AVI or ? to match Michell Orbe (Ashley pls advice?)

[Alec]

you posted some suppositions based on hearsay, then took pot-shots at people. I found your first post odd and baseless (you accept this yourself), but didn't think anything was worthy of comment until you started being offensive.

 

[chebby]

Sure there's a conspiracy against me ...

Yes, we are all plotting against you at our secret meetings.

 

[davedotco]

Sure there's a conspiracy against me, and the thread is blown out of all proportion. I get accused of this and that, yet my initial post was just an alternative to the OP -- balanced, fair and honest appraisal (with a little humour, too).

"Now I've not heard any actives, but from the countless posts I've read about their ability, sonic signature, the closest I've heard is my set-up.

Yes, Leema Pulse MKI and PMC speakers. The bass is as controlled and taut as a very taut thing, the top-end is crisp and the midrange is immensely expressive. From what I've read, the only thing a AVI owner would miss is the outright clarity (there's honesty for you), but again this is going purely on all comments written about the fabled AVIs.

Add into the Leema equation is a shed-load of analogue inputs and a fabulous double-sided phono stage for turntables. No need to faff with buying extra boxes and gizmos.

That said, it could be b#####ks and I look the idiot."

Cno offers alternatives of Bel Canto + LS50s as alternatives and later R300 to go with the OP's Cyrus, yet no-one batters an eyelid. Wish there was more parity when it came to other posters replies. Why not tell Cno "it's a price thing"?

Because he made that comment before the OP had given a budget, not after.

Sure you can buy used product, the OP seems quite comfortable doing so, but that is a different market that can not really be compared to buying new, fully warranteed equipment from a compedent supplier.

Or of course you can mix it up, a decent used amplifier such as those suggested by yourself and Cno with a pair of DB1 Golds, new from Fanthorpes (£800) and you might get pretty close to budget, perfectly valid setup.

I really do not see what your 'issues' are.....*unknw*

Apart from the secret society plotting against you that is......*shok*

 

[Alec]

Sure there's a conspiracy against me ...

Yes, we are all plotting against you at our secret meetings.

It's my turn to take the minutes next time.

 

[plastic penguin]

Sure there's a conspiracy against me, and the thread is blown out of all proportion. I get accused of this and that, yet my initial post was just an alternative to the OP -- balanced, fair and honest appraisal (with a little humour, too).

"Now I've not heard any actives, but from the countless posts I've read about their ability, sonic signature, the closest I've heard is my set-up.

Yes, Leema Pulse MKI and PMC speakers. The bass is as controlled and taut as a very taut thing, the top-end is crisp and the midrange is immensely expressive. From what I've read, the only thing a AVI owner would miss is the outright clarity (there's honesty for you), but again this is going purely on all comments written about the fabled AVIs.

Add into the Leema equation is a shed-load of analogue inputs and a fabulous double-sided phono stage for turntables. No need to faff with buying extra boxes and gizmos.

That said, it could be b#####ks and I look the idiot."

Cno offers alternatives of Bel Canto + LS50s as alternatives and later R300 to go with the OP's Cyrus, yet no-one batters an eyelid. Wish there was more parity when it came to other posters replies. Why not tell Cno "it's a price thing"?

Because he made that comment before the OP had given a budget, not after.

Sure you can buy used product, the OP seems quite comfortable doing so, but that is a different market that can not really be compared to buying new, fully warranteed equipment from a compedent supplier.

Or of course you can mix it up, a decent used amplifier such as those suggested by yourself and Cno with a pair of DB1 Golds, new from Fanthorpes (£800) and you might get pretty close to budget, perfectly valid setup.

I really do not see what your 'issues' are.....*unknw*

Apart from the secret society plotting against you that is......*shok*

Well with the Leema at around £400 and s/hand DB1is for about £500; that's sorted for reasonable money. It's an alternative and more cost effective than other passive suggestions. (the R300s retail around £1,000). Yes s/hand R300 are obv cheaper, but trying to find a decent pair is pretty rare.

 

[hybridauth_facebook_1361961955]

Thanks to everybody for all the valuable input (so far)

I am amazed though how people can start bashing eachother on such a subjective topic as choosing Hifi. A waste of valuable energy IMHO. Let's just be nice to eachother, what's wrong with the fact that person X favours a setup with vintage passive speakers over state of the art 2k14 active all-in-one solutions that are attractive to person Y or Z?

Me, I don't mind if set is brand new or 30 years old. I just want it to sound good.

On topic; to clarify things I tend toward buying good 2nd hand cos of the value for money. It would be great to have it all in box instead of a multi box setup. However, from reading posts all over the web, I think that the 9T or 9RS may lack bass given my personal (music) taste. Getting a subwoofer is not an option for me, given earlier experiences in both home audio and (recording/mixing) studios. Blame it on music producer ears ;-)

I've contacted Audio Tec in the Netherlands and will travel there for an audition of the active AVI solution (I asked if they still have a passive setup available for 1 on 1 comparison).

The idea of getting the AVI s2000 pre & 2 mono power still appeals to me very much though. However, given my ltd budget I might hang on to the Cyrus 8 for a while and spend more on speakers. So more input is very welcome.

Near me, a pair of AVI Duo have been offered, can anybody tell me if these are worth the 70 mile trip for having a listen?

Thanks again for taking part and eh... be nice to eachother, allright?

 

[davedotco]

Thanks to everybody for all the valuable input (so far)

I am amazed though how people can start bashing eachother on such a subjective topic as choosing Hifi. A waste of valuable energy IMHO. Let's just be nice to eachother, what's wrong with the fact that person X favours a setup with vintage passive speakers over state of the art 2k14 active all-in-one solutions that are attractive to person Y or Z?

Me, I don't mind if set is brand new or 30 years old. I just want it to sound good.

On topic; to clarify things I tend toward buying good 2nd hand cos of the value for money. It would be great to have it all in box instead of a multi box setup. However, from reading posts all over the web, I think that the 9T or 9RS may lack bass given my personal (music) taste. Getting a subwoofer is not an option for me, given earlier experiences in both home audio and (recording/mixing) studios. Blame it on music producer ears ;-)

I've contacted Audio Tec in the Netherlands and will travel there for an audition of the active AVI solution (I asked if they still have a passive setup available for 1 on 1 comparison).

The idea of getting the AVI s2000 pre & 2 mono power still appeals to me very much though. However, given my ltd budget I might hang on to the Cyrus 8 for a while and spend more on speakers. So more input is very welcome.

Near me, a pair of AVI Duo have been offered, can anybody tell me if these are worth the 70 mile trip for having a listen?

Thanks again for taking part and eh... be nice to eachother, allright?

This is quite a dificult one. An awful lot depends on what you consider to be 'good' or 'enough' bass.

What follows is a personal opinion, I'm getting that in first.

I feel that virtually all affordable hi-fi speakers have far too much bass and very littly of it has anything to do with the music.

Deliberately hyped bass response, cabinet resonances, driver overhang, time smear all combine to give a full warm character to the sound that to me is just horrible, strangely a lot of people seen to like that.

Playing speakers with accurate bass comes as something as a shock, many people don't like it, everything sounds so different. Good passive speakers, with suitable amplifiers, can do that but they are unlikely to be cheap, new at least. The ADM9rs are like that, total control over the bass response, tight, punchy and when required pretty powerful.

The big difference is that they do not try and cover up their lack of deep bass extension (they are a 6inch 2 way after all) by hyping the mid bass, as most hi-fi speakers do. Once (if?) you get used to bass response of this quality and type you will find, as I do, most affordable speakers to be pretty much unlistenable.

 

[Overdose]

I feel that virtually all affordable hi-fi speakers have far too much bass and very littly of it has anything to do with the music.

Once (if?) you get used to bass response of this quality and type you will find, as I do, most affordable speakers to be pretty much unlistenable.

As a matter of (genuine) interest, what passive standmount speakers do have a good/accurate bass response? All in your own opinion and all that other caveat stuff.

I'm fairly confident that I'd be able to get suitable amplification and source below £500, but just how much would you need to spend to get the same sort of quality from speakers that the ADM9s offer?

 

[relocated]

Whilst the Active / Passive debate gets quietly out of hand (again) I was wondering why lindsayt mentions the need to try a different tonearm? Where did that one come from?

The OP has a real quality TT set-up with a very fine SME 309 and a very decent Zyx cartridge (I love 'em) not at all sure what changing tonearms has go to do with it.

Trying to work out why lindsayt says the things that he does is a complete waste of time. I think he believes that everything made in the last 20 years is 'new-fangled-rubbish'and needs replacing with product that manufacturers bettered decades ago. You have to feel sorry for him.

 

[relocated]

Thanks to everybody for all the valuable input (so far)

I am amazed though how people can start bashing eachother on such a subjective topic as choosing Hifi. A waste of valuable energy IMHO. Let's just be nice to eachother, what's wrong with the fact that person X favours a setup with vintage passive speakers over state of the art 2k14 active all-in-one solutions that are attractive to person Y or Z?

Me, I don't mind if set is brand new or 30 years old. I just want it to sound good.

On topic; to clarify things I tend toward buying good 2nd hand cos of the value for money. It would be great to have it all in box instead of a multi box setup. However, from reading posts all over the web, I think that the 9T or 9RS may lack bass given my personal (music) taste. Getting a subwoofer is not an option for me, given earlier experiences in both home audio and (recording/mixing) studios. Blame it on music producer ears ;-)

I've contacted Audio Tec in the Netherlands and will travel there for an audition of the active AVI solution (I asked if they still have a passive setup available for 1 on 1 comparison).

The idea of getting the AVI s2000 pre & 2 mono power still appeals to me very much though. However, given my ltd budget I might hang on to the Cyrus 8 for a while and spend more on speakers. So more input is very welcome.

Near me, a pair of AVI Duo have been offered, can anybody tell me if these are worth the 70 mile trip for having a listen?

Thanks again for taking part and eh... be nice to eachother, allright?

Patrick, if you go over to AVI forum and join up, you will be able to ask 'Arthur' about Duos and Trios as he still has or had them up to recently.

 

[hybridauth_facebook_1361961955]

I feel that virtually all affordable hi-fi speakers have far too much bass and very littly of it has anything to do with the music

My point exactly. I listened to my own turntable - first hooked up to a Pink Faun phono/Pink Faun power amp, accompanied by speakers whose brand I've forgotten, but they were far out my league anyway (just as the Pink Faun combo). Now there was controlled bass, completely natural sound and it all went just 'loose'. Incredible listening experience.

Then, listening to the AVI pre/2x mono power with my own S2000PP head amp (over the same speakers), the experience was likewise. Of course there was a bit less of everything, but it was unlike anything I'd listened to before. Control, depth, image, clarity, detail... it just had it all. The band was in the room so to speak, and I could virtually hear Adrian Sherwood tweaking the knobs while he used his mixing desk as an instrument on Creation Rebel's Starship Africa (psychedelic dub album from 1978).

That's what I'm looking for in the end. Having that listening experience in mind, I'll gladly audition the active AVis as well.

 

[davedotco]

I feel that virtually all affordable hi-fi speakers have far too much bass and very littly of it has anything to do with the music.

Once (if?) you get used to bass response of this quality and type you will find, as I do, most affordable speakers to be pretty much unlistenable.

As a matter of (genuine) interest, what passive standmount speakers do have a good/accurate bass response? All in your own opinion and all that other caveat stuff.

I'm fairly confident that I'd be able to get suitable amplification and source below £500, but just how much would you need to spend to get the same sort of quality from speakers that the ADM9s offer?

It is very dificult.

I am now so adverse to what I describe as 'over warm' bass that I would rather have extremely limited bass, such as the Dali Zensor 1 than the fake warmth of something like a Kef R300.

It is hard to argue with the physics, a small speaker of sensible sensitivity is not going to produce deep bass. One of my favourites was the small PMC DB1, currently available in 'Gold' configuration for £800. The bass is fairly decent, though for them to work to my satisfaction they would need a lot of space and some fairly potent amplification. I would like something well in excess of 100wpc with these and, depending on the system, I would pair them with PMC's own monoblocks at about £1200pr and a nice dac/pre-amp.

I do not get to hear that much modern hi-fi, but pretty much everything in the budget to mid price sounds pretty horrible to me, sometimes it is down to poor system choice and setup but I have heard little in the dealers that would tempt me to part with much money.

 

[CnoEvil]

Sure there's a conspiracy against me, and the thread is blown out of all proportion. I get accused of this and that, yet my initial post was just an alternative to the OP -- balanced, fair and honest appraisal (with a little humour, too).

Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean we're not out to get you. *diablo*

Cno offers alternatives of Bel Canto + LS50s as alternatives and later R300 to go with the OP's Cyrus, yet no-one batters an eyelid. Wish there was more parity when it came to other posters replies. Why not tell Cno "it's a price thing"?

*angel*

 

[Covenanter]

I can't be bothered to read the thread. Is it just another load of AVI groupie posts?

Chris

 

[hybridauth_facebook_1361961955]

Yr remark leaves me curious. For me, it's not about names, brand, hype or £ - it's about the sound I get out. That's how I picked my Orbe configuration and where the guy who built it for me clearly put question marks on my cartridge choice at first, after listening to it he had to admit that the ZYX was a better match than the top of the line Clearaudio cartridge he used to recommend (at less than 35% of the price). So I am very curious on your pick of amp/passive speakers (standmount, floorstanders) up to £1500 - and the sound characteristics that come with it. Or should I just wait till after the ADM9 audition?

 

[Overdose]

Yr remark leaves me curious. For me, it's not about names, brand, hype or £ - it's about the sound I get out. That's how I picked my Orbe configuration and where the guy who built it for me clearly put question marks on my cartridge choice at first, after listening to it he had to admit that the ZYX was a better match than the top of the line Clearaudio cartridge he used to recommend (at less than 35% of the price). So I am very curious on your pick of amp/passive speakers (standmount, floorstanders) up to £1500 - and the sound characteristics that come with it. Or should I just wait till after the ADM9 audition?

My question was to see what really compares to the ADM9s. The cost of a good system is largely dependent on speaker choice and TT if required. As far as I'm concerned, audibly transparent digital sources and amplification can be had for modest sums and transparent is as good as it gets in absolute hifi terms, so the real variable for me is in the cost of the speakers, as these seem to give real and tangible improvements as prices increase (in general terms).

I don't have any real issues with my system, but would be interested to hear the latest ADM9s vs my current setup. That said, if I should ever have the space for a sub, that may be the way to go vs new speakers, as I too listen to music with artificial sub bass. In the main though, I don't feel I'm missing out anywhere.

Ultimately, I feel that I would need to spend rather a lot more money to better what I have if moving to a more traditional setup.

 

[matt49]

Yr remark leaves me curious. For me, it's not about names, brand, hype or £ - it's about the sound I get out. That's how I picked my Orbe configuration and where the guy who built it for me clearly put question marks on my cartridge choice at first, after listening to it he had to admit that the ZYX was a better match than the top of the line Clearaudio cartridge he used to recommend (at less than 35% of the price). So I am very curious on your pick of amp/passive speakers (standmount, floorstanders) up to £1500 - and the sound characteristics that come with it. Or should I just wait till after the ADM9 audition?

Unfortunately this whole area has become rather polarized, mainly because of the idiosyncratic behaviour of the current management of AVI.

I happen to think the AVI ADM9s are very good VFM (I forget exactly which model I heard). Of course, there are other active speakers that deserve consideration. I have a pair of Adams that do a jolly good job for me.

The key thing is to be sceptical about exaggerated claims made for any particular brands. In your price bracket, the AVIs are definitely worthy contenders. I'd also suggest trying the Martin Logan Motion 15s. And if you could push your budget further, some Martin Logan or Magneplanar panel speakers would be very interesting.

Matt

 

[Craig M.]

Patrick, I wrote an embarassingly long post detailing my lead-up to owning ADMs. Maybe you'll find it helpful. If you can demo some I think you should, if it's the sort of sound your after I don't think you'll find an equal for the money. http://hddaudio.net/viewtopic.php?id=7715