. It would be much easier to have a PC/Mac permanently connected in my AV rack purely for music and programme downloads. But, for now, I will start with the ATV3 and go from there.

once again, thank you all.

 

[Sirguy969]

So ATV3 or jailbroke ATV2 off ebay for £250!

which is best and why?