I recently purchased a Panasonic 42PZ85 over a 40W4500, not because of issues some members appear to have but due to preference for the Plasma picture. However after my decision I became fascinated by the anger towards WHF for praising the SonyW4500 series. I would therefore like to know if WHF plan to modify their reviewing process, now I understand that a business can't base or alter its practices on what is said on an open forum, my concern however is that other sites such as Avreview have mentioned issues with this particular series, and that another HDTV testing site test for Clouding and back-light bleed on LCD TV's. The point of this thread is to hopefully open a debate with a constructive approach.
Can WHF learn anything from the Sony W4500
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We know there was at least one dodgy review unit doing the rounds, but the numerous samples we tested here - and the shop-bought sets we've subsequently seen in homes of family and friends - have been absolutely fine.
We will continue to ask for multiple samples of sets, and get out and about and see the sets in action, plus persist with team-testing in a range of lighting conditions.
We will also continue to host and react to threads on this Forum, which will feedback into our reviews and general coverage.
Is there anything else people would like us to consider?
We will continue to ask for multiple samples of sets, and get out and about and see the sets in action, plus persist with team-testing in a range of lighting conditions.
We will also continue to host and react to threads on this Forum, which will feedback into our reviews and general coverage.
Is there anything else people would like us to consider?
What is the real colour of James Bond's suit in the ads that are run in TV shops promoting HD? I thought it was black, but when watching in comet the other day on the Sony 4500 it was blue.
As far as reviews are concerned people need to understand that a 5 star rating, or any rating for that matter refers to TVs in a particular category. The Sony gets a 5 star rating in relation to other LCD TVs of that spec. A 5 star rating of an Lcd TV could mean that it is better or worse than a 5 star rating of a plasma TV.
Ratings should only be used as a rough guide. The best review is your own eyes, as long as you understand what you are watching in the shop. Are you watching HD or SD? Are you watching fast motion sport or a cartoon? Has the TV been set up right? All these things have to taken into consideration.
As far as reviews are concerned people need to understand that a 5 star rating, or any rating for that matter refers to TVs in a particular category. The Sony gets a 5 star rating in relation to other LCD TVs of that spec. A 5 star rating of an Lcd TV could mean that it is better or worse than a 5 star rating of a plasma TV.
Ratings should only be used as a rough guide. The best review is your own eyes, as long as you understand what you are watching in the shop. Are you watching HD or SD? Are you watching fast motion sport or a cartoon? Has the TV been set up right? All these things have to taken into consideration.
Hi Clare, firstly I'd like to say how much I have appreciated WHF magazine and the reviews, and ability to ask the team questions!
One thing I would be interested in is reviews which comment on off-air pictures not always being best quality. I know that Panasonics are often praised for their onboard tuners, and some Sonys do not score so highly in this regard. Given that many people don't watch much live TV, but mostly through a PVR or Sky + etc, is there any way of commenting on a review how a televsion handles images watched through a PVR? For example, would the Sony KDL32v4000 (which you comment isn't the best for off-air broadcasts) actually be fine if you watched tele through a PVR or a Sky + box, or would it equally show it's weaknesses here? Or do the comments in the reviews about how good DVD images look equate to this anyway?
many thanks.
One thing I would be interested in is reviews which comment on off-air pictures not always being best quality. I know that Panasonics are often praised for their onboard tuners, and some Sonys do not score so highly in this regard. Given that many people don't watch much live TV, but mostly through a PVR or Sky + etc, is there any way of commenting on a review how a televsion handles images watched through a PVR? For example, would the Sony KDL32v4000 (which you comment isn't the best for off-air broadcasts) actually be fine if you watched tele through a PVR or a Sky + box, or would it equally show it's weaknesses here? Or do the comments in the reviews about how good DVD images look equate to this anyway?
many thanks.
Too dependant on the quality of the pvr i would imagine to be able to give meaningfull reviews????
I think a percentage out of 100 would be better than 5 stars. Plus if something like a Pioneer 5090 gets 5 stars then surely my 40W4500 cant also get the same 5 star award.. marks shouldnt be price bracket dependent. They should be more like game reviews where everything is on a level playing field regardless of price bracket. If a 32inch tv has a better picture than 50 inch then obviously it will get a higher percentage mark, whether or not the 50inch is the best tv out of all the 50inch screens.
If however brackets must be made then sort them into the relative screen sizes but not based on price.
If however brackets must be made then sort them into the relative screen sizes but not based on price.
Ginder: I think a percentage out of 100 would be better than 5 stars.
That doesn't really help. Seeing something rated at 82% and something rated at say 86% doesn't really tell you anything meaningful. I used to work on computer magazine in the mid 80's to early 90's and we used to agonize over whether something should get 92% or 93%. It was all nonsense really as in all honesty there were only three possible outcomes: avoid, consider buying if it meets your needs and fantastic. TBH I'm not even sure that magazines should have rating systems. Read the review then make your own mind up.
That doesn't really help. Seeing something rated at 82% and something rated at say 86% doesn't really tell you anything meaningful. I used to work on computer magazine in the mid 80's to early 90's and we used to agonize over whether something should get 92% or 93%. It was all nonsense really as in all honesty there were only three possible outcomes: avoid, consider buying if it meets your needs and fantastic. TBH I'm not even sure that magazines should have rating systems. Read the review then make your own mind up.
Clare Newsome:
We know there was at least one dodgy review unit doing the rounds, but the numerous samples we tested here - and the shop-bought sets we've subsequently seen in homes of family and friends - have been absolutely fine.
We will continue to ask for multiple samples of sets, and get out and about and see the sets in action, plus persist with team-testing in a range of lighting conditions.
We will also continue to host and react to threads on this Forum, which will feedback into our reviews and general coverage.
Is there anything else people would like us to consider?
Claire did you personally view your family and friends LCDs in VERY low light conditions? I am being reasonable here Claire, did your reviewers view the LCDs in very low light to pitch black conditions?
I can honestly say that if you put any Plasma and any LCD side by side in a pitch black room wired up to the same Blue ray player, you will see backlight bleed in 'some' form or another (on the LCD).
We know there was at least one dodgy review unit doing the rounds, but the numerous samples we tested here - and the shop-bought sets we've subsequently seen in homes of family and friends - have been absolutely fine.
We will continue to ask for multiple samples of sets, and get out and about and see the sets in action, plus persist with team-testing in a range of lighting conditions.
We will also continue to host and react to threads on this Forum, which will feedback into our reviews and general coverage.
Is there anything else people would like us to consider?
Claire did you personally view your family and friends LCDs in VERY low light conditions? I am being reasonable here Claire, did your reviewers view the LCDs in very low light to pitch black conditions?
I can honestly say that if you put any Plasma and any LCD side by side in a pitch black room wired up to the same Blue ray player, you will see backlight bleed in 'some' form or another (on the LCD).
Martin Gman:I am being reasonable here Claire, did your reviewers view the LCDs in very low light to pitch black conditions?
Yes: we have a totally light-tight, windowless, black-walled TV testing room - aka The Bunker - which can then be lit to varying levels using a dimmer system.
Yes: we have a totally light-tight, windowless, black-walled TV testing room - aka The Bunker - which can then be lit to varying levels using a dimmer system.
matthewpiano
Well-known member
- Nov 23, 2007
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I think price bracket HAS to come into review ratings. Most people go out with a budget in mind when they are buying something and so its most useful to have a general idea of which are the best sets AT THAT PRICE POINT. What Hi-Fi's focus on performance per pound makes it very clear if a particular product performs beyond its price point.
Martin Gman:[Claire did you personally view your family and friends LCDs in VERY low light conditions? I am being reasonable here Claire, did your reviewers view the LCDs in very low light to pitch black conditions?
I can honestly say that if you put any Plasma and any LCD side by side in a pitch black room wired up to the same Blue ray player, you will see backlight bleed in 'some' form or another (on the LCD).
I can honestly say... that in pitch black or very low light levels, your pupil size wil be greater so that:-
a/ you will introduce more aberration from the natural lens of your eye
b/ with a bright source against a dark field there is then more potential for veiling glare due to the imperfect transparency of the eye itself
I can honestly say that if you put any Plasma and any LCD side by side in a pitch black room wired up to the same Blue ray player, you will see backlight bleed in 'some' form or another (on the LCD).
I can honestly say... that in pitch black or very low light levels, your pupil size wil be greater so that:-
a/ you will introduce more aberration from the natural lens of your eye
b/ with a bright source against a dark field there is then more potential for veiling glare due to the imperfect transparency of the eye itself
Gerrardasnails
Well-known member
- Sep 6, 2007
- 295
- 1
- 18,890
Martin Gman:Clare Newsome:
We know there was at least one dodgy review unit doing the rounds, but the numerous samples we tested here - and the shop-bought sets we've subsequently seen in homes of family and friends - have been absolutely fine.
We will continue to ask for multiple samples of sets, and get out and about and see the sets in action, plus persist with team-testing in a range of lighting conditions.
We will also continue to host and react to threads on this Forum, which will feedback into our reviews and general coverage.
Is there anything else people would like us to consider?
Claire did you personally view your family and friends LCDs in VERY low light conditions? I am being reasonable here Claire, did your reviewers view the LCDs in very low light to pitch black conditions?
I can honestly say that if you put any Plasma and any LCD side by side in a pitch black room wired up to the same Blue ray player, you will see backlight bleed in 'some' form or another (on the LCD).
I have a three year old LCD - KDL-40W2000. I often watch films in darkness (both sets of curtains closed, even the door closed and I don't see any backlight bleed. Now, I'm not going to say that plasma is better or worse than LCD. What I will say is that not all LCD's are rubbish and obviously the new top Sony sets are not all riddled with backlight bleed and clouding.
If I bought a new screen and it had problems, I would send it back.
We know there was at least one dodgy review unit doing the rounds, but the numerous samples we tested here - and the shop-bought sets we've subsequently seen in homes of family and friends - have been absolutely fine.
We will continue to ask for multiple samples of sets, and get out and about and see the sets in action, plus persist with team-testing in a range of lighting conditions.
We will also continue to host and react to threads on this Forum, which will feedback into our reviews and general coverage.
Is there anything else people would like us to consider?
Claire did you personally view your family and friends LCDs in VERY low light conditions? I am being reasonable here Claire, did your reviewers view the LCDs in very low light to pitch black conditions?
I can honestly say that if you put any Plasma and any LCD side by side in a pitch black room wired up to the same Blue ray player, you will see backlight bleed in 'some' form or another (on the LCD).
I have a three year old LCD - KDL-40W2000. I often watch films in darkness (both sets of curtains closed, even the door closed and I don't see any backlight bleed. Now, I'm not going to say that plasma is better or worse than LCD. What I will say is that not all LCD's are rubbish and obviously the new top Sony sets are not all riddled with backlight bleed and clouding.
If I bought a new screen and it had problems, I would send it back.
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