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Amp upgrade for Monitor Audio RX6

dakchi

New member
Apr 9, 2011
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Hello,

I currently have a pair of MO RX6 with a Marantz PM6005. I really like the sound from the Marantz but I feel that it is not capable of driving the MO correctly. It is not a surprise since the PM6005 has little power. Would you recommend to keep the PM6005 and pair it with a power amp to have more power, or change the amp to a more powerful one? in the second case, which amp would you recommend? I would like to have a warm and full sound (not on the bright side). Something like the sound of the Marantz. I listen to all kind of music, but more to Jazz. All my music is lossless files stored in a NAS, so I would prefer that the amp has a DAC if possible

Thank you for your help
 

muljao

New member
Jul 18, 2016
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Maybe the marantz pm7005 which is 20w more power and has a USB input might be worth an audition if you like the marantz sound, or the pm8005 if your prepared to shell out for seperate dac
 

dakchi

New member
Apr 9, 2011
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I went through the forum and found out that there aren't a lot of people here who like Marantz Amps. Most people believe that Marantz is inferior to other brands. The Marantz was my first amp. I didn't listen to other amps before buying it, so probably I can have a better sound with other brands. Maybe Cambridge RXA60 (or 80 if the 60 is not powerful enough), or the new NAD368 (I like the fact that it is future proof, but how does it sound?) or the award wining Rega Flex-R combined with a DAC (it will be an expensive option)

Anyway, I am open to any suggestions, as long as I have a warm full-body sound and an amp powerful enough to drive the RX6
 

muljao

New member
Jul 18, 2016
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There are a lot of people who like and dislike a lot of things. That should not put you off if you like the marantz sound. I also like the marantz sound, have had older amps and cd players, but of couse you have other options.

The pm 6005 has no pre-out, which is why I didn't say anything about power amps, also I know very little about them.

Also, the 45 watts that your marantz has is not under powered for most speakers, a 60 watt amp is more poverwful but only by about 10%
 

Frank Harvey

Well-known member
Jun 27, 2008
567
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18,890
For the tonal balance you're after, I'd stick with the Marantz, and I think for any worthwhile difference, I'd look more towards to the 8005 amplifier.
 

kukulec

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2015
40
7
10,545
I heard both the 6005 and 8005. IMHO the diference is not that big as you would expect from the power and price difference. If you can find a nice used 8005 with a low price then it is ok, however as a new amplifier I would buy an Arcam A19 on its discount price or a Cambridge CXA60/80 or Pirmare i21/22. I did not have the possibility to hear a Rega, but is seems they are great too.
 

drummerman

New member
Jan 18, 2008
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dakchi said:
I went through the forum and found out that there aren't a lot of people here who like Marantz Amps. Most people believe that Marantz is inferior to other brands. The Marantz was my first amp. I didn't listen to other amps before buying it, so probably I can have a better sound with other brands. Maybe Cambridge RXA60 (or 80 if the 60 is not powerful enough), or the new NAD368 (I like the fact that it is future proof, but how does it sound?) or the award wining Rega Flex-R combined with a DAC (it will be an expensive option)

Anyway, I am open to any suggestions, as long as I have a warm full-body sound and an amp powerful enough to drive the RX6
I don't think many dislike Marantz. It's just often not the choice higher up. Not sure why. I have a feeling if more would choose a high range Marantz £1500 plus they'd probably would not swap boxes as they would otherwise and waste thousands over the years. That their products are also mostly bomb proof probably helps.

My theory is that Marantz owners rather enjoy their systems/Music than participate on mostly pointless forums. That's why we never hear from them.
 

gasolin

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2013
716
111
19,070
muljao said:
There are a lot of people who like and dislike a lot of things. That should not put you off if you like the marantz sound. I also like the marantz sound, have had older amps and cd players, but of couse you have other options.

The pm 6005 has no pre-out, which is why I didn't say anything about power amps, also I know very little about them.

Also, the 45 watts that your marantz has is not under powered for most speakers, a 60 watt amp is more poverwful but only by about 10%
That should be not 10% but 33% or 1/3 more power
 

gasolin

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2013
716
111
19,070
kukulec said:
I heard both the 6005 and 8005. IMHO the diference is not that big as you would expect from the power and price difference. If you can find a nice used 8005 with a low price then it is ok, however as a new amplifier I would buy an Arcam A19 on its discount price or a Cambridge CXA60/80 or Pirmare i21/22. I did not have the possibility to hear a Rega, but is seems they are great too.
who is talking about power and price diffrence, 45 to 70 watt (8ohm) is only 2db what matters is the sound quality and ability to handle more difficult loads

I do not at all miss power or sound quality, at this point where im at it would make a bigger difference to get better speakers than amp, im happy with the sound my system have

also power wise i would more or less be able to play as loud with my old speaker with a PM6005/6006 as i can do now with my PM8005 and current speakers because of different sensitivity, 90 db and 6 ohm fra RX6 should be more than okay if your room isn't to big
 

dakchi

New member
Apr 9, 2011
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kukulec said:
I heard both the 6005 and 8005. IMHO the diference is not that big as you would expect from the power and price difference. If you can find a nice used 8005 with a low price then it is ok, however as a new amplifier I would buy an Arcam A19 on its discount price or a Cambridge CXA60/80 or Pirmare i21/22. I did not have the possibility to hear a Rega, but is seems they are great too.
I see that you have a Cambridge CXA80. How would you describe the sound out of it compared to the Marantz 6005 and 8005?
 

kukulec

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2015
40
7
10,545
This is the last time I react on you, as you simply lack the good will and the experience with various amps. Read back what dakchi wrote. S/he need something which drives better the speakers and got more power. "also power wise i would more or less be able to play as loud with my old speaker with a PM6005/6006" - do that, and your hearing, the amp and your speaker will get damaged. No, a PM 6005 will not be able to the same in a distortion free way. From my side this is the end of discussion, feel free to spread your "wisdom".
 

dakchi

New member
Apr 9, 2011
18
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0
Guys,

This is just an open discussion. No need to get angry *pleasantry*

The reason why I believe the PM6005 is not enough powerful to drive the RX6 is because I hear some distortion at high volume. At low volume, no problem, the sound is distortion free
 

MUSICRAFT

Well-known member
Hi dakchi

If you're thinking of the Elex-R plus a DAC then if your budget allows at a RRP of £1350 I feel you should also look at Hegel Music Systems H80 amp/DAC. Silver RX6's form an excellent match with the H80. In general we have also found this to be the case with Monitor Audio loudspeakers paired with Hegel amplification.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft
 

muljao

New member
Jul 18, 2016
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gasolin said:
muljao said:
There are a lot of people who like and dislike a lot of things. That should not put you off if you like the marantz sound. I also like the marantz sound, have had older amps and cd players, but of couse you have other options.

The pm 6005 has no pre-out, which is why I didn't say anything about power amps, also I know very little about them.

Also, the 45 watts that your marantz has is not under powered for most speakers, a 60 watt amp is more poverwful but only by about 10%
 

That should be not 10% but 33% or 1/3 more power
No. It's not. Power in watts is not a linear scale
 

drummerman

New member
Jan 18, 2008
540
1
0
muljao said:
gasolin said:
muljao said:
There are a lot of people who like and dislike a lot of things. That should not put you off if you like the marantz sound. I also like the marantz sound, have had older amps and cd players, but of couse you have other options.

The pm 6005 has no pre-out, which is why I didn't say anything about power amps, also I know very little about them.

Also, the 45 watts that your marantz has is not under powered for most speakers, a 60 watt amp is more poverwful but only by about 10%
That should be not 10% but 33% or 1/3 more power
No. It's not. Power in watts is not a linear scale
Power in watts is. Its not if you calculate db from watts.
 

muljao

New member
Jul 18, 2016
154
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0
drummerman said:
muljao said:
gasolin said:
muljao said:
There are a lot of people who like and dislike a lot of things. That should not put you off if you like the marantz sound. I also like the marantz sound, have had older amps and cd players, but of couse you have other options.

The pm 6005 has no pre-out, which is why I didn't say anything about power amps, also I know very little about them.

Also, the 45 watts that your marantz has is not under powered for most speakers, a 60 watt amp is more poverwful but only by about 10%
 

That should be not 10% but 33% or 1/3 more power
No. It's not. Power in watts is not a linear scale
Power in watts is. Its not if you calculate db.
Ok my mistake. Sorry Gasolin.
The result so is only 10% approx
 

gasolin

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2013
716
111
19,070
45 vs 60 watt is 1db where 3 db would have been 100% (90 watt) 1db = 1/3 or 33%

With my old PM6005 amp i could play as loud with Q Acoustics 3020 as i can now with my PM8005 and misison LX-2, just about the same max spl

There is 2 db difference between a PM6006 and a PM8005 that you only noticed when you play as loud as you can (and the difference would be subtle) at normal levels you won't notice the 2 db difference

What you migh notice is better sound quality, the amp being better at difficult loads, that could lead to better sound since the better amp doesn't have to struggle as much to control the speakers as the smaller amp.

If you want to play noticeable louder without distortion i know you have to have atleast 3 times as much power, as fare as i remember from a tread,topic on whathif, i meaning if you have about 2x45 watt and want to get noticeable more power with the same speakers, you need about atleast 130-150 watt or else you might not feel the difference is huge enought, alone the fact that people think 10 db louder is twice as loud makes a difference of 2 db (45 vs 70 watt) seem like almost nothing,not worth talking about

That's why if the diffrence in watt is only 1-2 db you should focus on sound quality and how good the amp can handle more difficult loads
 

itsme

Well-known member
Sep 12, 2015
9
0
4,520
Decibel is logaritmic.

2db difference is a substancial difference.

+ 3dB increase: Example 60dB is twice as loud as 57dB
 

gasolin

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2013
716
111
19,070
itsme said:
Decibel is logaritmic.

2db difference is a substancial difference.

+ 3dB increase: Example 60dB is twice as loud as 57dB
It's a fact that most people perceive and increase of 10 db as twice as loud even when 3db more than, let's say 100watt is 200 watt

https://recording.org/threads/twice-as-loud-6db-or-10db.24495/

It's not about how many db is twich the wattage but when people perceive the sound to be twice as loud, an increase of wattage by 100% is for most people not considered twices as loud when they listen to the difference, technically as mentioned 3 db is twice as loud so a 2 db more powerfull amp won't make a huge difference if you want to play louder than you can with the current am (Marantz PM6005)

However small the diference in power is, there can be a huge difference in sound quality and how good the amp handles difficult loads
 

insider9

Well-known member
Sep 20, 2016
739
298
5,270
May I suggest not to derail this thread any further.

OP, I recently sold my RX2s to a guy who recently purchased Cambridge Audio CXA-60. He planned to buy speakers second hand and when buying a brand new amp demoed it with Silver 2 and 6. He was really impressed with the pairing. Whether it's the pairing you'd enjoy is a different matter but a similar demo would be easy to do.

I'd suggest trying CXA-80 with new Silver 6 and see what you think. These should be easily available.
 

wilro15

New member
Jan 19, 2012
74
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0
My gut tells me that Cambridge Audio plus Monitor Audio equals earache. One mans medicine is another mans poision though.

I would echo what other people have said: keep the speakers and go for a bigger Marantz or something like Hegel.
 

davedotco

New member
Apr 24, 2013
20
0
0
gasolin said:
itsme said:
Decibel is logaritmic.

2db difference is a substancial difference.

+ 3dB increase: Example 60dB is twice as loud as 57dB
It's a fact that most people perceive and increase of 10 db as twice as loud even when 3db more than, let's say 100watt is 200 watt

https://recording.org/threads/twice-as-loud-6db-or-10db.24495/

It's not about how many db is twich the wattage but when people perceive the sound to be twice as loud, an increase of wattage by 100% is for most people not considered twices as loud when they listen to the difference, technically as mentioned 3 db is twice as loud so a 2 db more powerfull amp won't make a huge difference if you want to play louder than you can with the current am (Marantz PM6005)

However small the diference in power is, there can be a huge difference in sound quality and how good the amp handles difficult loads
Power is an objective measurable quantity, as indeed is sound pressure level.

Increasing the power by a factor of 2 will cause a 3dB measured increase in SPL, it is necessary to increase the power by a factor of 10 to raise the measured SPL by 10dB. Simple science.

Where it gets interesting is how the ear/brain interprets those difference. In a lab a normal person will just about detect a 1dB change in SPL as an increase in volume, in a domestic setting, playing music on a hi-fi, you need an increase of 2-3dB in level, to be percieved as a small but clear increase in volume.

That's right, each time you turn up the system a little, enough that you can actually tell that it is louder, you are requiring the amplifier to produce 2 x the power. Do it again and it is now 4 x the original power, as you turn up the volume the power required increases rapidly.

This is why most hi-fi runs on less than 1 watt most of the time, but quickly run out of power if, for one reason or another, you try to drive them harder
 

seemorebtts

Well-known member
Feb 2, 2013
66
0
18,540
kukulec said:
I heard both the 6005 and 8005. IMHO the diference is not that big as you would expect from the power and price difference. If you can find a nice used 8005 with a low price then it is ok, however as a new amplifier I would buy an Arcam A19 on its discount price or a Cambridge CXA60/80 or Pirmare i21/22. I did not have the possibility to hear a Rega, but is seems they are great too.
hi I don't know who you are but I like you.you have great ears :)
 

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