Arcam CD192 vs Rega Apollo

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Hi there, I'm just after some opinions please. I will be auditioning the kit but just wanted some other people's thoughts. I'm considering upgrading my source which is currently an Arcam CD73t. I'm considering either purchasing the Rega Apollo or upgrading my CD73t to a CD192.The cost for these is virtually the same. My music tast is fairly broad, ranging from Bob Dylan to Rage against the machine. Because of this i'm after the best "overall" sound i can get. Is the Arcam CD192 in another league to the Apollo? Many thanks Tom
 

Clare Newsome

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Hi Tom,

The Arcam is a better player than the Rega, so for the same money we'd say go for the upgrade.

The CD192 will have a very similar sonic signature to your current player, so if you're happy with the balance of your system you'll just be getting more of the same (but better!)
 
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Anonymous

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Hi Clare

Thanks for your very prompt response. I think perhaps i should have been a little more concise in my original post. If i went for the Rega option, i would probably be able to sell my CD73t for roughly £250-£300, so it would actually cost me £300 for the Rega. The Arcam CD192 upgrade is £500 so there is actually a difference of approx £200. Would you still go down the Arcam path? I am very happy with my current set up, the only thing i would say is that maybe my system is a tad "relaxed" but i think this is the Arcam sound (probably down to my A80). Am i looking in the wrong place (source) if i want a bit more "attack"?

Thanks

Tom
 

Clare Newsome

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We'd still opt for the CD192 upgrade. but also look to put an amp-upgrade on your agenda as the next step - the Arcam A80 is a good amp, but can sound a tad pedestrian at times.
 
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Anonymous

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Thanks again Clare for your quick response,

I was hoping you would say go for the CD192 as it would also be an easier upgrade as far as my equipment stand is concerned. I did initially look into getting a P90 to run with the amp but unfortunately my Rega R3's cannot be bi-wired. To be honest, they would be the last component i would want to replace. I have had them for a couple of years now and i think they are fantastic!! On the same note (i'm sorry if this should be another post) but have you had chance to review the R3's yet. I read that they were going to be in January's issue which i missed?

Thanks

Tom
 

Clare Newsome

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After not having Rega kit for a while, we're gradually working our way through the current range!

We haven't reviewed the R3s yet - we tested the R1s in the January issue. We really liked them, praising them for their excellent mid-range detail and wonderfully direct delivery. They got four stars - losing a star for having limited bass and a slightly bright treble (the former being something your floorstanders are less likely to struggle with!)
 
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Anonymous

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Well i wait with baited breath for your review of them. Personally i think they could be a bit of a hidden gem. Just because i auditioned them with some Kef IQ5's and Monitor Audios (i forget which model) and thought they blew them out of the water. (All personal opinion of course). I would not of even auditioned them had my local Sevenoaks not highly recommended them.
 
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Anonymous

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hi, claire i am after a cinema suuround system but dont know which one to go for. i have listened to the 2.1 systems like the bose3.2.1 and also a 5.1 system with wireless back speakers. can you recommend a system for me. my room is 21ft by 12ft. i dont really like a lot of cables around the room. how do you rate the sony dav x10
 

Clare Newsome

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can you please re-post your query in the home cinema forum (go to the forum home page,click on home cinema and then "start a new thread' button - you'll get a lot more responses then. thanks!
 
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Anonymous

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Just to give an alternative view, this week I demoed the Arcam A90 and the CD73 against the Rega Cursa3, Maia3, Apollo and the Naim cd5i and Nait 5i. I found the Arcam and Rega very enjoyable but the Naim for far to forward for my taste. The Arcam was a bit more detailed than the Rega but felt it a bit forced in the mid range, whilst the Rega was a bit more laid back but sounded a bit more rounded. In the end, after about an hour I went for the Rega set up with Focal Chorus 816v speakers. It sounded very nice indeed.

As its always said, its about personal preferences to how you like the music presented from the electronics. If you like the Arcam sound I would stick with it.
 
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Anonymous

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Cheers for your input Shari.

It's a cliche but thats probably coz it's true (its about personal preferences to how you like the music presented from the electronics). Personally i like the detail that Arcam produces, and i think it is an "honest" sound. This may not be to everbody's taste but it is to mine. Having had Marantz PM7200, NAD C521BEE, Wharfedale Diamond 8.4 before, the difference is vast, much more detail, soundstage etc. The A90 was not really an option when i was purchasing my amp due to the price, but i did test it against the Arcam A70, Cyrus 6 and Rotel Ra06 and what might be surprising to some, the A80 was my choice. I thought the A70 was a little lightweight, the Cyrus a bit "sharp" but with wonderful detail, and the Rotel sounded a bit "muffled". I'm not sure if i have explained this correctly but i actually thought it was a little bass heavy. I did also audition the Rotel RC-06/RB-06 combo and found that to be much the same. Granted it was very powerful but i found it lacking clarity and found it a bit tiring. I would be interested to hear other people's opinions on these particular models.

Thanks

Tom
 

JoelSim

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I agree with you on the Arcam sound, detailed and relaxing. Wouldn't swap it currently (unless I won the lottery, where I'd move it into another room in the house as a second system).
 
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Anonymous

Guest
[quote user="Clare Newsome"]
We'd still opt for the CD192 upgrade. but also look to put an amp-upgrade on your agenda as the next step - the Arcam A80 is a good amp, but can sound a tad pedestrian at times.

[/quote]

Clare is being rather tactful here I think with her description of the A80.To my ears the amp is soft and mushy in the bass with no drive or punch.If you are after more oomph and a less relaxed sound i would say it was a must that you change the amp first. I had an Arcam A75+, very similar sounding amp to the A80, and i have an Arcam CD73t.The soft sound I had was from the amp not the cd player.As soon as i changed the amp i had a punchy livlier sound. If you buy a CD192 your sound will still sound pedestrian, albeit a better quality of pedestrian. Do yourself a favour and change the amp first.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
chiefbrody, can you please tell me where you got the quote to upgrade your CDP? i have a CD72 and am also looking to upgrade it but i cant seem to find any info on how, where and for how much the upgrades can be done.
cheers,
chris
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Hi Chris

I got the quote from my local Sevenoaks in Leeds. They are my local Arcam dealer and will therefore send off the unit to Arcam for the upgrade. I have always found Sevenoaks to be very helpful and knowledgeable and therefore i have used them for years. Whereabouts are you based? I'm sure there must be a Sevenoaks or an Arcam dealer near you.

Thanks

Tom
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Fraziel,

I have read some people's comments regarding the Arcam DIVA range for amplifiers, and i can see what they mean about them not being the most authorative units, but what i really like is the clarity and detail of the sound. It's not something i would like to sacrifice for a bit more oomph. Again it is down to personal preference but i have auditioned other amps and found the detail lacking and the sound a bit tiring. As i said in my previous post, i listened to the Rotel Pre/Power combo, a Rotel Ra-03,Rotel Ra-06, Arcam A70 and Cyrus 6vs2 and the A80 was my preference.

I have considered auditioning some other units and replacing my amp, but due to my equipment rack, (long story) my options are fairly limited. I considered the following:

Arcam A90
Exposure 2010s
Primare I21/I30
Naim Nait 5i

I would still not rule out an upgrade of the amp so any opinions or suggestions would be welcome.

Thanks

Tom
 
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Anonymous

Guest
fr0g

I'm with you on that one, the clarity and detail really impressed me and that's what sold it for me. Unfortunately, as my Rega R3's are not bi-wireable adding a P80 is not an option at the moment. If they were, that would probably be my next move. I may have to wait a while then because i really don't want to replace my speakers as i'm very happy with them. I think i would still like to upgrade my source as i think it will still be worthwhile, even if it does not give me much added "oomph". It's not that i'm unhappy with my set up, far from it, i just have a little case of upgraditis. From what i have read about the CD192 i think it could well be a very good move.

Thanks

Tom
 

d_a_n1979

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Personally i'd contact Arcam direct.

Theyre great to deal with and great service. I emailed them to get a quote to have my Arcam Alpha 9 integrated and 9P power amps serviced, i sent them 2 days later and had them back in just under 2 weeks and they looked brand-spanking new! They even replaced both the facia's for me as well as the internal service!

They now sound so much better then before and even then they still sounded bloody good!
 
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Anonymous

Guest
[quote user="fr0g"][quote user="Fraziel"][quote user="Clare Newsome"]

We'd still opt for the CD192 upgrade. but also look to put an amp-upgrade on your agenda as the next step - the Arcam A80 is a good amp, but can sound a tad pedestrian at times.

[/quote] Clare is being rather tactful here I think with her description of the A80.To my ears the amp is soft and mushy in the bass with no drive or punch.If you are after more oomph and a less relaxed sound i would say it was a must that you change the amp first. I had an Arcam A75+, very similar sounding amp to the A80, and i have an Arcam CD73t.The soft sound I had was from the amp not the cd player.As soon as i changed the amp i had a punchy livlier sound. If you buy a CD192 your sound will still sound pedestrian, albeit a better quality of pedestrian. Do yourself a favour and change the amp first.[/quote] Now you're putting words into other peoples mouths... nice.

I tested a 640A when I bought the A80, and returned it after a day. The clarity and detail of the A80 is what sold it to me. But it depends on the sound someone likes. I'd be tempted to add a P80 myself.
[/quote]

what do you mean now? Have i done something before? And I am not putting words in anyones mouths.I am however quite able to read between the lines having heard the amp.My opinion is Clare was being tactful.i could be wrong, but thats what it looked like to me.Perhaps you should grow up and accept that some people have a different opinions to you instead of making childish remarks. If you had also read all the posts you would have seen that chiefbrody was complaining about the sound being too relaxed.Whether you like it or not that is entirely down to the amp.Or are you going to disagree With Clares opinion too? Yes the arcam has clarity and detail but it lacks drive and punch.FACT. I did not even suggest changing it to a cambridge so why even mention it? I agree that the cambridge does not have the clarity and detail of the arcam.Add the P75 power however and it does and has drive and punch the Arcam can't hold a candle to.FrOgJust accept that the Arcam is the cause of the pedestrian sound.Thats a fact and not some attempt to start an argument.I just want to point out that changing the cd player will not solve the main problem
 
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Anonymous

Guest
[quote user="d_a_n1979"]Personally i'd contact Arcam direct.

Theyre great to deal with and great service. I emailed them to get a quote to have my Arcam Alpha 9 integrated and 9P power amps serviced, i sent them 2 days later and had them back in just under 2 weeks and they looked brand-spanking new! They even replaced both the facia's for me as well as the internal service!

They now sound so much better then before and even then they still sounded bloody good!
[/quote]

The Arcam website tells you to contact your local Arcam dealer does it not?
 

matthewpiano

Well-known member
Arcam amps do tend to be very pedestrian sounding. I had an A65+ that absolutely ruined my enjoyment of music for a long time because it sapped the life out of everything. Some people are happy to lose the speed and attack to gain the things that the Arcams are very good at - detail resolution, soundstage, and tonal reproduction. Others are happy to lose quite a lot of those features and opt for the Cambridge Audio sound - fast, exciting, but not terribly good tonally. This is why I love NAD amps so much. They walk a very well judged line and combine all the best attributes of Arcam with the excitement and punch of Cambridge.
I would completely agree that, in the context of your current system, the CD player is not the weak point. The CD73 is a highly capable, detailed and involving player that, at present, will be getting pedestrianised by the A80. I've auditioned the A80 and liked a great deal of what it did in hi-fi terms but it completely lacked any sense of atmosphere or excitement. I would be inclined to try the CD73 with a Naim Nait 5i or, if you want to spend a bit less, a NAD C352 or C372. All three will provide much greater excitement without losing the hi-fi attributes of the A80. Alternatively look at a second hand Musical Fidelity amp.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
[quote user="matthewpiano"]Arcam amps do tend to be very pedestrian sounding. I had an A65+ that absolutely ruined my enjoyment of music for a long time because it sapped the life out of everything. Some people are happy to lose the speed and attack to gain the things that the Arcams are very good at - detail resolution, soundstage, and tonal reproduction. Others are happy to lose quite a lot of those features and opt for the Cambridge Audio sound - fast, exciting, but not terribly good tonally. This is why I love NAD amps so much. They walk a very well judged line and combine all the best attributes of Arcam with the excitement and punch of Cambridge.

I would completely agree that, in the context of your current system, the CD player is not the weak point. The CD73 is a highly capable, detailed and involving player that, at present, will be getting pedestrianised by the A80. I've auditioned the A80 and liked a great deal of what it did in hi-fi terms but it completely lacked any sense of atmosphere or excitement. I would be inclined to try the CD73 with a Naim Nait 5i or, if you want to spend a bit less, a NAD C352 or C372. All three will provide much greater excitement without losing the hi-fi attributes of the A80. Alternatively look at a second hand Musical Fidelity amp.
[/quote]

I am tempted to go down the nad route myself. i heard a nad system last night hooked up to a set of mon Audio S1's and it sounded superb with dnm reson speaker cable and interconnects.It has plenty of punch and detail but also has a slight richness of tone which made a lot of really poorly produced cd's sound quite listenable. That could be the way for chief brody to go.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
[quote user="Fraziel"][quote user="matthewpiano"]Arcam amps do tend to be very pedestrian sounding. I had an A65+ that absolutely ruined my enjoyment of music for a long time because it sapped the life out of everything. Some people are happy to lose the speed and attack to gain the things that the Arcams are very good at - detail resolution, soundstage, and tonal reproduction. Others are happy to lose quite a lot of those features and opt for the Cambridge Audio sound - fast, exciting, but not terribly good tonally. This is why I love NAD amps so much. They walk a very well judged line and combine all the best attributes of Arcam with the excitement and punch of Cambridge.

I would completely agree that, in the context of your current system, the CD player is not the weak point. The CD73 is a highly capable, detailed and involving player that, at present, will be getting pedestrianised by the A80. I've auditioned the A80 and liked a great deal of what it did in hi-fi terms but it completely lacked any sense of atmosphere or excitement. I would be inclined to try the CD73 with a Naim Nait 5i or, if you want to spend a bit less, a NAD C352 or C372. All three will provide much greater excitement without losing the hi-fi attributes of the A80. Alternatively look at a second hand Musical Fidelity amp.
[/quote]

I am tempted to go down the nad route myself. i heard a nad system last night hooked up to a set of mon Audio S1's and it sounded superb with dnm reson speaker cable and interconnects.It has plenty of punch and detail but also has a slight richness of tone which made a lot of really poorly produced cd's sound quite listenable. That could be the way for chief brody to go.[/quote]

Guys

I do appreciate your input. I have had NAD gear before but feel that i would not really be "upgrading" but just swapping one sound for another. The NAD is about half the price of the A80 and although i have never heard it (C352) i can't imagine it sounds as sonically good as the A80. I appreciate it may add a bit more excitement and attack, but will it lose too much clarity and soundstage etc?
 

matthewpiano

Well-known member
[quote user="chiefbrody"][quote user="Fraziel"][quote user="matthewpiano"]Arcam amps do tend to be very pedestrian sounding. I had an A65+ that absolutely ruined my enjoyment of music for a long time because it sapped the life out of everything. Some people are happy to lose the speed and attack to gain the things that the Arcams are very good at - detail resolution, soundstage, and tonal reproduction. Others are happy to lose quite a lot of those features and opt for the Cambridge Audio sound - fast, exciting, but not terribly good tonally. This is why I love NAD amps so much. They walk a very well judged line and combine all the best attributes of Arcam with the excitement and punch of Cambridge.

I would completely agree that, in the context of your current system, the CD player is not the weak point. The CD73 is a highly capable, detailed and involving player that, at present, will be getting pedestrianised by the A80. I've auditioned the A80 and liked a great deal of what it did in hi-fi terms but it completely lacked any sense of atmosphere or excitement. I would be inclined to try the CD73 with a Naim Nait 5i or, if you want to spend a bit less, a NAD C352 or C372. All three will provide much greater excitement without losing the hi-fi attributes of the A80. Alternatively look at a second hand Musical Fidelity amp.
[/quote]

I am tempted to go down the nad route myself. i heard a nad system last night hooked up to a set of mon Audio S1's and it sounded superb with dnm reson speaker cable and interconnects.It has plenty of punch and detail but also has a slight richness of tone which made a lot of really poorly produced cd's sound quite listenable. That could be the way for chief brody to go.[/quote]

Guys

I do appreciate your input. I have had NAD gear before but feel that i would not really be "upgrading" but just swapping one sound for another. The NAD is about half the price of the A80 and although i have never heard it (C352) i can't imagine it sounds as sonically good as the A80. I appreciate it may add a bit more excitement and attack, but will it lose too much clarity and soundstage etc?[/quote]

I don't think price is really the issue because NAD gear has always punched well above its weight and I think Arcam gear tends to be a little over-priced for what it does. Put it this way, I could have bought an A80 and chose the C325BEE as a superior all-round amplifier. I would have liked a Nait 5i (Which I also auditioned and thought was fabulous) but that was a bit above my budget. What I think you need to do now is audition some of these things within the context of your system Try different amplifiers with your CD player, and vice versa, to see what gives you the best improvement. Then report back to us so that we can all learn from your experience. I'm now contemplating going further up the NAD range and will, equally, share my experiences as and when I audition the kit.
 

JoelSim

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It's down to what rocks your boat. I personally like the Arcam sound, I don't find it pedestrian, and in fact with a few glasses of wine is just perfect. Everyone who has heard my system has been mightily impressed.

If you think a NAD system can hold a candle to an Arcam system then good luck to you.
 

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